[1.0.0.4] 100 Twin Falls runs

Grim Dawn Gameplay Discussion
1

Hello everyone,

first of all thank you for your feedback!
This is the updated version of my results of 2x 100 Twin falls farming runs.
After I posted the results of the first 100 runs, several people posted a different version of the run, that appears to be more effective. That lead to my doing the 100 runs for the new route.

The idea was to…
…gather somewhat reliable data to be able to rate a farming run at this current patch
…keep the effort to do so as low as possible to A: sustain the fun and B: to make it more likely that someone else decides to gather data too to compare the results :wink:

Please be aware, that the runs were completed by my unfinished pyromancer, so your per hour - averages could vary quite a bit. The per run-averages should be comparable though.

So here they are:

100 Twin Hive runs (with tower)


my average time (out of 10): 151s

100 Twin Hive runs (without tower)


my average time (out of 10): 102s

  • As you can see, the run that is including the tower averages a significant higher average of heroes & bosses per run. However a lot more important is the slightly higher average of heroes & bosses per hour on the tower run, which in the end leads to a higher average rate of legendary drops.
  • While going through these runs I encountered a huge variety in drop luck. I had 30 runs without a single legendary and 12 runs with 8.
  • In addition, the numbers might not be 100% reliable due to the still fairly low number of total runs. With 200-300 runs, the absolute numbers would be a better representation of the actual drop rates.

According to these results, the Twin Falls run that is including the tower seems to be the better option out of the two.

Route with tower:
A -> C

Route without tower:
B -> C

A:

get.php?id=11833&stc=1&d=1469132729815×511

B:

get.php?id=11837&stc=1&d=1469134012844×534

C:

get.php?id=11834&stc=1&d=1469132729823×519

[i]Thank you for reading through the results - as always, any feedback is appreciated!

If you are interested in the excel-files or an “excel-blueprint” to test a farm route on your own, feel free to let me know.[/i]

Good luck and have fun everyone :slight_smile:

ORIGINAL POST:

Hey there,

first of all, please excuse potential spelling/grammar mistakes as English is not my mother tongue.

When I read Flying Potato’s thread about 60 Cronleys runs I was interested in how it would compare to my Twin Falls run - so I documented 100 runs and this are the results:

  • Start: Twin Falls rift -> fastest way south east to the Swarming Hive entrance -> Exit the session after finishing the Swarming Hive
  • I focus on killing heroes/bosses only and all the trash mobs that sometimes block the narrow paths
  • I pick up all materials and everything green and above

get.php?id=11807&stc=1&d=1468961880893×57

  • The per hour calculation is based on the average time (out of 10 runs) of 1:42
  • This time does only include the run, starting with the teleport to the rift and ending upon exiting the session after the Swarming Hive clear

I know that an average out of 100 runs might not be a totally accurate representation of the drop rates. With 200-300 runs the results would be quite a bit more reliable.
However I didn’t feel like continuing today, I’ll update the post when I get another decent number of results.

Any feedback is appreciated :smiley:

Good luck out there!
Have fun :slight_smile:

Attachment: Twin Hive runs.jpg
Attachment: Twin Hive 1.jpg
Attachment: Twin Hive 2.jpg
Attachment: TF.jpg
Attachment: Twin Hive tower 1.jpg
Attachment: Twin Hive tower 2.jpg
Attachment: Twin Falls Path.jpg
Attachment: Twin Falls Hive Summary.PNG
Attachment: twin hive results with tower.jpg
Attachment: Twin Hive tower 1.jpg
Attachment: Twin Hive tower 2.jpg
Attachment: twin hive results without tower.jpg
Attachment: Twin Hive without tower.jpg

2

Nice data! Always good to see these things.

Of course this data is/will be compared to Flying Potato’s 1.0.0.3 data of 75 runs (http://www.grimdawn.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38582)… So a couple of questions.

What build did you use?
So your route cut right to the hive, correct? You did not go around the tower in the west and then down to the hive? The tower area has a lot of heroes as well.

It appears, if you’re not going around the tower, that you’re clear speed is slower (no disrespect, just stating a fact based on the data). Everyone’s clear speed is going to be different, so a per run comparison may be more useful. You’re average of 10 runs of 1:42 is a little “faster” than Flying Potato’s average of 75 at 105 seconds (1 minute 45 seconds) but he included the tower. He also averaged 1.5 more heroes per run, which could be accounted for in going around the tower.

