Need final clarification on Savagery/WPS/Upheaval interactions.

Now, if I have 165% weapon damage on Savagery and 200% on Feral Hunger, does it mean that the final damage when Feral Hunger procs is 165%x200% = 330% weapon damage?

That´s a very good question and I would like to know the answer, too.

And what about the charges? If I have 9 charges up is it (in my case with Execution):

  1. 120 %x165 %x 270 %=534,60 %
  2. 120 %x270 %=324,00 %
  3. 165 %x270 %=445,50 %
  4. Something completely different


Upheaval is only executed, if no WPS was rolled. With a weight of 97 you might want to unlearn Upheaval.

Yes, likewise for Savagery and any of your WPSs. Celestial powers can proc simultaneously, it’s the same as for items procs.


With other WPS with 25% chance to be used now you have 20% to proc this WPS and 80% chance to proc Upheaval when crit.

upheaval does not inflict damage to your primary target, i don’t understand why so many people say that it does

easily testable with a character that deals no dot damage on autoattack and hitting one of the two devil’s crossing dummies until you crit, at which point the adjacent dummy begins taking bleed damage while your primary target does not

i was curious at first if maybe only the %weapon damage component also hit your main target, but with 0/10 upheaval, 1/10, and 10/10 the damage range from crits on the main target doesn’t change

LOL true, never noticed that. One more useless skill like Torrent.

So Upheaval is actually useless in most cases, especially when you have high WPS %? Thanks for all the clarification btw.

Not all classes / builds have that many WPSs, so that you still benefit of Upheaval then.

this sucks.

Wasn’t jajaja the one who posted that 2H savagery warder guide built around upheaval/blindfury?


Are there any other trap skills like that? Torrent’s bouncy lightning always disappointed, but I figured the build needed any single target DPS help it could get… “useless like upheaval” implies it adds nothing to the primary target’s damage taken.

that explains why upheaval has been abysmal in any of my attempts to make use of it. would it be unbalanced when working with wps or why is that?

and it gets worse…

Probably unbalanced - basically you want two skills to be executed by a single attack. Not sure if this is the correct explanation, but both activate off of default attacks, but once a WPS was rolled it is no longer a default attack.

Wow. That explains why my 20/10 Avenger Upheaval is so fucking slow at killing bosses. What a shitty skill.

Ok, another question, say I have 97% WPS with Savagery and bind 100% chance on critical hit devotion to Savagery, does it mean that said devotions is going to proc regardless of wps? Or does it actually mean that I have only 3% attacks left to proc it?

Also, if WPS has > 100% weapon damage, we multiply Savagery wd x WPS wd and get final damage number. But what if WPS is like 30% weapon damage?

Still need answers to those questions, please :slight_smile:

It’s going to proc regardless of WPS. Have I not already answered this? :wink:

Yes, likewise for Savagery and any of your WPSs. Celestial powers can proc simultaneously, it’s the same as for items procs.[/QUOTE][/INDENT]

I would assume it is multiplicative, too.

Its shitty when you try to use it like any other WPS, i.e. stack up all your WPS to get as close to 100% as possible. Upheaval is good when Feral Hunger is your only WPS and you have a high crit, it’s basically free damage on 25-35% of your 80% of hits that aren’t Feral Hunger procs.

Thanks for clarifying, man! Althought Savagery weapon damage being multiplicative with WPS with 30% damage kinda don’t make sense, would mean that we are actually losing a lot of damage.

About upheaval not damaging main target is like a bad joke…
It seemed to me that targeting mob next to boss resulted in more damage on the boss than targeting directly, but I assumed that was due to lower DA and resulting higher crit… Now i know :frowning:
Very sad, seemed so promising full OA warder, only upheaval no other WPS.

Wrong. When your attack rolls “crit”, Upheaval act just like another WPS, with 100% chance to activate. If you dont have other WPS, you will always roll Upheaval. If you do have some other WPS, all %chances on those WPS (including Upheaval) will be scaled down, so total chance will remain 100%.

I made tests on dummies, and statistical results confirm mechanics i’ve described.

I dont know, WHERE have you got the data, that Upheaval works in different way than all other WPS. Makes 0 sense as well.

Actually, according to my tests, Upheaval does not increase damage for primary target (i believe, it’s always 100% Weapon Damage). All secondary targets, hit my AoE, will take modified damage, though. But since AoE is so small, i can clearly claim that Upheaval IS the SHITTY SKILL. Dont put any points into it, unless Feral Hunger is your only other WPS, and you have a strong need to trigger “on-crit” devotion (like Hand of Ultos).

P.S. some time ago, Upheaval affected main target too. Then, it was changed. It was quite useless before that chance, due to low %Weapon Damage, and it remained useless, now because it doesnt work on main target (lol).

I find your answer makes sense, so that Upheaval is added to pool of the other skills if there is a crit, but Crate confirmed this is not how it works. You have been on the other thread - I’m just adding it here, too, for clarity.