Fair enough, after 20+ years of gaming, I should know better than to expect complete civility. 
addressed that already, if you’re doing a weapon swap setup then just use plaguebearer’s master’s spellblade with double mark of dreeg.
also jajaja’s saboteur is better and faster than blademaster, no idea why you keep touting that as the pinnacle of efficiency
no, you lose res reduction, since warpfire is -33 and black star of deceit is -30, while malediction only gives you -50
it doesn’t struggle with res reduction, it’s one of the best builds in the game due to the abundant res reduction that it has access to. warpfire, black star, widow, eternal haunt.
you lose +2 to arcanist and +2 to demolitionist, you can’t use mark of anathema since you’re stuck with pyroclasm mark, so staying at 26/16 CT isn’t very easy, not to mention the fact that you have very limited conversion so you’re not really gaining a lot from the weapon damage component of callidor’s.
i agree that it’s probably a lot better if you don’t use CT at all, but that’s what you opened with, and that’s what we’re talking about, so
level 75 is irrelevant, shar’zul scales to be 11 levels higher than you whether you’re 75 or 85, the numbers are the exact same. i also kept 30 unspent points on my CT sorcerer for most of my playtime.
the fact that you reached shar’zul doesn’t really say anything, you would be hard-pressed to find a build that couldn’t get to shar’zul if you’re not awful at the game.
i have no doubt that the build is solid, it’s probably one of the best in the game as well. i don’t think it’s so much better than my agrivix setup that it warrants a nerf, though, until i see some videos proving otherwise. the chinese player mentioned 6 minute BoC clears, and that’s what the other top builds in the game are getting.
when somebody suggested my callidor’s setup to you in another thread, you tried it and went on about how broken it was and how it was going to get nerfed from all sides, so maybe if you were a bit less sensationalist with your comments i would be more willing to take you seriously.
Callidor’s Tempest doesn’t need to be nerfed as it is fine as is. The things that need to be changed are Agrivixs Malice proc, Slayer’s Blades proc & resists reduction stacking. The 2 procs are way to strong and there is no reason why you should be able to stack that many different sources of resist reduction. All resists reductions should reduce their resists the same amount and not be stackable. That way you have a choice in which resist reduction mechanic you want to use. How it is now you can absolutely abuse the system and make the games content point less.
No, the way farming is most efficient these days, refreshing blitz+blink and with high level justifiable ends on top will farm faster than anything (get the most average legendaries/infrequents per unit time), at least with perfect play. They didn’t nerf his damage enough for any other build to catch up to his mobility with faster killing speed. The saboteur is much more enjoyable to play at this point because it forgive sloppy play and imperfect gearing.
no, you lose res reduction, since warpfire is -33 and black star of deceit is -30, while malediction only gives you -50
That’s only true vs bosses.
it doesn’t struggle with res reduction, it’s one of the best builds in the game due to the abundant res reduction that it has access to. warpfire, black star, widow, eternal haunt.
Same as above, while killing bosses yes, but it can’t debuff mobs as reliably as almost any other build archetype.
you lose +2 to arcanist and +2 to demolitionist, you can’t use mark of anathema since you’re stuck with pyroclasm mark, so staying at 26/16 CT isn’t very easy, not to mention the fact that you have very limited conversion so you’re not really gaining a lot from the weapon damage component of callidor’s.
Just counting elemental/aether:
47.25[physical]*(0.15[Reckless]+0.27[IEE])[converted]=19.845 on my pistol vs 31.5 warpfire
Pyroclasm mark alone makes up the difference. This is the reason I actually went back to Calidor’s, PRM simply doean’t have the base damage without a huge skill point investment I can’t afford.
i agree that it’s probably a lot better if you don’t use CT at all, but that’s what you opened with, and that’s what we’re talking about, so
Unfortunately, no, I underestimated the power of a high level CT, see above.