If you are going to do more runs, I would be interested in seeing how many more heroes (and loot) you would run into going around the tower and if the extra time was worth it (again, this may be different for different people better/worse clear speeds). With the increased drop rate in 1.0.0.4 I was expecting higher per run results than Flying Potato, but yours are lower… I think it is because of the heroes that you’re cutting out by not going around the tower. Could still just be random variation is sample sizes of 75 and 100… But those do seem decent enough…

What dropped the rare mat?

Thanks again for sharing!

3

I’ve been doing these runs with an unfinished life leech version of the Brimstone Gunslinger Pyromancer.

This is the route I took:


I’m also not a fan of the “per hour” number. As you said it will vary heavily depending on your build. I only included it because I was interested in it myself aswell as I thought some might ask for it. Also I was not trying very hard to be as fast as I could, just farming and gathering stats while listening to audiobooks. Just as I would farm normally.

The rare mat was dropped by one of the heroes that spawn just southwest of the Twin Falls Rift - I believe it was a boar-type enemy.
I too was surprised how low the rates were - however I felt rather unlucky on that day, compared to the drops I got on other days.
The sample sizes of 75/100 may sound like a lot but as I was logging the data, even in the end the numbers still shifted a lot. So I guess with 200-300 runs we’d get some more accurate results.
Maybe I will try out the run that’s including the tower.

4


I usually take this route through TF. I highlighted in yellow the area that typically has several heroes.

First time trying to attach a picture…hope it works…

Oh, it did work…after I copied the thumbnail from the post…hmmm…

Anyways, I’m not sure my route is the same as flying potato, sounds like he might skip the skeletons and go back to the hive via the steps. I usually spawn the skeletons and maybe 1/5 times there is a hero too then I kill it, else just keep running through the false wall. The area though is probably still similar but times are going to be different.

Per run is a better comparison for 1.0.0.3, but time is important if you were comparing to a Cronley run…that you did… So both can still be important…

5

Thank you for your input. This is now pretty much the same route that I’m on to right now:


Only 12 runs in it appears to be a far superior route - the most remarkable number is the minimum of 8 heroes that I’m currently at, with the average sitting at around 8,3.

As soon as I have enough data gathered I’ll share the results - may take some time though :wink: :smiley:

edit: 30 runs in I’m at around 235 heroes and only 2 legendaries - I guess my RNG-luck is horrible…

6

Awesome! That tower area usually has 2-6 heroes, so I do think it makes a big difference! Good luck and look foreword to the results!

7

Many thanks for the data collected, i pretty sure Potato appreciate someone help him :slight_smile:

I have made this runs, but for now, i prefer BOC first level for the mats and trove and high chance of mats on boss.

8

Thanks for the data. It pretty much proves what I had suspected. Wasps are no good for legendaries!

9

It seems like I’ve started a trend! I’m really grateful that someone else has started recording data - let the discussion begin!

So, it seems to me that you’ve had some seriously bad RNG - do you exit the game completely every x number of runs? I don’t know if it has any effect on the RNG, I just know that back in TQ, a certain data gatherer (ClosetChemist) would exit every 10 runs to reset the game’s seed. Either way, better safe than sorry in my eyes.

My route is different to both of the suggested (although inside the hive it’s the same):

This just felt intuitive to me, as well as getting through the run quickly and killing the maximum number of wasps.

I know you aren’t a fan of including a rate, and I can agree on that, but let me explain to you why I do:

Since I’ve now done 4 different paths, all with the same character and mostly the same gear, it’s very easy to compare the runs by just looking at the rate of legendaries per hour (or whatever it is you want to farm). Now that someone else has joined the data scene (yay!), it obviously makes things a little… interesting. However, if you take 102 seconds and I take 105 seconds, and someone who is interested only takes 90 seconds, they can calculate the approximate rate for themselves using a calculation:

(Runner’s time / their time) * rate = their rate

Also, I do find it a nice summary of the data - for example, 4.38 heroes per run… but how many heroes is that per hour, per minute? Personally, I find that a rate sums up the data nicely, even if it does vary for each person. Having said that, I can definitely see your point of view.

