An old conversation, hmm.
I presume the the intend at first was making SR a more challenging place. People solved the problem with camera/aggro abuse, then it became easier. So since the intention was missconsidered at the beginning(imo), there is still room for a change. If they can fix the Camera Abuse, make the rooms bigger and adjust the scaling per shards then SR challenge can be balanced. Otherwise ofc no one wants to change things. Abusing make their build look better. How many builds can face 3 Nemesis 1 Boss at the same time in SR 85-90? Maybe retal builds? A few casters with constant kiting and hit&run? What about melees? Static casters or rangeds? They’ll certainly perish. Maybe they can kill one to the cost of death with everything they have, respawn do it again etc. It’s meaningless and not even a challenge. So If devs make a poll with a two choice; an adjusted SR without camera abuse and things as they are. I think that most veteran players choose the first option. But the solution must come from them since we can ask things as much as we want it’s their decision. I play without camera abuse, but I also carefully move if no one jumped at me right after entering the room, so I maybe pull one or 2 without alerting the more dangerous ones. Thankfully some monsters are so slow that I can kill one till the other comes but in small room that’s not always possible. And there are people proudly screams I did SR 90 without any abuse, yeah some builds can do that but then where is the diversity? So the intention at the beginning makes SR for certain builds/class-combos/playstyles apparently(without any abuse). I get it; to kill Crate or Calla you need certain things but SR is a different concept and should be available to all types of build without any abuse up to a point. Sure there will be higher/different performances depending on the builds, classes, piloting, reflexes etc. If devs planning to say these ‘‘now that’s good enough for a game.’’ for GD and moving on another game; this issue should be solved so everyone can measure performances more accurate. And only then there won’t be any SR build, CR build or noob SR players, Elite CR players distinction. After all that we can peacefully play the end-game, compare the builds, talk about creativity etc.
Edit: And I believe devs don’t want to change it because they think it’s what people want or need. I think people don’t want to cheat the game, they want to feel success(because reality is sucks). So making a death trap challenge ofc force them to bend things.
What people actually need is an adjusted SR. Will it be easier? Yeah. Then we will praise the SR 120 builds not 90 ones(just an example). It shouldn’t be that hard to do so. Diminishing the loot and making it available till 92(example). With adjusted power scaling and bigger rooms; people can develop tactics with min-maxed builds and their skills. If their build(followed or own making) atleast reach some points then they’ll feel success. Better builds and players will reach higher shards inevitably and we will praise them as they deserve. Because then their success won’t be dependant to an abuse.
One of the things I highlighted with that post is that for over a year, they’ve openly said they can easily fix aggro abuse if the player base asks for it, just like they did with the aggro problems in Crucible. Would it cause issues? Probably, they’d either have to make further changes somewhere (SR’s scaling, the size of arenas, editting arenas etc.) or the community throws SR 75-76 out the window and finds a new standard that the majority of builds can complete and a new range of shards that become the domain for deep shard divers.
To answer banana’s question of why they have not fixed it yet despite them saying several times on here, on twitch streams, over the community discord and probably in other places that they can - players in the community apparently like aggro abuse so it has stayed. If there is a big enough outcry for it to change now, it will do.
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That’s what I’m talking about. And I know your purpose, but reading those made me wanna share my opinion. And this is better than leaving things as it right now imo.
Make SR great again! LoL I forgot I wasn’t playing before FG 
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There is no need to measure performance but some people just can’t live without it. They want to show they are the best and tell it to everyone everywhere.
That is really naive.
There is no cheating in an offline singleplayer game.
I vote against. Now everybody can get what they want. Change it and some then can’t get what they want.
@Stupid_Dragon @grey-maybe
I’d like to submit Bonemonger Aether Oblivion Apostate. CR 5.55 and SR 85 videos attached. Could be made tankier with Ghoul / Hourglass combo I guess but then the build would lose Cruci time which, while not the best, still matters to me. Nothing too creative but with
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Scion’s of the Screaming Veil and innate Bonemonger’s Vititality -> Aether conversion
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existence of 50% Chaos -> Aether rings
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Scion’s high Weapon Damage
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ability to max out casting speed
the build is a natural and deserves to be given a chance.
