neat build. Since I enjoy living on the edge I dropped a bunch of defense to squeeze out more damage. Added fiend, more oa, Rune of Hagraad, and more life leech on glove. Was able to get around 6 min clear first attempt. https://www.grimtools.com/calc/qNYDnK7Z
Also noticed you have 2 extra points in night’s chill in the OP grim tool link 
Hi there,
how does this build compare to the http://www.grimdawn.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71965?
Also, there are couple of things I dont understand. Could anyone chime in?
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Why pick Guardians Gaze? 4 completely useless nodes that boost poison/chaos damage and proc that doesnt scale with this build either?
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Similar thing with Fiend, this build is centered around cold damage, why pick a constellation that is centered around fire/chaos damage? I would understand if there was a fire/chaos to cold conversion, but like this?
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If we chose to add RoH, wouldnt it be better to go 3 pc Sentinel to boost it as much as possible?
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Also, why use so much Life steal? Is it enough to have solid leech with just the Winter Veil proc, since ABB damage is minimal on lvl 6?
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Elemental balance rings vs. Mythical Reign of Ice and Fire?
thanks guys
Build you linked is a rune build and this isn’t so we can’t compare it directly. Rune should be faster because rune.
1&2. Weapon damage. Flame torrent does 26% weapon damage and since it procs so much you’ll pretty much have 2 instances of it all the time, so 52% WD or half an autoattack that’s basically a passive. Same with guardian’s gaze. It’s a weaker FT but it lasts longer and I believe it can hit one target twice from it’s revolution around you, so each eye will deal around 30% weapon damage and you can have 5 eyes up at a time if I’m not mistaken. Also both procs fit the theme of shit being around your char. It’s the same principle applied to my recent CT build, that just happens to have conversion.
3&5. If you make it a real rune build then ice and fire is better but that’s a different build 
- Same as 1&2. Weapon damage.
Trying to fully understand the mechanic. So lets say Fiend proc has 26% WD, that means it will add additional 26% of the 38-133 damage per weapon (should be around 22 damage on average if I count it right). But if we have lets say 50% phys. to cold conversion, 50% (11 damage) will be converted to cold and this number is multiplied by w/e + cold damage % we have (around 2 200% orso). Also from this number if we have lets say 12% life steal that percentage is converted to life when auto-attacking.
Does it work like this or am I completely wrong on this one? xD
Are those numbers rly sufficient to justify spending 10 devotion point on? (8 nodes are basically totally useless). Wouldnt it be better to rather boost further cold%, get more OA/DA, armor or HP?
Also, you mentioned that the rune build I posted should be faster, but it apparently clears in 11 min orso, whereas Ptiro has 9 min clear time completely without rune and Valinov said he did 6 min run when he added RoH.
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Also, you mentioned that the rune build I posted should be faster, but it apparently clears in 11 min orso, whereas Ptiro has 9 min clear time completely without rune and Valinov said he did 6 min run when he added RoH.
My Runefiltrator record is 5:48 with 4buffs+banner, but anything below 7 minute clear require quite a bit of piloting skill and a fast PC to minimise time loss on wave loading. Anything below 6 minute aslo require specific mutators and creep spawn. You need to put banner near retarded trio spawn point. And you need different kill order.
I had been thinking about something like this for a while. When I get back to modding I was considering making some existing spin proc items into a set that would offer even more spin procs. I am very happy to see someone made this a reality in vanilla.
It looks rly nice, but sadly it uses basically unobtainable medal. Is there a way to make it work without it, say with Mark of Dark Dreams?
Assuming this is your build https://www.grimtools.com/calc/4NOKkJKN
You can switch medal for any green with +2 Haggard preffix.
Thanks. Could you please give me a link to your build? (not the grimtools link, but forum post).
He didn’t post any. This was just shown in a discussion on the reasonably powerful builds thread. It’s buried down there, iirc.
Found it, its around page 98-110 orso. Very interesting discussion indeed about what seems to the current fastest Cruci build. So it seems like that the Crabcakes version is still pretty much alive, except we dont have to stack 3.5 K DA to survive, so we can take Leviathan to be even more offensive. Also it seems dual Crescent is better than Crescent+Beacon nowadays. Whats interesting is that out of all the medals used in different versions of this build (Undying Oath, BoM, Green with +2 RoH), no1 mentioned Mythical Mark of Dark Dreams? It has great bonuses and powerful transmute to VoS, not to mention it can be crafted so another great armor boost (like with the Reign rings).
