[Feedback] Demolitionist mastery

The worst mastery in GD right now. This mastery doesn’t provide anything we’d want in our builds. Demolitionist is a skill points draining mastery, that in the end is VERY MEDIOCRE and some of its skills are just bad.

Flame Touched line: rather the most useful skill in Demolitionist. Provides massive damage, defense, OA - something we don’t really see that much in other skills. This skill doesn’t really need love, because it is good enough to pay for it.

Fire Strike line: a very good, strong, maybe superior skill that does massive damage and has huge clearing power for ranged characters. However, the skill points it requires is enormous for just an auto attack replacer that only increases your damage a little bit. The least this skill needs is Brimstone working the same way for both, ranged and melee weapons. Searing Strike, transmuter for one handed weapons is not even good, just look at what it grants, 1/3 reduced energy cost for only itself, 5% damage increase and 10% crit damage. Nothing special, rather useless to waste 3 points on it if you don’t have spare points.

Stun Jacks line: rather farming skill, used to level up. More item support (casters) would fix many issues with this skill.

Flashbang line: this skill just feels useless as fuck. Basically, taking in account we’d only rather use it on bosses+, it only grants 250 reduced DA. Fumble and Impaired aim is way too RNG to be even considered at this point, if we play a caster, it’s literally useless.

Vindictive Flame line: if this skill gained some defense stats, people would actually want to waste more points on it. It’s one of these skills that provides mobility and damage, passively, but there’s never a good reason to add more than 1 point to Ulzuin’s Wrath. Basically, put 11/1 skill points at max to that skill, more than that is basically a waste of points. This skill looks like it was made for retaliation builds, but it doesn’t do ANYTHING for them.

Blast Shield: another good passive, BUT the cool down/duration should get some love.

Blackwater Cocktail line: another skill that could be used for many caster builds, however, this skills is not even good to be used that way. Demon Fire is literally useless for fire builds, Agonizing Flames gets outscaled by Elemental Storm devotion. Even at max rank (22/12) it gives only 30 RR. Yes, it is all resists and ES is elemental only, but that doesn’t mean we can’t go 32(12/12) to 42 (22/12) in the RR part. Heck, if you don’t want to make it too good for other builds, add -1% fire resist per level and make a debuff of it. Right now there’s no reason for the existence of Demon Fire and Agonizing Flames.

Canister Bomb line: this skill already got some love.

Grenado line: already got some love.

Mortar Trap line: people used to hate on it. Make it permanent, like Blade Spirit and most problems will be solved. This skill would be very interesting for proccing stuff (devotion) and for casters in general, where they sometimes have too many buttons to press.

Ulzuin’s Chosen: by far, my favorite Demolitionist skill. The issue is there’s no reason to pick it. It does only give some utility, but it’s a level 50 skill, why does it only give 12% increased damage (for traps) and 30% chance for -100% cooldown? The energy cost is not a big factor at all. If it granted % chance for energy cost refund, and cool down refund, the skill would be very attractive for Barrelsmith or a trap Purifier (if someone would think of a sexy build, or a new set would arrive).

Thermite Mines line: increase the RR to -100% and it’ll still be shit. There are too many threads about this one skill, everyone just thinks this skill mechanic sucks.
What was already requested:[ul]
[li]Increased radius[/li]
[li]Moving mines[/li]
[li]Redesign the mines to be something different[/li]
[li]I believe someone even requested something like “wall” explosions or that the fire instead of pointing up, points on the enemy in order to actually hit the target.[/li]
[/ul]

Please, do something about this mastery. It even hurts to pick it for anything. The main reasons people pick it is because of OA, Blast Shield, Fire Strike. There’s literally no other reason to even think about this mastery, even cold Grenado is shit at this point, it doesn’t matter how much damage you deal when you pick one mastery for one skill only.

Join the conversation, let’s make a huge thread about this mastery in order to push it on a better road.

Some fascinating opinions in here, but in any case, hold your panties 'til v1.1.0.0.

There’s too much going on in my pants right now. Demolitionist takes most of the room there, I’ve tried like 12 (or 13?) Demolitionist builds in the last couple of days, all were cancelled because they had Demolitionist there.

Btw, did you actually read it all in just 2 minutes?

The parts I needed to, yes.

Wierd. For me demo and occultist are my favorite masteries. Some comments from me:
Grenado and Canister bomb - you said that these 2 skills are ok in Demo kit - I think completely otherwise. Beside some ulzuins chosen grenado+canister+stunjacks spam build they have 0 usefulness.
Blinding flash is amazing skill, better in boosting crits than flame touched.
Overall it’s very fine-tuned class mastery. My remarks would be:

  • Usability of mines and cocktail -they are very good in terms of power, the animation and clunkiness do not help.
  • Brimstone is unused in melee, but im not sure if it wouldn’t be outright OP if it worked in melee the same way :slight_smile:

Brimstone does not have AoE projectiles in melee, but the flat damage is still added to your hits even so. Being as much flat damage as it is, it’s quite powerful for melee.

I never said they’re okay. I only said they already got some love, I’ve never stated they’re okay or anything similar. What I meant was they got enough love as for now, they might be useful on some builds, with certain items, but they’re not good in general.

