[Feedback] Blade Spirit damage seems ... a bit underwhelming

so, I’ve been testing this build lately, and thought that maybe after 4th BS addition, it will become a bit better. it actually didn’t. but I won’t talk about the build in general, only it’s BS part. and it’s literally bs.

I did some tests: couple of dummy resets - in this case I had AM bound to BS and was standing near so VoS rr would be applied to dummy. no flat rr but wcyd.

I also tested dummies in Fort Ikon and Devil’s Crossing and got the same 30 sec disparity for w/e reason. anyway, no matter how you look at it, a skill that takes 1,5 to 2 mins to reset a dummy once - and, lemme remind you, this is the ultimate NB’s skill with 26/16, fully converted and with almost double the pierce flat - this means the skill is … not really good.

also did a test SR run where was trying to attack enemies with BS and see their damage (spoiler - it was also miserable).

the damage tooltip:

so, for now - at least for pierce - BS still suck. I’ll say again, for the ultimate NB’s skill, hard-capped, fully converted and having a ton of additional flat, such damage is just ridiculous.

so, did anyone have any experience with BS lately? maybe cold ones are good? ar any other damage type? what do you think they need? please share your thought here.

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How does it compare to guardians of Empyrion and Wind Devils?

I dunno, I don’t have any builds made around them but will assume that WDs are ok and Empy Boiz are underwhelming too. maybe @mad_lee or @banana_peel will shed some extra light.

I have not played in Public test but i got 2 characters on normal using thouse blades… and its just like wind devils they feel bit weak skills to invest too much into them, they also feel very slow, always behind you, reach mobs when you already got them half hp, half the times… at least guardians of emp. feel a bit faster, cant say much about theyre dps cause i never invested many points in it…

I had a dervish with 4 spirits and 5 guardians and I found it underwhelming. It used a few fantasy greens as well. Tried it a bit in the playtest build but other than gaining a spirit it didn’t improve. My experience with builds like these is that they’re fairly fragile too. Overall I wouldn’t recommend it unless you’re into weird builds.

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i kinda feel the same, i normaly only use winds or blades if i want them to proc other devotion skill when they crit / hit but i normaly just put 1 point into them… but again i not in play test. Im talking about normal game :slight_smile:

Tested this:

Overall damage is pretty good, especially given that the build is kinda meme in nature. But it’s hard to say how much Spirits are really doing here, because build high damage %, double rare and a lot of procs plus a great proccer - Inquisitor Seal with almost no cd - for freshly buffed builds of wrath.

And tested this:

Definitely feels much more impactful on Bleeding due to synergy with the shield and due to how dot stacking on pseudo-pets work.

All in all I think direct part of Blade Spirits is mostly whatever damage and dot part is really good.

Can anyone confirm how Blade spirits proc devotions?

In my experience, the spirits do contact damage but this does NOT proc devotions. Only the burst attack of blades does. That attack happens every 2-4 seconds which sucks for devotions.

Compared to wind devils which does contact damage AND procs devotions every second. Not to mention the RR. Blade spirits suck in comparison.

I have to disagree. I tested Blade Spirits devo proccing vs single target a few times and it was always like Inquisitor Seal (1 tick / s) so for example 2 Blade Spirits were better than 1 Seal and worse than 3 Seals etc.

I remember Gnuffi saying their additional attacks proc devos as well but it was not enough to clearly see in this single target scenario.

I tried 3 spirits with a dummy and I couldn’t get a devotion to proc with contact damage. The dummy was actively taking damage for 30 seconds and nothing.
You can test by using pet attack to move the spirits “near” the dummy to damage it.

No offense but the burden of proof is on you not me because you’re telling sth contrary to common knowledge (also I cannot test it atm due to some irl stuff). Maybe you had too little OA to proc on Crit devo or maybe there’s a bug in Public Test (but I doubt it).

“near” is not “attacking”
dummies are neutral, ie pets wont attack without a command; you need to actually click the dummy once on a pet command
same goes for any pet with an aura, mines, inquish seal, guardians etc; they wont commence their actual attack without an order
devils are different now, after 9.8? or 1.2 they got “ai”/controller changed, so they are basically always “hunting” and attacking, which means they auto attack the dummy (they didn’t use to) - funnily enough it also means they will randomly disengage the dummy and roam/go look for a target elsewhere sometimes after a little while :smile:

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Oh okay, this makes more sense. Maybe blade spirits should get the AI updated too :smiley:

considering this is only a thing for dummy attacks and otherwise make them derp around, probably not necessary

watched the vid, Blade Spirits are often lagging behind while most trash dies from WoP/other casts while BS are still somewhere behind. this may be cool for bleed but for direct damage seems pretty bad.

Hold on a sec, a few patches ago Zantai wanted to reduce BS summon limit back to 2 - meaning they were somehow OP? Now he actually added 1 more summon but now they suck? What the hell is even going on here? Genuinely curious.

for me they a bit hard skill to judge just by dps alone yeh… what i mean is… even if they low dps skills, they almost free dps… meaning you can bassically walk arround doing nothing while they do damage… so in a way i dont think they should b that op anyways :slight_smile: but yes they are way too slow… dont they get bonus speed from player too or should tho !?

I genuinely don’t remember that, might be a very old conversation.

maybe they sucked all the way, no one actually tested their real power. once they were very good in buffed cr, then got nerfed, then builders switched into running SR, and BS don’t feel good. but, as I said, maybe they never were that good.

it’s the ultimate NB’s skill, it has a couple of dedicated sets even. (and on top of that, has pretty decent support). and you kinda suppose it to be good. not like you can stay afk and watch how they win the game for you, but not chopping like 1% of Nemesis health per second.

Yep, that’s what I figured back then as well. Was playing Demonslayer with 4 spirits and who would’ve guessed that most of the heavy lifting was done by Phantasmal Blades.

Also was playing dual Noctirn pierce Shadow Strike Infil with BS maxed (and full conversion, of course) - wasn’t all that impressed either. But since he wanted to nerf them so badly, figured I’m just missing something. Most likely this was discussed in another playtest somewhere in 2022 maybe, so it’s now long gone. But yes he wanted to revert the limit back to 2 spirits. So I have literally no idea wtf is going on with this skill XD

yeh i do still agree that the damage on the videos seems a bit small even for a skill like this… but i also cant comment much… I havent played nightblade in end content in a long time! tho my biggest complain is theyre slacking behind anyways…