Another random thing to note (which I also neglected to note when I did these runs): If you are using the in-game “Heroes and Bosses” stat on your character page 3 to calculate the heroes you’ve killed per x runs (I do a before, after, and let excel work it out :slight_smile: ), then I’d remember that the Wasp Queen would also be included, and I believe she drops a Grand Spoils instead of Heroic Spoils. In my later runs (Cronley’s, and eventually BoC first floor), I’ve separated it so the viewer knows that Heroes just means heroes :slight_smile: You may have already done this, I’m just putting it out there to clarify I guess.

I think, since people are referring to it, I’ll just put my summary of TF data here in case anyone wants to compare from a glance. Just note that it was done in 1.0.0.2, before they buffed drop rates from heroes, and was 75 runs in total:

Thank you very much for recording your own data - I’d love a whole community of people who record and compare their data, and the more that is collected, the more reliable and useful the data is!

10

I think part of it was he was skipping all the heroes around the tower… that will definitely cut into the loot that is dropped…

My route is different to both of the suggested (although inside the hive it’s the same):

This just felt intuitive to me, as well as getting through the run quickly and killing the maximum number of wasps.

I thought you might just go down the stairs… So you skip the heroes in the middle? There aren’t usually anything mobs between the cart choke point and the stairs, and some times a skeleton hero spawns by the false wall, which is why I run back up through there and that lets me into the middle area where more heroes usually are. Course that adds more time… Time is a big factor in efficacy…

I know you aren’t a fan of including a rate, and I can agree on that, but let me explain to you why I do:

Since I’ve now done 4 different paths, all with the same character and mostly the same gear, it’s very easy to compare the runs by just looking at the rate of legendaries per hour (or whatever it is you want to farm). Now that someone else has joined the data scene (yay!), it obviously makes things a little… interesting. However, if you take 102 seconds and I take 105 seconds, and someone who is interested only takes 90 seconds, they can calculate the approximate rate for themselves using a calculation:

(Runner’s time / their time) * rate = their rate

Suppose that saves a step instead of doing 5.81 hero per run/90 seconds per run60 seconds per minute60 minutes per hour… :):smiley:

Also, I do find it a nice summary of the data - for example, 4.38 heroes per run… but how many heroes is that per hour, per minute? Personally, I find that a rate sums up the data nicely, even if it does vary for each person. Having said that, I can definitely see your point of view.

What I was trying to say that comparing his TF run vs your TF run, the “per run” is more important.

I think you touched on this above, but the critical reason to include a per “x time” is when comparing runs from two different locations. Like your Cronley run is similar “per run” with 5.4 heroes compared to 5.8 of your TF…but “per Hour” it is 199 for TF but only 105 for Cronley as the Cronley is significantly longer run.

Both the per run and the per hour rates are good to have! It is all about what you’re comparing the data too though… :smiley:

11

You’re right - recording all the data actually lead to me enjoying the farm runs again! It’s nice to “make sense” of all the randomness :wink:

I’ve read about that somewhere in this forum and it would be great to have some clarification on this.
For the 100 runs without the tower I didn’t exit the game regulary. During the 100 runs with the tower I exited every now and then.

I get that it’s useful to compare runs for yourself if done with the same character and build :slight_smile:
However everyone could also just take the absolute number of Legendaries/run and multiply it with their own run-time in s / 3600.
Your way however seems to be the easier one to do the math - so I agree with that :smiley:

Also, I do find it a nice summary of the data - for example, 4.38 heroes per run… but how many heroes is that per hour, per minute? Personally, I find that a rate sums up the data nicely, even if it does vary for each person. Having said that, I can definitely see your point of view.

Thank you for mentioning that. I however did count the heroes manually. This way I didn’t fall asleep aswell as it gave a nice feeling of progression throughout the runs :wink:
Still I didn’t differentiate between The Queen “boss” and all of the “heroes” regarding the drops/spawns. This leads to the numbers not being 100% representative of the drop rate per hero due to the lootdrop of the queen being different, as you mentioned.

12

I have now updated my results in the initial posts.

(Is there a way, to change the title of this thread ?)

13

I don’t have time for a long reply but I will quickly say that I have definitely encountered heroes in that area, and it does seem to be pretty damn quick in general. Of course, one could always do some more in-depth tests but I think that so long as one loops around the tower, one will encounter most of the wasp heroes.