Guide to Making Guides

Grim Dawn Classes, Skills and Builds
29

I do not have a video in my guide at all. I like my guide. I broke down the leveling in it from the get go. Later I was asked to breakdown my Devotion. I typed it out for someone step by step how to do it.

I have changed my guide up a little, but I do not think it needs to be the way the OP wants it. I do not mind clear times in guides. It is not a bragging point, it shows what it is capable of. Videos are not mandatory for every guide. Level a character to 20 and see how it is playing, you either like the playstyle or you do not. I leveled a Witchblade to 34 and decided that it was not for me at that time. I leveled an Occultist to 28 and decided I did not like pets.

Until you play a character build, you have no idea if you will even enjoy it.

I view guides as a way to see what can be done with a character. For me, it does not have to have a video but it does need to be clear and concise with what the guide can do. I played WoW for years and guides usually just had details with rotations. I did not need a video.

30

I get both sides.

I know what your saying Oaktree, some builds are meant for fun, everyone plays differently and has a type of playstyle they prefer. But I do agree with what jajaja is saying.

I have seen before on these games when people follow a build without any proof of it being strong in terms of clearing content affectivly and it just puts them off the game when they can’t. People should post info of what there builds is about and if it lacks in areas then people should know because you can make a title as amazing as you want but it doesn’t change the build.

31

Then again, there is a difference between being crit and being crit while your resistances are lowered… what happen if your resistances are already not at max by default? Futhermore, it depends what type of build you do, in the senns if your close range or not and/or melee because your gameplay will be along the line of the build.

For exemple, with my CT build i have with the proc from my rings (Judicator’s Signets) :

  • 2440 DA
  • 1347 armor
  • 9147 health
    That’s with my current gear.

Against Fabius, without the ring it’s a Nightmare, with them i can tank quite a lot. Against Iron Maiden, he hits hard like a truck, harder than Fabius. Than again I guess with a bit more Armor he might become easier (although Aegis relic didn’T seem to help much to be honest (yes I tried that), hence why I will eventually farm him again to get his shoulder with the right affixes. I mean, this Nemesis, when he hit hard, he take off about half my health. That’s considering I use Maiven’s Sphere and the augment from the kymons + the transmuter from Black water cocktail which reduce ennemies physical damage.

For your information with he Aegis Relic i have (proc included) :

  • 2557 DA
  • 1559 Armor
    Since I didn’t saw much of a difference then when I use Agrivix’s Malice, I keep the latter one.

I just wanna say that I killed a lot the Nemesis, but mainly on my Sorceror Ct build.

32

Probably why you want so much DA. :smiley: I always get at least 11k on melee builds, and CT is effectively a melee build.

33

I understand health can help, but I would need at least 12-14k to feel a real difference, especially when Iron Maiden hits hard. I mean, in softcore I used to stay more in close range untill I was pretty close to die. In hardcore if my health go fast down too quick I back off and/or kite more.

That being said, for now I can’t afford having more health. :stuck_out_tongue:

34

Please jajaja, just please… It’s painful to look at you right now.

I got your logic here:

You are devoted to help others to optimize their builds, that’s marvelous. Then why are you comparing a Lightning Warder’s killing time to your Physical + Bleeding Witchblade’s? Is that what you called an objective measuring? Shouldn’t you go try to build a better Lightning Warder but with a more optimized style and then tell him what he did wrong?

And look at your constructive inputs here on Squib’s Retaliation Warder:

You indeed helped us to make this build more efficient and fun to play.

Your build’s titles are just the same clickbaits as other people marketed that you dislike. If you really want to help devs to balancing the game, why not share some TSS build or Vitality builds with us? You did not, because you have to name the thread like “1-2 mins Fabius kill etc”, and that’s not “fun” FOR YOU. You ask devs why they nerfed Falcon Swoop and Static Strike while you build several builds based solely on them, what would you expect? If you actually helped (like you claimed) other people to optimize TSS / Vitality / Reflect builds, maybe devs will see how underpowered these builds are and actually give them a buff.

This is Internet and I am not smart, but even I know efficiency is not necessarily fun.

P.S. Dear moderator, I am not flame baiting or trolling, but please go and delete this if you think it’s inappropriate.