Mark of dark dreams doesn’t contribute to rune damage aside from global cold mods. Same with undying oath. BoM and +2 rune green does and that’s what’s important when making these superfast builds.
Yep, I understand, but its possible to max out RoH even without the medal if you use the Silver Sentinel setup. Once its maxed, Dark Dreams medal should be BiS, no?
With silver sentinel you loose a lot of CDR and flat cold dmg on rune. Mark of Dark Dreams is never bis - there is no usefull stats on this medal.
No useful stats? Cold damage, frostburn damage, DA, melee dodge chance, +2 Nights chill, more damage and bigger VoS area and crafting bonus are not useful?
Cold damage
3% increase in total dmg you wont notice it cause we kill nemesises in 3-4 runes anyway. In two-3 with a banner.
frostburn damage
useless
DA
Okay, that one is somewhat good .
melee dodge chance
Only work on autoatacks, so useless.
+2 Nights chill
>0.5% increase in total dmg
more damage and bigger VoS area
60 flat dmg per second vs 2mil hits from Rune? Are you serios?
crafting bonus
like what? 4% phyz is the best thing you can craft. and its not a gamechanger.
Well, if you put it like this, it applies to 99% of the items in the game lol. Ofc the bonuses alone are not that powerful, but if you count them all together its a solid boost.
How is frostburn damage useless? I mean obviously the flat cold damage is more important, but doesnt frostburn damage represent huge chunk of overall rune damage with all its bonuses?
If chance to avoid attacks is useless, why even put so many pts into Shadow Dance then?
The flat cold damage bonus to VoS is not 60, its increased by the cold damage % bonus we have, so its over 2000. I agree its not as important, but the biggest advantage of the medal is the +2 meter to VoS, which means there are more mobs affected by it every single time we cast the rune and it applies RR from Nights Chill, which is super powerful.
4% physique or 7% armor is obviously not game changing, but its still very solid bonus.
I mean even Fluff recommended this medal specifically in the old Crabcakes build, Valinov just posted his version that clears in 6 min with this same medal. Just curious, what medal is better according to you in the scenario when RoH is already maxed?
What Ptiro wants to say here is that it’s better to get +rune bonuses on the medal than on pants. After equipping silver sentinel set (gives +5 rune), the only slots where you can get +rune are: relic (+1 inq, +1 rune on conpletion bonus for inq relics), belt (beronath, deception, arcanoweave gives +1 inq), amulet (+1 inq), medal (BoM, +2 greens) and pants(+2 rune, forgot the name of pants).
Assuming you get ignaffar relic that luckily has +1 rune, and then get some +1 inq item, say mageslayer amulet. You’ll have +8 rune and your choices are to get +2 rune medal or +2 rune on pants. It’s better if you get +2 on medal instead because as opposed to medals, pants can (1) cap resists better and (2) have more useful stats like phys res, slow res, whatever secondary res you want, %OA/DA etc.
But what if I have the pants but no medal? (Thus rune is maxed already) Then go ahead and use that mark of dark dreams, but it’s not BiS because it’s just a suboptimal choice you made because you don’t have the best one. In fact, Mark of Dark dreams will probably just have the same effect on your build as any other medal that gives some cold would. I’d probably even cap resists with the medal and get boots with some proc instead.
The original crabcakes build was very different from what you see in his thread now. It was originally a pure frostburn build which is why mark of dark dreams was suggested for nightfall.
Edit:veretragna’sbuild as reference for what a minmaxed sentinel build looks like, though he prefers chillflames instead of crescent moon.
Well, the pants are either Deathwhisper leggings or Mageguard legguards. Theyre both very solid and offer nice bonuses, with Mageguard we have to take a medal with +2 to RoH to hard cap it, with Deathwhisper we are already capped even without medal and ammy (talking about Silver sentinel setup).
How would a BiS medal for this build look like according to you? Assuming its some MI with bizarre rolls that is not realistically obtainable without GDstash, but I am still curious what kind of bonuses are we looking for to beat the ones from Mark of Dark dreams.
Silver sentinel+deathwhisper+dark dreams still looks like best choice to me, unless you are willing to GDstash some bizarre rolled green medal. Or use Runebinder set and +3 BoM to hard cap rune, but the rest of the stats on BoM are kinda meh IMO