[1.1.6.2] Spirits and Totems: DoT-stacking Archon (Vitality) | Zero greens | Strong and beginner-friendly | Viable for all end-game activities!

Player-scaling pets do not get healed, any life steal they deal goes to the player.

*except Wendigo’s Mark

Let me rephrase, Wendigo’s Mark* does not heal the player if attached to a ‘player-scaling-pet’ since it’s ADCTH does not have a WD% component.

Twin Fangs heals the player since it has a WD % component and that’s why I am running Twin Fangs attached to a ‘player-scaling-pet’ but not Wendigo Totem

I was too vague earlier, there are weird exceptions at times @Crate :rofl:

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Wendigo’s Mark, Wendigo’s Totem, ‘Wendy ghosted him’ … I get confused at times :cold_sweat:

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Pure damage with an ADCtH component on a player-scaling pet should still heal the player, which is why Living Shadow’s attacks heal the player as well.

However, Living Shadows has no problem since it cannot be attached to a ‘player-scaling pet’ skill, so the player is always the source and recipient … :sweat_smile:

My point is that attaching Wendigo’s Mark to a payer scaling pet should behave no differently to Living Shadow using one of their skills. Player-scaling pets are extensions of your character, whenever they use a skill, it is treated as if your character used it.

Source here (ignore the last paragraph though, player-pets in general have all since been made immortal).

Just take my Conjurer’s devo map. Wendigo is not just proc, it’s also casting speed and damage.

In theory it’d be great if it worked exactly the same, I’d normally assume Wendigo’s Mark would work the same way but it’s weirdly different in-game

Right. My bad.

Best for him would be Nery’s cabalist map. He doesn’t have anything to bind Wendigo Mark to anyway.

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So manner of fact and conceited?.. :joy: If you link, I’ll check it out. But I’m probably gonna pass as it is now.

Jackal gives 2% more cast speed anyways. Also I already don’t value cast speed much on this character for good reason as we’d have to sacrifice other stats for it and Acid Purge is the only skill to benefit from it and it is not a main focus of the build.

We already have a bunch of small damage procs with ADCTH already - you’re gonna have to think of the trade-offs and not just the benefits of Wendigo :face_with_raised_eyebrow:

Seems you’re right after testing it in-game, my mistake on that. I feel like this should be reported as a bug then - either it needs fixing so binding Wendigo’s Mark to a player pet correctly heals the player or several bind options for player pets on it need re-evaluating.

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I checked out your devotion map with my build, here’s a list of trade-offs:

Cons (in order of personal importance):

  • Less damage resists (average less overcap by 10%: differences from 15% vs 30%, 20% vs 30%, and 30% vs 40% for the most common damage types)
  • Less OA (2733 vs 2860 - 4.7% more)
  • No emergency heal
  • No Nullification skill
  • Less CC resistance (average 10%)
  • Less Crit Damage

Pros (in order of personal importance):

  • More movement speed (135% vs 129%)
  • More DA (3126 vs 3021 - 3.5% more)
  • More Damage Bonus (2170% unbuffed vs 2030% unbuffed)
  • Extra damage proc
  • More Cast Speed (140% vs 130%)

Honestly @mad_lee mad_lee, we should stick to my devotion map for a beginner friendly and tanky version*

Re: in the hands of someone wanting to maximize damage (not sure if it’s actually higher since OA/Crit matter), say for something like Crucible, yours might be more desirable

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Guardian’s Gaze is really sweet, good recommendation. I’m gonna see if i can run a different variant/build with it!

One reason I wouldn’t use it for this build as is, is that I’d really want the green Necro skill belt -> which is not the most desirable belt for the rest of the build and removes my ‘0 greens’ or ‘easier to farm’ aspect

^ I just realized i already have like 75% Chaos to Vitality conversion :sweat_smile: , my bad YA

how do you activate it? Can you activate Wendigo instead with the same skill?

