[Suggestion]Buff Sabouteur via Nex and Ortus

N&O should be mainly supporting DW Fire melee Sabo and none of that cold BS.

There are like zero viable end game DW Fire builds as far as i know of and Sabo should be Fire, Fire and Fire again.

As-is its kind of the poor brother of any DW Cold Infiltrators

So basically screwed the only good Sabo build?

Cause even if N&O is fire set, lack of - fire RR on Nightblade means build will be disappointing.

And here we came dangerously close to the logical follow up question - why buff the only good Sabo build if there’s Rimetongue, Harra and pure cold FS waiting in line?

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To further increase the gap? :smile:

But I have very good Rimetongue N&O, Lee have one with SR set, you can even go no set and still be decent.

Cold Grenado or Stun Jacks is meme, fire FS with Mageslayer is what I tried, well it’s not very good build to be honest. So I’d rather see buffs to other possible builds, but no way I will be happy if Nex and Ortus become full fire set.

Nothing a liberal injections of steroids can’t fix. :rofl:

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Its not like you cant add easily a mod to N&O -“Convert Cold RR from Night Chill to Fire”.

I honestly dont want to advice wrecking anyone`s build - i just want a viable endgame Fire DW melee Sabo!

Cold has dozens of top builds, Fire = 0.

Melee Sabouter with N&O is hella strong. Only bad thing about it is that it uses Shattered Set for optimal performance.

Unfortunately, only Cold FS part of it is strong tho, Fire SS never really took off without Fire RR to Night’s Chill.

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Missing a chunk of RR is tough. But you could maybe get away with a Blazeheart + Allahdrah DW combo for pure fire.

Idk, something like this with Justicar set DW fire saboteur ?

Or SR set. (which would lose the amulet pierce conversion but be less fragile). only 100-ish RR but possibly good single target.

It depends on how badly you want to be pure fire.


I had the wrong jewelry augments selected. No wonder it seemed low at the time. Since I adjusted, it should be ok, with RR:

  • -44% mines
  • -23% devotion
  • 25 reduced devotion
  • -8% ring
  • -and possibly some help from Viper’s 20%RR

total is 100RR. Which is actually decent. I think it can do without LA and Flash bang (more OA).

Pure Fire Sabouter will fail miserably, and nothing will save it, except Fire RR mod to Night’s Chill and some Cold/Acid to Fire conversion. But that’s fine, Nightblade is anything but a Fire class.

…and Demo is anything but a cold class.

cold build uses mostly nightblade with support/RR from demo

perhaps a fire build should be able to use fire SS and bombs for a mobile bomber class, idk.

it seems that all the converted stun jacks builds (and all stun jacks without lights defenders) are just a meme build, so perhaps the skill needs to be looked at.
(btw, have the recent buffs to cold SJ harra’s affected much?).

no dude, there is a big difference. First and foremost, Demo offers huge RR to Cold. It’s the only reason Cold Sabo works, believe me. I mean, I know it because I have made the strongest Sabo long ago.. There is also a case of converting a lot of fire into cold thanks to build-enabling belt and cold buffs to FS.

Without Fire RR in Nightblade you can forget about it, unless you wanna stick with farming Main Campaign, then anything will go, frankly.

so i guess cold damage it is.

they changed mines to cold RR as a sabo buff, perhaps N&O needs to do the same for fire to nights chill. it seems to be the only option for fire sabo - if it wouldn’t break other classes the rr could be on an amulet or something.

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100 RR (see above) is not too bad for this if one wanted to do pure fire. I looked at MLee’s link above and the Blazeheart + Allahdrah Sabo has similar WD but profits much more from Firestrike due to fire and the lit conversion. (Less RR by 30 equivalent or so on the cold side, but 25% more RR for the fire side). OA/DA values are ok and there’s some room for stat juggling

Could be worth a try. It’s no N+O super-procs, but gotta be open to alts.

Maybe use Mageslayer set too? gives %15 fire RR
EDIT: Set also gives %18 elemental RR maybe could be viable for fire sabo

EDIT: https://www.grimtools.com/calc/qNY53oBN Spitballing here this might work

Fire Sabo is a miserable thing. I tried one with N&O+ Justicar’s set - everything good (stats, armor etc) except damage - it’s like 16k (maximum) in GT. In-game numbers are better, yes, but still there’s no damage.

Actually, melee FS works on 3-4 builds (Cold Sabo and Blazehearts Defiler/Shieldbreaker) and fire Sabo is not that case.

Dunno what can help except -% fire RR to Night’s Chill and some conversions to Fire, as @mad_lee has already said.

if Fire Sabo is miserable compare to Cold Sabo, then why not both? I built this in game actually, and DPS is 152k permenant (Cold/Fire ratio 55/45). In tanky version (SR set): https://www.grimtools.com/calc/aZq4ezvV, it has 88 fire RR and 118 cold RR (not counting Viper), with a lot of shield absorb (add Phoenix and Arcane Barrier on top of Blast shield/ Serenity/ Ghoul/ SR set). Yeah, i dont have super piloting skill to get sub 5 or even 6 minutes, but very colorful and consistent build. To be honest, i think dual Cold AND Fire is something special to Sabo, and it is what game design N&O set to do in the 1st place. You want Cold melee Nightblade? Infiltrator or Trickster a lot better.
Edit: i’m trying to change a bit to Mageslayer set for this dual type build, like this one: https://www.grimtools.com/calc/L2JpQggZ and it got a whole lot more RR (31 more fire RR and 16 more cold RR), really thinking it might work too.


SR set doesn’t count because it’s an overtuned generalist set that surprisingly hasn’t gotten adjusted. If your answer is “use SR set” the mastery combo in question is probably struggling or you’re shooting for excessive durability.

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If you have an awesome weapon that alone you think “it can be really good” and want to build around it, and you dont know yet what other gears it needs, SR set comes to mind immediately. I mean, its pretty obvious, but not “the ONLY option” you can get. If you want Cold FS Sabo, you can also try Rimmetongue set (support both classes, at least for skill points, not skill modified like Blade trap). If you want fire FS Sabo, then Justice set can be good (support Demo class and very good flat dam and AS). Then if you think of dual fire and cold, and want more general elemental RR, Mageslayer set is really shine. After that, it comes to what the result of testing all those ideas. In the end, i think if N&O set CANNOT match with all of these options, then it clearly need some buffs. But 1st, its actually not bad at all in 2 or 3 options. And 2nd, what kind of buffs you want? More damage? I dont think it lack damage (around 150k DPS auto atk with an DEFENSIVE gear choice like SR and serenity relic) is pretty insane. More tanky? What tanky options you want for a weapon set? And those proc from these 2 swords healing really good. Or you just want to buffs things, so it can all match “the meta sub 5 or sub 6 minutes builds”- then i give up. I want to “buff Saboteur”, like giving new sets for this class, more options to chose, not just “buff N&O set” since it already got plenty of ways to play N&O.

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Sadly the only set designed for SB is a caster set (quite more meme), the cold focus build makes most Demo skills redundant, I prefer the balance between both masteries thou. Unless Z decides to make a new set, otherwise its hard to build a balancing SB.

puts on the acronym police hat

SB (disambiguation)
Did you mean: saboteur, shieldbreaker, spellbinder, spellbreaker?

Pre FG we didn’t have much of an issue with this. Breaker = spellbreaker, binder = spellbinder, sabo = saboteur. Though it gets weird now that FG is here. What even do we do?