And, no, that’s not what I’m talking about. I proposed a concept which I think works very well, not a specific CT-based build, as you will see soon. I’m perfectly willing to admit that Agrivix is probably better for a CT build, I just critiqued the trend of putting Agrivix on fucking everything.
level 75 is irrelevant, shar’zul scales to be 11 levels higher than you whether you’re 75 or 85, the numbers are the exact same. i also kept 30 unspent points on my CT sorcerer for most of my playtime.
the fact that you reached shar’zul doesn’t really say anything, you would be hard-pressed to find a build that couldn’t get to shar’zul if you’re not awful at the game.
The fact that I can respec a random char, stick some stuff i pulled from other chars, not even use res augments (look at the screenie, -8% chaos res ffs) or spend all stats/skills and run BoC at lvl 75 with a bugged Calidor is at least a sign that this concept works as more than just an Avatar killing gimmick.
You are being uncharitable, and you know it.
i have no doubt that the build is solid, it’s probably one of the best in the game as well. i don’t think it’s so much better than my agrivix setup that it warrants a nerf, though, until i see some videos proving otherwise. the chinese player mentioned 6 minute BoC clears, and that’s what the other top builds in the game are getting.
Again, I did not post a build, i posted one screenshot and some theorycrafting in hopes of getting people interested in something that is very likely to be a lot of fun (or at least effective). It wasn’t an entry in the BoC under 6 min dick-measuring contest, though something similar may become one.
when somebody suggested my callidor’s setup to you in another thread, you tried it and went on about how broken it was and how it was going to get nerfed from all sides, so maybe if you were a bit less sensationalist with your comments i would be more willing to take you seriously.
Both the CT/Agrivix sorc and these pistols will get nerfed, for different reasons though. I would be willing to bet on this.
The CT/Agrivix sorc is overpowered in the classical sense. 0.5 sec cd aoe proc that easily deals 8k damage, the near-invulnerability granted by Blast shield, the sheer power level of defensive devotions compared to offensive ones, one-shotting bosses with Devastation… the numbers will go down, item and devotion choices will become more limited but the build will stay decent. This is what happened to the blademaster.
These pistols, on the other hand, abuse the way the game is balance and are a very powerful gimmick. All it takes is for the proc to becomes something like “50% wpn dmg, 200 base piercing dmg, 20%-ish dmg to Chtonics” and they go right back on the shelf.
I would personally like if that didn’t happen because they provide a cute niche to build a gimmick around and don’t upset the overall balance…
the proc on those guns is 100% broken. You can have 100% uptime on them. They need to have at least a 6 second cooldown and probably only have like a 2 second duration at most. Having them last as long as they do and only a 3 second cooldown makes them completely out of wack.
riftstone + shadow strike works the same as blitz + shadow strike, you should be able to gap close every single pack without any downtime if you were interested.
i don’t think that’s fair to say, the vast majority of players on this forum do not know how to min-max in this game, and a brief glance at the build compendium tells you that very few players even realize how broken and centralizing resistance reduction even is
further, res reduction vs normal mobs is not especially relevant, since they all die in a second or two with devastation (which is almost always up for every single pack with aldanar). res reduction is most pressing vs bosses, for obvious reasons.
sounds like your math is better than mine here so i’ll do some more testing, dunno why i didn’t consider just how little the base damage of the weapon matters when we stack this much flat damage from stuff like flame touched/reckless power/IEE
yeah i mean that’s fine but you can see why i take pains with that right? to say ‘agrivix is a red herring!’ and then post a screenshot of a build that probably isn’t actually better than the same build using agrivix is disingenuous at best, and again, your sensationalism bothers me
again, levels don’t really matter here, stuff scales to be the same amount of levels above you regardless
it’s true that you’re not using augments, which is fine i guess, but the vast majority of damage you take in boc is physical, which gets reduced an enormous amount from iskandra’s 3piece. modalsoul has boc clear vids where he’s not using rings or pants, just due to how broken 20% phys resist is.
like i get that it’s fairly haphazard but you understand that you’re using pretty close to best in slot gear, right? i’m being uncharitable for reasons i mentioned earlier, i want to see videos because from my own testing i’m not noticing much improvement.
i never said i didn’t think the build worked. see above, i’m fairly confident it’s one of the best builds in the game. i just don’t get why you think it’s significantly better than the current top builds, and your vehemence strikes me as unfounded.