35

i like how u conveniently cut out the rest of my quote where i compliment his build’s ability to fight loxmere on HC. also in case u haven’t noted the smiley, the phrase was said half jokingly.

i have made builds around winterking - nerfed, belgothian carnage + ss - nerfed, falconswoop - nerfed. did i complain about any of these? no, because they were infact op. i only complain about static strike because it isn’t op. if anything stormhearts are mildly op but this is besides the point.

i’ve stated very clearly, i post here mostly for self entertainment, its fun for me to find effective builds thats why i don’t post underpowered ones. i’m not here to help everyone improve their build/farm faster or help devs make the game better. i’m simply doing whats fun for me. and pointing out things in certain builds that don’t quite make sense is something i like to do - and sometimes people prove me wrong and i’m happy to eat my words, just ask Ceno.

i only compared my witchblade kill time becasue its not a bleed build, its a straight forward LMB build similar to that other guys, who claims he has 120k dps or something and end up killing sharzul alot slower, it didn’t make sense to me so i think it was a highly inflated/misleading number with transient procs etc. thats why i pointed it out.

like you said, its the internet. if you hate me this much, don’t read my guides or my posts or hell, report them. whatever man.

36

They aren’t difficult to find… and these below are just comments specifically from people sharing their builds, this doesn’t include the rest of your douchebaggary that was out there. These are people who found enjoyment to share their builds with the community, much like it’s fun for you to share yours.

belittle: make (someone or something) seem unimportant.

Your own logic defeats you…You say you do not belittle and in the same post you say “so what its the internet lol”.

Adding a compliment to belittling is nothing more than a back-handed compliment. It’s like being a douchebag in real life and saying it’s ok as long as you smile.

I’m trying but nothing going on on the receiving end.

37

seriously OakTree, you take most of my comments completely out of context or take part of a post.

many of these are IN RESPONSE to people throwing offensive comments at me first, i.e. the guy calling everyone a retard who doens’t believe in chariot.

considering many of ur whole 9 post history are spent here making personal insults i.e. “belittling” me. i’m not going to argue anymore with a hypocrite. i’m sure you are contributing to these forums in much more meaningful ways than me;)

38

You asked me show you quotes and I did. I went beyond that to show you in this thread alone how you were doing the very things you claimed you were not and justifying it because “its the internet”. If I’m a hypocrite, then me and you are in the same club pal.

39

This is getting a little silly.

The ostensible purpose of the OP was to encourage guide writers to include more helpful information set forth in a clear and visually pleasing manner in order to assist guide followers. This would mean including oft skipped items such as leveling guides and clarity on devotion pathing and linking.

I’ve hardly ever seen someone respond to a guide and complain that it is too OP and wish that it was harder to kill mobs. It’s almost always the opposite (I kill too slow, die too much, etc.) I would think most people would like to know about options to either increase DPS without sacrificing defense or the converse.

It seems based on some recent comments that any sort of negative opinion on a guide or its choices is out of bounds, because maybe inefficiency is intended or whatever. I mean, I just commented on a Primal Strike guide that maxed Feral Hunger and Upheaval, is it better to remain silent and let new players follow it because maybe the OP intended to waste the points to make the build more challenging. Or along the same lines, is opining that certain skills and devotions are not particularly good (like the prebuffed Chariot) outside the bounds of reasonable discourse–I don’t think so.

40

I think basically your point is that he belittles builds.
His point is, he only calls out certain parts of the build he thinks is dumb, the “dumb stuff”, so he’s not actually belittling the build, just certain aspects of it.

Maybe I’m wrong though lol.

41

agree 100%.

while there’s nothing wrong with someone wanting to play in a challenging way, newbies looking at guides want to know how to play a certain build in an effective manner, not the opposite. they already have trouble with the game due to not having gear.

not every build needs to kill as fast as a blademaster but they should be reasonably optimized within their own capabilities.

whats fun for the reader isn’t for the op to decide is the for the reader to decide and i’m betting most people don’t have fun getting owned.

if people cannot handle negative feedback they shouldn’t post here, because feedback is what they are gonna get when they post a guide. we are not in kindergarten here, not everyone is a princess and not every build lives happily ever after. if the onlything they can accept is newbies praising their build and worshipping them, they are in the wrong place.

If the worst thing you see me do is make fun of certain parts of a build. you should really see the kind of personal attacks people do to me here lol. calling me arrogant, poser, retarded etc etc. you don’t see me go crying to a mod lol.