Everyone needs his own Bonemonger build to feel complete and I’m no exception.
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You know what takes forever? Going through over 200 entries one by one, or it would have been 200 if some weren’t placeholder due to lack of data or players not sharing builds (Lazy players!).
Until the blanks are filled in though, we’ve done our part for v1.1.9.0. 
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i wanted to write a changelog, but i was busy all day.
will write it now in the very first post.
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Changelog created (first comment that was reserved by me). Will add your apostate tomorrow.
(and i’m going to answer everything tomorrow, it’s 2am and i have to wake up at 8.30)
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Don’t you want warlord having best score?
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yes, pretty much that)
and also i’m not the biggest fan of retal
(it will most likely go away, added that for lulz)
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Thank God, I have 3 cool retaliations for my big update thread 
I am tired as hell with it already but I am completionist 
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Lmao. Warlord is probably the most boring of the retal builds so you don’t really have to complete it
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In the below thread earlier this year, you mentioned the near impossibility of facing full-health Nemeses + Boss battles (certain ones like Salthazarr or the Magi twins are much harder than a Nemesis like Valdaran or Moose) while having 2 more Mutators and no Crucible blessings. I take it the reason it was never touched was that nobody gave it serious thought as to how to make removing the 1 v 1 pulling beneficial.
Would it be waves of bosses and then Nemeses?
Would you get those SR soul chunks carried to the boss room?
Would you get to choose one of those SR blessings that no one really touches and remove the component cost?
No one really talks about what the future of SR should really look like, so it ends up not being touched. Fine with me, as my builds are much more consistent getting loot from SR than in Crucible.
Also,
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Adding my 5 cents about SR:
SR below 81 is WAY to random, especially when it comes to bossrooms.
having Korvaak, MQ and Gargabol on the one hand, and at the same time Laria, Derps heroes and GF bugs - that’s just too big of a gape in difficulty.
Not to mention encounters, when you have FG bird +2 statues and 3 Rahn’s Guardians (or how’re they called?). Instead of 4 bosses you have 8 of them.
So, one of the reason i prefer sr90 over sr75-76 is that the former one is somewhat a better testing environment, whereas the lattest is just stupidly random.
i forgot they even exist.
Yes, SR 80 is way more difficult than SR 81.
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Hi! Thank you very much for this analysis. As a new player (I only started playing a few months ago) who is also interested in getting into the endgame, this is a very valuable resource. I have a few questions though regarding some of the discussion in this thread.
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From what I have gathered, camera/aggro abuse has some controversy around it. Can I confirm that in your current ranking system, this is allowed for clears above 85?
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Are health potions / buff potions / clusters allowed in your ranking system? I really hated the PoE style of potions wherein you have to click all 5 potions after every mob clear to keep up the really short duration buffs. It was refreshing to see potions with a much longer cooldown in Grim Dawn. But apparently the Grim Dawn community considers them as cheese? Why would they be frowned upon when every build can make use of them?
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Is there a death limit on SR clears for your rankings?
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I recently cleared SR90 with a vitality cabalist (Ravenous earth dark one) which I noticed isn’t on your rankings. Would a video evidence be enough for my entry to be counted?
Thank you!
One-shotting enemies is not so boring for me, altough several dozen hours on week with it may be pretty terryfying experience 
A lot of players seems enjoy this class too.
Only doing autoattacks on a ~160ish AS build looks boring the other retals at least play as casters. And with witchblade you can cook dinner wh8le waiting for cof/fevered rage to end
yes, I’m very biased towards casters.
Grim Dawn is not a real ARPG, it is just a toybox with cheat tools. Most of you guys would not make it to the top in Diablo 3 where you need to farm like crazy and with dedication. You just sit in grim tool and gd stash and create builds out of the blue