but then why broach it in the way that you did? i think that’s what bothered me enough to respond.
neither of these builds are anywhere near as broken as the concept of flat resistance reduction, which is something i tackle in my huge endgame essay in the feedback forum
sapros was gamebreaking in tq, and its removal didn’t suddenly solve the problem of flat res reduction being stupid, people just found alternatives.
i don’t think agrivix is broken and i don’t think this build is broken, hell, i think both are worse than jajaja’s saboteur and that’s not even optimized yet.
i’m interested in theorycrafting this build as well, i’d just like to do so with a bit more restraint i guess? i really hate people just dismissing everything as broken and deserving of nerfs and whatever else, it’s one of my biggest complaints about this community. look at zappa’s post in my CT thread, the very first reply, and you’ll see exactly why i don’t bother engaging in theorycraft here with many people here.
i didn’t read the blademaster build in detail, but im 99% certain my saboteur is both tankier AND kills things SIGNIFICANTLY faster, he probably has faster mobility i dont doubt that. but i’d like to know how long it takes that build to kill a boss compared to mine. u also haven’t seen what the saboteur build can do WITH perfect gear+perfect play. i recorded my vids on like the very 2nd run or something… 1st run was to explore the minimap.
as far as the guns go. again probably op, i agree. with that said i still think fabius is the best farm in terms of end game legendary hunt, i somehow doubt the gun build can kill fabius faster than 20sec or find him faster.
freshing SS/blitz isn’t that necessary, if u realy need that many gapclosers, u can easily pop a riftstone along side of SS
ur missing the point of the CT/aggrivix build. aggrivix is the onlythign thats op, and devastation could probably use a small nerf. i don’t even think blastshield is all that op. and CT is most certainly not op. it was just a skill to trigger aggrivix, many many builds can do it. it isn’t about being a sorc or using CT, the op is in the relic itself, thats it.
What a annoying thread to try and make sense of. Spec?? Items used??
Why make the reader sift through Chinese crap?
Here’s a build I made using them so you don’t need to go through chinese crap. I mean yuck feces.
Dreeg’s Buzzsaw Pyromancer
Grim Calc
Video
Thanks but hats not the build being discussed.
I’m simply wondering why the OP didn’t start the thread with a proper link to grim calc and describe the build.
" Guise, Agrivix is a red herring!!!" doesn’t even mean anything to me. It’s just a lot of nonsense.
But it shows how OP they are which was his point, that they were stronger then Agrivixs Malice.
I will skip the technical discussion, too tired…
What you read as sensationalism was simply snarkyness. Yes, Agrivix is good, obviously, i stated that in the first fucking sentence.
Just because it’s good doesn’t mean it’s the only way to clear endgame. It’s ridiculous how everyone and his mother are just sticking Agrivix, ToL and Behemoth on every char.
How to play PB? Put Agrivix on, use clairvoyant to convert chaos to aether.
How to play melee battlemage? Put agrivix on, use mindwarp to convert physical to aether.
How to play ranged primal strike? Pick Druid, put agrivix on, use vortex of souls and stack aether damage.
How to play 2H warder? Don’t, play something that uses Agrivix.
Pretty much everyone on these forums at some point tried to say fuck it to skills as such and just attack using CotWK or OJ and devotion procs to trigger the fucking Agrivix.
This is why it took an isolated community to discover the Demonslayers nonsense. You would think that something that was so expliotable for so long would be well known to everyone on a forum which has a lot of people theorycrafting and trying to optimize builds as much as possible…
That’s why Agrivix (and to an extent Fire strike, Elemental balance and Storm touched) was a red herring.
i never said i didn’t think the build worked. see above, i’m fairly confident it’s one of the best builds in the game. i just don’t get why you think it’s significantly better than the current top builds, and your vehemence strikes me as unfounded.
Jesus Tittyfucking Christe! What build? What fucking build?
I posted a screenshot of a setup and said “hey guys, this two item combination is stupidly good, slap it onto a char you already fucking have and check it out!”
