Alternatives to adcth meta

you understand I only play hardcore and the character hasn’t died right? And I do have Ghoul plus 15% damage absorption and 24% physical resists before ghoul’s proc. I also have 10% life steal before ghouls proc
I could use more DA as its just under 3k with BWC OA shred

And I am not saying your character is bad. I am saying it will be risky to play it versus end-game content and health regeneration won’t help.

I have tested my fair share of non-inquisitor casters and with the exception of Sorcerers it’s really really hard to make them into consistent endgame farmers.

EDIT: Moreover I think if you change hp regen components in rings to Bloodied Crystals your overall survivability will improve quite a bit.

I have more issues with energy then I do survivability, so If I changed them they would be for Mark of Illusions so I can stop using Royal Jelly Extract’s :slight_smile:

  1. Yes, I realize that. It’s why I put those points in Mog’s line.

  2. Or you could keep the totem and put all the points and the gear and the devotion choices invested in health regen to a better use. And it’s LOTS more saved investment than points in the totem. Timeflux ring is especially calling out for you with that slowres. Or the Coven blue ring for oa/da. And you could use a proper relic with defensive holes fixed elsewhere. Etc.

Health regen is obsolete if you don’t kite most of the time. And extremely pricey. It’s just TOO LOW for the effort. You love it but it doesn’t love you back.

It’s a great health regen build and a one-in-a-million original pyro. But health regen is meh. I still think that even after perusing the recent changelog but I’m curious if I’m wrong and how health regen buffs work in practice.

You should visit two Reapers on wave 160 then, I’ve heard that they help hardcore characters with energy issues :slight_smile:

Health regen is a little better now that it was (buff was approx. 75% increase or so). I am super thrilled it is on Crate’s radar for buffs but much more is needed for it to be a modest alternative to life steal.

A build might be able to hit 4k regen 35% of the time but that requires well rolled MI, armor augments, weapon augment, x2 corpse dust, significant devotion investment and spending extra skill point to max health regen skill. The opportunity cost of all this is other important stats get neglected and dps suffers (also form of defence). adcth requires a lot less investment for the sustain it yields (which has much greater potential).

Additionally for casters the phys res on ghoul is very important. Not having some kind of equivalent defence on behemoth also makes it weak to damage spikes (which casters experience plenty of). To create competitive alternative to adcth, regen needs to be more than a niche kiting or tank only option.

Tested 4k regen Druid in crucible. Once debuffs are on, regen stop completely. :eek:

I’ve encountered this problem a lot aswell. Regen feels (almost) as good as lifesteal now, except for when you are debuffed. Then it’s just down the gutter and as bas as previously.

Gesendet von meinem Moto G (4) mit Tapatalk

-% health regeneration debuffs can be stupidly potent. E.g Fleshweaver Haraxis has a -500% health regen debuff. Additionally in settings like Shattered Realm and Crucible I guess you can get multiple health regen debuffs stacking together (assuming -% mechanic stacks for regen like rr does).

4k regen on a druid though. Guessing that took a lot of investment to hit even with shaman buffs.

On the subject of devotions for health regeneration, do players feel that 15-25% chance of activation on hit is reliable? By that I mean: does it end up triggering on cooldown without issue? Are there cases where it triggers against something trivial and isn’t available when needed? I was wondering whether something like “100% chance at 75% health” might end up working better, even if it would mean losing the CDR from Hourglass. An advantage of lifesteal is that it’s easier to control, although nominally more dangerous.

Back when I played a Behemoth + Tree build at the start of AoM, I felt that on-hit devotions were fickle things, although that might just have been inexperience; besides, the devotion icons in the status bar have been updated since then, which should make it easier to track what has triggered and what hasn’t.

Idk about Behemoth,on Blast shield is almost certain proc and is working well with kiting style.

Since it seems like the initial heal of behemoth is here to stay the best way for it to be taken advantage of is by attaching it to skills like blast shield where it has 90% to activate during the buff. It is usually quite safe to take hits on a maxed blast shield so it works nicely. Resilience, blade barrier, ascension, overguard etc. Any abilities which the player activates can give control over when it procs to get the most from it.

Keeping track of the cooldown can be a bit of a nuisance but you get used to it.

I tried that, but Giant’s Blood has 29% chance of activation on Arcane Will, if I recall. Not exactly ideal on a character with low health and armor.

Mirror of Ereoctes should be better. Arcane will is not great for it

Games like poe went for leech over time with a % of max life per second cap on life leech, thereby forcing meta to adjust to methods where you can’t just heal to full almost instantly.

Anyone that knows their ARPG’s, knows what happens when you have instant leech that can get that high. It will outshine the other types with great ease if left in that broken state.

Is it really worth nerfing it? Good question, it’s kinda satisfying to play with it and sometimes it can just be fun to be able to do what you want and not get everything nerfed. As long as you can keep upscale SR however, and as long as SR effective farming isn’t safe enough without it, it’s gonna be number 1 though.

Introducing a leech cap would definitely be controversial given it’s role in keeping certain lower armoured builds alive. I guess people would rather see regen more competitive alternative instead. Nerfing adcth with a cap would mean defence across builds needs to be balanced.

We have already seen regen starting to be taken up by more builds since the regen buff patch. It is still underpowered relative to adcth and still niche overall, but on non-WD casters that never could leech as much regen is appearing.

well ghoul balance/change is super risky move to make upcoming patch.

there are 1billion parameters and builds, ideas and such to think about and result of combinations are even beyond my gd capacity/knowledge id say that.

i accept that ghoul is so cheap and powerfull now, and might need some adjustments… i am wording as ‘adjustments’ cause nerf is not way to go.

it would be healtier to leave ghoul for another patch, imho.

probably just leave ghoul as it is, and buff other means for healing such as regen and periodic heals so that they can compete with adcth.