Thank for build.
In this build, on [Level 52 - 64], which should be the primary attack spell and which the secondary? And the same in devotions?
Do you still play this build? Iâm using it and I would love to know what to do in Malmouth. XD
Just stand and get hit. Thatâs what a retaliation build is
Squibâs build still works
https://www.grimtools.com/calc/nZor4edV (AoM version)
Just curious:
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Is having less DA (purposefully) actually beneficial to clearing speed as you get hit more often or is that stupid because it invites death through being critted? I mean having 6000 DA would mean you would hardly retaliate because only bosses would hit you, no?
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Squib seemed to have 24k life, your version has about 14k â no matter?
boths build sux. change that devotion points
âŚhäh?
Donât pay attention to him. He has a habit of coming into threads and disrupting the flow.
Engaging him would mean a heated discussion which either gets the thread locked or posts purged i.e a waste of time
Iâll address your concerns
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Less DA = More retaliation. For Ret character around 2.7k DA with permanent buffs is enough
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I have 16k HP (tip: always switch on permanent buffs in grimtools when viewing builds)
Itâs lesser than Squibâs sure but I have 4.7k Armor without temporary buffs. With buffs it goes upto 8k. That high value of armor will keep you safe. -
Oh and I also took some RR so use Wind Devil periodically to debuff your enemies. This improves Retaliationâs kill speed
Hey thanks Cthon. I like the way you write and communicate, by the way. I also like your guides, which help me understand a lot more than merely the immediate instrumentally-tuned mini-context.
I have read about 40% of these 78 pages, and am not entirely sure I understand where the consensus is as to where this build is also in terms of gladiator crucible today, I saw your post from this last page saying âstill viableâ and you linked a grimtools update which also has slightly different devotions.
May I still askâŚ
Since I donât have a lvl 100 warder, and no serious retal gear yet, I was thinking of a secondary skill to use just till Iâm in the swing, and not sure if I should invest more into Savagery for that purposeâŚ?
Did Squib get so much life âjustâ from gear? I see his logic in âmore life + wendigo = better healingâ and wonder if I can also try for thatâŚ
To figure out my dps, am I supposed to just add all the retal bits on my third page together?
Do bonuses to â+x% all damageâ also affect retal damage?
Is there a reason you donât take even a tiny bit of war cry? Doesnât seem the build is starved for pointsâŚ
vielen Dank!
-I donât recommend taking Pure retaliator through crucible. Youâd be a corpse before it clears the damn thing :p. Itâs safe but too slow (atleast for me)
Even with Hybrid setups I stop at challenger. A DoT Retaliation WB can probably clear gladiator, but I didnât try it. Imo Retaliation builds are meant for Main campaign which includes Nemesis, end game bosses and Super bosses. Not implying Retaliation chars canât clear crucible. Theyâre just slow for my taste
-Squibâs logic isnât incorrect but the game has changed a lot since he made this build and I think that your ability to defend your HP is as important as the HP pool. High HP pool with little defenses or Low HP with high defenses, imo both are bad which is why I prefer to balance it out.
Also note he and I are different players so our build philosophies are bound to vary. 
-I am using a component called Oleronâs Blood that allows me to reduce enemy damage similar to War Cry
-Total Damage and Total Damage penalties do not affect Retaliation. It is a damage type of its own and is only affected by %Retaliation damage bonuses. However, retaliation damageâs effectiveness does depend on enemy resistance similar to conventional damage and therefore Resistance Reduction is very handy for retaliation chars.
Gern geschehen (blame Google if this is incorrect :p)
them say them pro but cant make a good build some clear everything ( include ravager on ultimate )
better them use cheat so no need change builds lol⌠but them maybe like waste of time!
I started this build as my 2nd character and i just love it (as long as i donât have to deal with ranged/caster heroes and tons of healers aroundâŚ)
I have followed Squibâs guide almost to the letter, some small changes in skills and gearing, and just finished AoM in ultimate for the first time.
grimtools.com/calc/lNk374QN (too few posts for link)
Most items are still pre-expansion, only belt and chest are new. Some skills are implemented from Chthonâs grimtools link further up.
With a bit of tweaking in devotions and updated gear I bet this build will continue to be fun.
@Chthon, I saw you added quite a bit of cunning into the build. Wouldnât those be better placed into physique?
I am using RR from Ass Mark which activates off crits, I need OA for that
Not to mention Retaliation works best when your DA is low (around 2.7k is fine). Enemies should be able to hit you but not crit you, that is what is considered to be the perfect DA value
So donât invest too much in DA, retaliation is slow enough as it is. By adding more DA you make it even more boring
hi, iâm following this build and iâm lvl 40 and loving it so far, but the range mobs/boss took forever to kill⌠any info you can give me ? i got full set of perdition right now and every items got retaliation dmg .
In my experience with this build, ranged/caster heroes and bosses will be a pain in the a** throughout the game.
Options would be to either equip items/components with reflect damage or choose some form of offensive skill/ability. However, the mechanic behind reflected damage makes is near useless anywayâŚ
Iâm gonna do some tweaking with my current setup, see if I can implement more of Chthonâs offensive ideas to better handle those pesky buggers
EDIT:
Minor tweaks and upgrades, reached lvl 100. Plenty of room for improvements tho
Current setup
https://www.grimtools.com/calc/nZoWy9vZ
Ancient Grove dungeon
https://www.grimtools.com/calc/RZRn9O0Z
Slight issue with gearing.
Can tank crucible (aspirant) up to 150 not-too-safely, nemesis starting with ZâŚ
Would love to hear some suggestions.
Surprisingly fun to play with all the monsters are flying in the air and very efficient too, thanks for your detailled guide
Been awhile since I played but just got back into the game with Malmouth 1.0.6.0v and happy to see this is still going.
At level 51 with perdition set, itâs good to see what gear your using, thanks for sharing!
With the mod added doing full retaliation to ranged this build got so much better.
In fact it almost feelsl like cheating.
So, in the current version of the game what would the BiS be like and how much is enough in DA?
You kinda need to give em a tiny crit chance for em to hit 100%?
Sorry what build u using⌠so itâs also effective against ranged
@swordsmann
there is no âeffectiveâ way in the standard Grimd Dawn game.
The reason: you cant stack enough reflect damage! So it will never be
sufficient.
Crate made sure of this through the item- and skill-pool, which limits reflect
damage.
If you stack reflect damage in the main Grim Dawn game high enough, most ranged normal mobs will
die more or less quickly, but certain main storyline bosses will still be a pain in the ass.
A good, viable retalliation-reflect build would be possible, but Crate decided
against it.
kind regads Arkon
ps. I played one with BIS-gear (reflect and retalliation). It only worked well, when I used a third partyprogram to boost my reflect damage considerably (more then three times)