But that will penalize those that do not do not use elemental retal to begin with.
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And? It has been shown that NOT using the conversion is objectively the weaker version. By not using it you basically playing a gimped version. Should we now take into account weaker, less fine tuned versions of the same build?
We should probably take into account that one should not balance builds around “seraphim of thorns/blades” greens 
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Yes, I was merely giving a suggestion if something has to be nerfed in this case, it has to be the set retal in my opinion. Weird conversion shennanigans and lowering the conversion of the items that are not part of the set is a bad thing in my opinion.
I mean, 3 minutes Calla for a retal build is kind of weak in my opinion and it doesn’t really warrant a nerf. I remember that phys Counter Strike Warlord with Sentinel of the Three doing 1 minute and change on Calla AFTER getting nerfed. So a retal build doing 3 minutes is fine.
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You mean witchblade with fevered rage?
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Yeah, that. I swear it was Warlord though.
If this is fine, then Stoneguard is fine.
Yeah, people cry about retal nerfs in patch notes, OP asks for more nerfs. What a bizzare world we live in.
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There is no such thing as a phys retal build that doesn’t have elemental retal in it. Chariot in itself is fire retal and that is enough to warrant conversion items on ALL phys retal builds. That’s unless you’re intentionally gimping your build. Show me a phys retal build without conversion that performs on par to those with it and maybe the discussion will take a different turn.
This is why I’m also against nerfing ele>phys conversion for the same reasons @Norzan mentioned. Because the only way to nerf those without affecting non retal builds is to introduce a penalty a la Beronath (which is OPs suggestion) which is rather inelegant considering there are a lot of them. And that kind of nerf hurts non stoneguard builds even more compared to stoneguard.
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I haven’t read everything because I’m lazy, but I don’t understand why you are now claiming Stone guard is OP. Yes, physical retaliation is in a much better position than lightning retaliation, but I don’t think it’s OP enough to need a nerf. And fire retaliation is much stronger right now.
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What? Lemme see a build. I’m interested.
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Again, I am lazy and have not tested it. It’s a little fragile and needs tweaking, but it’s powerful enough. Please test it instead.
https://www.grimtools.com/calc/b28Bz1qZ
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Chariot got fire retal? You mean messenger of war?
Targo the builder and Ulzaad is physical retal. You assume all players know about things like converted into physical damage ignores armor. I take the casual perspective here, lets say someone who does not live on the forum completes the stoneguard set, get other decent retal items, and go with shield wall and ulzaad and obelisk and vire devotions. Should this persons build be DOUBLE gimped now? gimped once because does not use convesion, gimped twice because stoneguard set got nerfed because some GD stashers on the forum broke the game?
It’s like saying “you are gimping yourself if you do not GD stash”.
I thought you was gonna uninstall?
2 Likes
How the heck are you wearing Thornhide Leggings? I was going to test this but wut?
You need to have max physique rolls on all gear, and use a temporary item to provide enough physique to equip them, or have more points in veterancy and when you have the pants on you reduce the number of points in veterancy. Also I think craft bonus with physique is needed on helm, glove, belt.
Not going to bother stashing 20 copies of impossible MIs, but I got it to work.
https://www.grimtools.com/calc/L2JAd9EN
Now to see if it WORKS
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