Please allow us to welcome a new ranged spec. Are there not enough melee specializations and strong ones?

Grim Dawn Ideas and Feedback
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【5. Evoker Vindicator Lightning damage
【6. Demonslayer Reaper Phantom Knife Vitality Damage
【8. Demonslayer Trickster Phantom Knife Vitality Damage
【10. Lightning/Acid RtA Grasping Vines Archon Lightning Counterattack
【13. Harbinger Conjurer chaos damage
【16. Lightning RtA Aegis spam Archon Lightning Counterattack
【18. Physical ranged DW RF Warlord <2. Gutsmasher EoR Warlord physical damage
【19. Vitality ranged DW Oppressor Vitality damage

Have you noticed how serious the homogenization is, 5 13 18 19 are real long-range, 6 and 8 in my opinion just release a skill with a long-range weapon, more like a magician? 10 16 is holding a long-range weapon but relies on lightning counterattack, 18 is long-range but the same combination is replaced with melee, ranking 2nd. I did complain about the weak range, but my focus is actually on playability. I think it is time to launch a strong specialization that focuses on range. It is only in BD that you feel that the difference between range and melee is not big, but in terms of the game process Absolutely not the case, it’s definitely easier to use melee specialization in the game.thanks for your reply Automatic typesetting confuses the numbers, but you can definitely see them clearly

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Based on what? I mean…I, the developer that designed the class, just said it’s not a melee class, but what would I know I guess?

What is it lacking?

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My reply to Gnomish_Inquisition is my point of view. Just like Night Blade and Shaman support most BDs, a new ranged specialization is needed to support more ranged BDs to improve the playability and richness of the game.

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That doesn’t answer my question. What will a “ranged” mastery bring to the game that is missing now?

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Another “channeling” thread I see. World is full of prophets nowadays.

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There’s only one way to answer to your comment: :clown_face:

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When are we getting our first “ranged” mastery? Inquisitor is a caster! /s

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these are the only ranged builds i’m referring to, i don’t know why you’re even bringing in they others, they are obviously not ranged?

no it did not those are totally difference builds, and it’s amazing you can’t see that/if you think they are even remotely the same anything you say should be dismissed

then again, it’s amazing you still dont’ see the point with your own list in hand
the issue is not ranged specialization missing, the key is the iteration of the game’s balance. 1.2 fundamentally changed so many things that benefitted melee more, so dual wield melee that was absent before now rose above the previous gunners
This is to say that gunners can rise again, with another iteration of the game’s balance, regardless of another mastery or “non ranged specialization” - because it’s about the items and skills status being buffed or not and to which degree

i’m now convinced you’re not actually speaking from a point of sincerity but a point of “greed”/personal desire irrespective of the reality or state of the game… - this has nothing todo with ranged build status in the game
In essence you’re just upset you didn’t get a mastery that 100% serves you/Berserker mastery hasn’t shown to do exactly what you want

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I don’t know why you attacked me, or even doubted my sincerity. You missed the point from the beginning. I’ve said I welcome Berserker, which is a good thing for all players, but I just don’t think Berserker is going to be a huge change.

At least he is now positioned as an all-rounder and I think a strong ranged specialist is needed to solve the problem and make the game richer and more playable. When I want to establish a long-range poison damage in the game, you will find it difficult to find a suitable weapon. Any melee weapon you pick up will have higher damage than your long-range damage. What I mean is in the game, not the BD stage.

I just listed all those holding long-range weapons to show that they are seriously homogeneous.2 and 18. I mean the same specialization, not the same BD. . It doesn’t matter, I waste my time making some suggestions just out of my love for GD. My name is GD ff. Designers also think that my suggestions are just complaints, and some people make fun of me as a prophet, but shouldn’t opinions be expressed in advance?

The designer even asked me what will a “ranged” mastery bring to the game that is missing now? Maybe in his opinion, ranged mastery is the one that will not bring changes.

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The fact that you asked this question proves that we have no consensus at all, but Paikis’ question gives you exactly the answer.

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You misunderstood. It’s not that it’s not suitable for long-range combat, but it’s more suitable for melee combat. Of course, this is just my prediction. When a character is positioned as omnipotent, of course I predict this under the current conditions.

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Making fun? Hardly. I mean you said it right here.

IIRC, there was a point in GD’s development cycle where there was community concern that ranged (including casters) was becoming the “go to” playstyle or some such. People didn’t want that form of gameplay to dominate everything.

Your proposal to increase ranged damage to match melee would likely bring back that sort of imbalance that the community wanted to avoid in the first place.

It feels like you want to obliterate everything from far away and avoid being hit. That’s not GD. That’s a bullet hell/heaven game IMO.

Also, AFAIK, isn’t the top 20 builds intended to showcase the fastest SR 75 clear times?

There is no solid indication of what you want “range” to be capable of. Are you asking to have similar SR clear times as the top 20 with range? Faster CR clear times? Like be specific because it’s hard to tell.

This thread was already negatively received because of the mention of a mastery that isn’t even ready for release, much less for closed testing. Had it just been about ranged with possible suggestions/solutions to improving it…it might have had a different reaction.