You should take Vire’s Might in any case, mate, second teleport is a boost both to damage and survivability. With Volcanic Stride it’s a great devotion proccer.

And Wendigo is more beginner’s friendly because it has physical resist, damage reduction from Beasts and humongous leech.

Just trust me on this map, mate, it’s a best blend of offense and defense for Vitality builds.

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Is Cleansing Water even useful?

In my experience with it, the proc was terribly underwhelming.

It is underwhelming 90% of the time IMO (but also I don’t play Arcanist very much so I don’t know most of the ‘buff cleansing’ use cases) - it’s mostly there because Ulo is necessary for the amount of resist overcap I want, but the 100% proc is occaisionally useful (when you are hit with a DoT, or if you know if specific bosses have buffs - though the latter is beyond the beginner use case)

Ulo (Cleansing Water) is there mostly for the resist overcap in combo with affinity reqs. and it’s active/proc is only there as a backup - whereas I would take Wendigo only if I was explicity going to use the proc.

I could bind it to the same skill/instead of Ulo, but if I wanted to bind them both it would increase the number of active buttons -> less beginner friendly.

Vire’s Might is good :+1: and we can take it whether we bind something to it or not, stuff like is totally customizable but not included in the core of the build because its flexible (I run it myself but didn’t include in this more beginner-friendly version)

It’s not more beginner friendly IMO because I would also lose an passive emergency heal (much more likely to help a beginner), more overall resists by not going Wendigo and it doesn’t need an active button to make use of it (much easier to pilot).

90% of the time we’re not gonna be missing the ADCTH from Wendigo’s Mark since our one of our 2 main skills (Wendigo Totem) will be healing us for 4.5k HP per tick each: 1.2 * (11% + 1350) HP for enemies that matter - the other sources of regen/ADCTH are just there for offsetting Dying God + Blood Orb as we move in between packs and don’t wanna set down a Wendigo Totem.

Because we already have so much regular healing and sustain -> I don’t value additional medium bits as much, the only reason I got Giant’s Blood is insurance for those ‘one-shot’ moments (which in practice, are not 1 gigantic hit but many big hits being shotgunned at once).

Ulo being bound is just icing on the cake, if you only use that skill 1 in 40 times or don’t even bind it that’s fine, whereas if you have Wendigo’s Mark bound it’s intended to spammed.

It’s good but I’m not gonna blindly trust you, if that happened people would stop taking a look for themselves and there’d be no actual discussion of trade-offs. And build discussion and builds, in general, would be worse off in that way.

Also in this specific build, no offense to you, I genuinely think mine is better suited.

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Well, from my experience of making Vitality builds Wendigo devotion is just too good to pass up after some buffs few patches ago. It’s just so much value that it’s not optimal, imo, not to take it, unless you are doing DG + Rattosh + Aeon devotion map.

Thing with healing devotions like Giant is that their effect is diluted and almost lost on super leechers like Dark One Shamans.

But again, you are right, it’s your build, you do things the way you see, totally your decision to take someone’s advice or not.

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Hmm… having recently tried the Dark One Set and the glory of Wendy go Toturu, I am curious.

With Ziller’s current setup vs MadLee’s proposed one, what will be the difference in practice?

Not talking about numbers, but like “will it be easier to do Cruci with one setup while the other might favour SR/Superbosses etc”.

And if being easy to play even at the cost of sheer power is a consideration, would anything change?

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Agreed on on the dilution!

Personally for a less beginner friendly version of this build I’d forgo Giant’s Blood but keep Ulo and then use the 3 freed up points to reach the 3% OA in Raven for 'the crits babyyy'

I’d say my build is more a safe SR build.

Hmm if I didn’t account for ease-of-piloting then I’d probably get rid of Giant’s Blood and go for more damage (e.g. 3 points into Raven or perhaps something with more cast speed by swapping from Lotus to Okalaine’s Lantern and making a focus to use Acid Purge more in between CDs)

e.g. something like this:
https://www.grimtools.com/calc/bVA9oa7V

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