Just for you… Would this be better?
Hey, guys, this two item combination is really cool and it’s already perfectly compatible with the Markovian’s set pistol cadence Blademaster you surely already have set up since everyone here is using it to farm BoC/Nemesis:
And yea, after actually putting on augments, Shar’Zul and his buddy took less than 30 sec:
Now, can we please go back to discussing how to abuse this demonstrably stupid combination before the nerfhammer hits and leave the CT/Agrivix discussions in the appropriate thread?
but then why broach it in the way that you did? i think that’s what bothered me enough to respond.
Because it’s demonstrably good, and deserves to be put out there for other people. And since other people seem to be stuck in the infinite loop of sticking Agrivix onto things, a similar setup is a very good place to start since it makes comparison easier for everyone.
neither of these builds are anywhere near as broken as the concept of flat resistance reduction, which is something i tackle in my huge endgame essay in the feedback forum
sapros was gamebreaking in tq, and its removal didn’t suddenly solve the problem of flat res reduction being stupid, people just found alternatives.
i don’t think agrivix is broken and i don’t think this build is broken, hell, i think both are worse than jajaja’s saboteur and that’s not even optimized yet.
i’m interested in theorycrafting this build as well, i’d just like to do so with a bit more restraint i guess? i really hate people just dismissing everything as broken and deserving of nerfs and whatever else, it’s one of my biggest complaints about this community. look at zappa’s post in my CT thread, the very first reply, and you’ll see exactly why i don’t bother engaging in theorycraft here with many people here.
True, there is no reason for flat resistance reductions to stack.
Agrivix is simply too good compared to similar effects. It’s not conceptually broken, the numbers are just too high. Compare to typical lightning bolts and aether missles that proc from items, they in general do around 2000-3000 dmg in a small aoe every 1-2 sec, this one does 8000-ish with the same char stats every 0.5 sec in a huge aoe.
I’m not saying everything about the CT/aggrivix char is op, but it is the build that combines a lot of op things all at once. Blast shield is just as stupid as fighting spirit was before the nerf.
Big generalization there. I never fucking touched Agrivix and had no idea what it was. Hence my first comment.
I know what it is now, and I’ve certainly seen it used, but I don’t think it’s being used as much as you think it is.
I’ve been thinking 85% Weapon Damage and 6s/6s Duration/CD. Weaker 100% uptime, max of 2.
Did I or generalcash force you to come to my thread? And those yuck feces, chinese crap you said, just killed the mog , if i don`t post those “crap” ,can you make this "yuck feces 2.0"build by yourself?
wut???
will respond to more of this later but like
maybe people wouldn’t be talking about agrivix if you didn’t directly compare this mechanic to agrivix in the title
to say that agrivix is a red herring is literally, objectively making a value judgment between the two mechanics; to say that x is a red herring that distracted us from y is to say that y is better/more meaningful than x. this is how language works. this is the language you chose to use.
why you chose to phrase the thread and its contents in the way that you did, i don’t really understand, since you don’t seem to like the idea of people comparing the two
further, you’re really overstating the ubiquity of the agrivix thing. i was the first to post about it (though i think nine was using it on his PB character before me), then someone had a prm version, and jajaja is using the OJ version (which i don’t think is actually better due to the reliance on weapon swap, but it’s really cool either way). where else are you seeing it? just because it’s a top tier build-type it doesn’t mean everybody is doing it.
This.
I have NO idea what you guys are going on about too. Like…who is Agrivix!
This thread is like listening in on a conversation you missed half of, and you still cant figure out what they’re talking about.
Apparently I’m out of the loop.
Lol I never went to your site not even once. So I’m guessing the answer is No. And yes Feces is yuck, I mean its why after I take a shit I flush the toilet instead of playing with it. But maybe thats just me.
Anyways I was being Sarcastic to the person I quoted about the Chinese crap thing. But thanks for saying Hi.
I don’t think the item (or the set) is intended for melee range build, its a pistol boosting PB.
I think the proc will be changed to CC and less damage, maybe like invoker’s shard’'s proc.