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the fact you think Paikis is answering your question or even being genuine shows how off the mark you are
i’ll highlight it for you:

again, what problem, what isn’t playable?

there are several, i have no issue making a poison gunner…

yes, this is deliberate design, something the devs have even explained why
personally i’m not sure that design philosphy fits as good anymore with all the other changes to the game, but it’s a base design that was made for a reason - and that reason wasn’t really that far out back in the day

which matters why, or do you not understand the difference, or the nuances, or even the criteria for the top20 and why those top20 builds were the top20 back then?
Class doesn’t matter, dmg type doesn’t matter when we’re talking about ranged builds existing or being good or easy to build. It doesn’t matter exactly for the same reason you see multiple warlords and many phys dmg builds on the list, because for the 4th time

^please try to understand this, because at a very basic level it seems like you do not
if you don’t understand fully what i mean with the explanation given around game’s balance mattering for gunners, then ask and i’ll try to elaborate best i can

the problem with expressing opinions in advance is when there is nothing to have an opinion about
you haven’t played Berserker; you don’t know what it will/can or will not do for the game or ranged flavour
the additional issue becomes when you can’t even formulate a basic underlying reason for your issue or unfounded speculation; even when directly asked

the designer asked for a reason; and yet, despite multiple prompts; you have yet to deliver a singular let the multiple things necessary to answer it
*you have briefly but relatively vaguely touched upon it in your answer to me with the poison weapon, that’s it, but it’s far from specific enough nor wide enough/doesn’t cover the multitude of effects a full mastery would necessitate
so, what is wrong with the game that it requires another ranged specialization mastery (yes inquis counts, also even if you don’t think so), what does that mastery need to do - be specifici, and to the core of it why - “it’s necessary because the game currently doesnt’ do or allow X”

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Smh typical gen z behavior. Stop getting offended. :joy:

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Seems some people in this forum apparently can see the future. I can think of better things to see in the future than how a mastery in an upcoming expansion is gonna play like.

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You are right, I really thought Paikis had the same idea as me, and I came here thinking that someone would have the same idea as me, but now it seems that I am just as lonely as the Inquisitor.
What I actually meant was acid damage rather than poison. An acidic hunter with a crossbow is what I imagined, but you’ll find it hard to find the right weapon, your damage will never be as good as lightning, some damage like acid and aether lack ranged specialization and Weapon support.
But there are related remote specializations in MOD Dawn of Masteries to provide support.

Back to the starting point, I just hope that the Inquisitor will no longer be alone. I really don’t know if your iteration of the game’s balance refers to the alternation of strength and weakness. But for example, if you don’t even have support for acid and aether, you should enrich first and then balance.

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Thanks for your reply, I just wish acid damage and aether damage had associated ranged specs to provide support to catch up to Shaman’s lightning damage. I don’t think only Inquisitor can support more ranged BD.

The following is a discussion with others
You are right, I really thought Paikis had the same idea as me, and I came here thinking that someone would have the same idea as me, but now it seems that I am just as lonely as the Inquisitor.
What I actually meant was acid damage rather than poison. An acidic hunter with a crossbow is what I imagined, but you’ll find it hard to find the right weapon, your damage will never be as good as lightning, some damage like acid and aether lack ranged specialization and Weapon support.
But there are related remote specializations in MOD Dawn of Masteries to provide support.

Back to the starting point, I just hope that the Inquisitor will no longer be alone. I really don’t know if your iteration of the game’s balance refers to the alternation of strength and weakness. But for example, if you don’t even have support for acid and aether, you should enrich first and then balance.

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You do realize that you don’t actually need Inquisitor to play ranged? There’s nothing inherently melee about Oathkeeper and Occultist, while Nightblade’s ABB actually becomes a ranged skill when you have ranged weapon?

There are 2 pistols and 3 rifles for acid ranged. If you think that’s not enough, you’d do better asking for those in the expansion instead of complaining about unreleased class.

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IIRC, there is an honorable mention for a Vortex of Souls build in the top20 thread. If the build reached that point after all of that community testing, pretty sure it’s in a better than decent place.

Unsure as to acid. I haven’t played a ranged, non caster build since AoM launch.

I suppose an argument could be made for there being not enough aether/acid ranged builds but without some sort of tangible data (gd tools, videos, etc.) I doubt asking for changes would get much traction with either Crate or the community.

This is likely the best advice for changes you are asking for…beyond modding.

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are you seriously saying, or trying to say/conflate, that because you can’t find an Acid dmg Crossbow (there is several btw), or that the existing Acid dmg Crossbows there aren’t “up to your standards/desire”, or aren’t happy enough using transmogs, that it equates to the game both needing another mastery, and that mastery has to be a one dimensional on top ?? @_@ - then i’d say you’re very very far out there

If you have an issue with the game’s itemization, then that’s a specific thing you can easily bring up, both in feedback and playtest, state the weaponry missing and the skill support not present etc
It’s true there is less ranged weapon variety than melee, always has been, doesn’t mean ranged builds are necessarily lacking or not strong or can’t be made, and in the least shouldn’t be reason to be upset about Berserker mastery supposedly(you don’t know) not featuring X, - but just ask for the items you feel missing ?

Again, the fact you think inquis stands alone, or there is no neat ranged builds, when you have the old top20 demonstrably showing you wrong by featuring only a single inquis build, should be hint the other masteries are plenty to form good gunners, we just need 1.2.2+ to bring back what was lost when the gunners were on top20 and 0 dual wield melee was - hint hint

(again, it’s about game balance/buffs up and down, the 36 current classes is more than capable of making good strong gunners it’s just a matter of dialing in the skill and items + modifiers to where they deal with 1.2 changes as easily as melee AAs did)

i made one btw, worked plenty fine before 1.2 - haven’t played it in a long time