Op alert

Searing Strike, transmuter for one handed weapons is not even good, just look at what it grants, 1/3 reduced energy cost for only itself, 5% damage increase and 10% crit damage. Nothing special, rather useless to waste 3 points on it if you don’t have spare points.

1.7 total dmg and 3.3 crit for one point is a waste?

Stun Jacks line: rather farming skill, used to level up. More item support (casters) would fix many issues with this skill.

There’s only ONE issue with jacks. Solvable by tripling the dmg.

Flashbang line: this skill just feels useless as fuck. Basically, taking in account we’d only rather use it on bosses+, it only grants 250 reduced DA. Fumble and Impaired aim is way too RNG to be even considered at this point, if we play a caster, it’s literally useless.

Flashbang is good. Perfect skill if it wasn’t for that confuse and having to chase down strays.

Blast Shield: another good passive, BUT the cool down/duration should get some love.

Blast Shield got a buff already. Anything beyond that might be op.

Right now there’s no reason for the existence of Demon Fire and Agonizing Flames.

Chaos builds that don’t want Manticore, maybe?

Mortar Trap line: people used to hate on it. Make it permanent, like Blade Spirit and most problems will be solved. This skill would be very interesting for proccing stuff (devotion) and for casters in general, where they sometimes have too many buttons to press.

Mortars’ problem is the same as the rest of them: clunky mechanics. And not enough conversion. Not much to do with uptime in my experience. (This is also why Dagalon set is what it is. Whoever needs better uptime on mortars? BTW pls fix Dagalon. Mortars only work with the head and a mix of other purples and a green, afaik. No reason to ever use full Dagalon. No one ever got any points left after maxing Firestrike and Inquisitor ranged stuff. EDIT: except the RoH hybrid but that’s RoH - worth the struggle)

Ulzuin’s Chosen: by far, my favorite Demolitionist skill. The issue is there’s no reason to pick it.

I don’t get it… No reason to pick it? There’s no reason to play the clunkfest it suppports but once you do there’s no reason NOT to pick it.

Join the conversation, let’s make a huge thread about this mastery in order to push it on a better road.

I generally agree with the thought. But I’m quite sure Demo’s gonna get some good gear in FG.

This man seriously said Flashbang ONLY grants 250 DA. Yeah, one of the biggest sources of DA reduction, definitely needs more.:rolleyes:

I just don’t like it at all, never pick it too, lol. I picked it once, then felt like I wasted points. This is the reason.

I guess it was “only grants 250 da” as in “grants da and does nothing else” not “grants only 250.” Still… fumble is a useful layer of defense. As much as I wanna see buffs to demo I must admit flashbang is pretty good.

I know mastery has problems, but guys, really, it looks like a some hype around Demolitionist… Everything isn’t so bad, as you describe…

I don’t understand how anyone can think that aoe fumble is a bad thing. Flashbang is great.

CB would be more usable if the CD is reduced to 3 seconds. It remind me of Grenade in TQ, another skill that not so bad bmg-wise, but absurd CD kill any initiative to use it.
Grenade suck due to collision and clunkiness. I don’t want to compare it with runes , its kinda sad. So sad.
But the root of grenadier problem is awful itemization. What do we have? A rifle with mana pita. A pair of guns with mana PITA. Cindercore belt that suck compared to , say, Cord of violent decay. A pair of gloves that suck compared to other options. Pants suck. Shoulders suck. No chest. >_>
Where is caster-like stuff for explosive`s?

Some things that do annoy me:

Physical damage that you can’t convert in stun jacks, mortars. What’s the point?

Like others have said, general clunkiness of many skills. Mines are by far the worst of course, but the grenades aren’t great either. I’ve built two versions of the barrelsmith build before and after the change to lightning, I now sort of hate grenado, it’s odd.

The fact that you have to put 50 points in the mastery in every build that uses fire strike. Compare to savagery, just 32. Cadence, 40, but the middle node is usually a one pointer. This is part of why literally every purifier build runs out of points.

https://www.grimtools.com/db/items/8129

I’ll just leave it in here.

Not everything. Fire Strike builds are good. But that’s it. Demolitionist is what it is. 60% demo skills could as well be deleted. Just removed from the mastery with nothing to replace them. And it wouldn’t affect the game in the least. At least not for top 100 builds itg. What pisses me off a little bit (because I do like demo, I wouldn’t be writing this if I didn’t) is this:

There are sets and items that turned meta upside down in 7.1 (Makakors, Deathmarked, Venomblade, N&O, new Iskandra relic, new Nidalla relic, etc). But barely smithed did nothing. Despite the fact that this set was accompanied by the biggest mastery rework in this patch (maybe except Star Pact), it changed nothing. Lighting or not, demo clunks are still as unviable as they were before.

I wasted a good couple days figuring that out. In a final act of desperation I even tried electrocute with double Salvos, lol.

That doesn’t do anything for demo. Using this instead of LD helmet with Stun Jacks?

People complained a lot about mines prior to 1.0.7.0, and yet that patch did nothing to mines. And just now Z mentioned a 1.1.0.0, which by Crate’s semantic versioning standards is gonna be huuge. That’s a strong indicator that Crate has been reworking or at least planning to rework mines for some time now, as opposed to just giving it some token buff like +1 m radius or something.

no, but it just happens to give full physical to lightning conversion
to forcewave soldiers

What does Soldier have to do with Demolitionist?