42

Don`t worry jajaja, you are one of best if not the best guide maker out here. I really enjoying reading your guides. :cool: Just hope to see more hc related builds in the future, like phy. warder or cadence witchblade :wink:

43

But aren’t those basically the same difference. Personally I don’t care as I am sure I have had way more posts deleted then he has (I’m a dick so it’s not my fault :cool: )

The rest of this has nothing to do with what I quoted :slight_smile:

I just don’t get why people get so worked up about other peoples builds. I mean the whole point of giving you choices in how to build your character is so that not every character ends up the same.
Now if people specifically ask for help in making their build better, then by all means go for it.
I’ve always just used the skills I enjoy, and try to combine them in different ways. I don’t give a shit that people don’t like TSS, or they think Blood Rite is trash. I was using CT long before Most made it cool. (As Lightning Nova just wasn’t cutting it in Ultimate in B29 so I switched my LN builds to CT) I have many chaos based Sigil builds even tho Vitality is just stronger.
Just do you and let others do themselves. There’s plenty of ways to make builds, not all of them will be good in your eyes or mine. But who gives a shit, I mean how does it really effect you.

44

There is nothing wrong in criticizing a build and offering some construtive feedback to aid the OP to optimize his build, but if you’re gonna drop sarcastic, witty or provocative remarks like “can you fight a real boss without 100 consumables tho?”, don’t expect the build creator to take your feedback in a construtive way, as chances are you’re trying to arbitrary mock the build and trying to provoke a reaction from the OP.

45

it doesn’t affect me. im here to have fun, and speaking my mind on this forum when i free like it is fun for me. i don’t feel the need to be a carebear about my comments and nor do i except so from others in stuff i post.

are u seriously saying that no one should say any negative comment in a build thread? that the only form of comments allowed are compliments?
no one is saying u can’t play the game the way u want, but if u post a guide here, ur opening urself up for comments, good or bad, that’s the whole point.

sure, i talk in a “nicer” fashion when the build writer isn’t acting like his build is some second coming of christ. look when you title your build like “INVINCIBLE 100K+ DPS TANK CANNON” in all caps, and if you can’t really back it up in your gameplay vids. then someone just might leave a sarcastic comment.

and in general my comments whether sarcarstic or nice, are directed at a portion of the build. i don’t make attacks on people.

You wanna see some of the negative “feedback” i’ve gotten in my guides on the titling convention alone?

do you see me crying to the moderators? no, cuz im not a 15yr old princess. i don’t give a shit. you post stuff on the internet, some people will like it and some won’t and they are free to speak their mind. get used to it.

and thanks to whoever is supportive of me, glad your enjoying the builds.

46

Thought this was supposed to be a guide or something. Why for the last 4 pages has it been almost exclusively arguing over whether or not one person respects another person’s builds? Seriously, when you’re criticized you have two reasonable options: you take it into consideration or you ignore it. Getting into some pissing contest over it is completely pointless.

47

Well, this thread has completely devolved into something completely unintended. I was gonna chill out and redo the guide at a lazy hour at work but boy now it is almost completely unnecessary.

I’d like to completely overlook the unnecessary name calling about how certain build/guide writers go to other builds/guides and criticize them, because the inherent problem lies with the fact there is a difference between a build and a guide.

A build is a package of gear, attributes, skills, and devotions to make a certain type of gameplay viable and/or fun. A guy posting a build can just say [BUILD] on the title and not explain why and what he did to make the build. Because that’s the point of his post, he’s not there to help you how to find out how he got there and why he made certain choices.

A guide on the other hand is a reasonably well reasoned explanation of a build. It has to provide pertinent information on the build, and the reasons why it works and/or why the author considers it fun. On the other hand, there are a lot of questions asked about basic information because, let’s face it, guide writers and the rest of the population that has completed the game on Ultimate at least once are a very small minority.

If your guide allows a player to do better at the game, i.e say complete Elite and face Ultimate, then more people are going to play this game longer and they’re going to get their friends to play too. I’m not saying “help the devs by helping the newbies”, but let’s make the game more popular. It is already popular, and I can understand that there are people who ask for a step by step per 10levels leveling guide, which honestly seems a bit extreme for me, but a brief reasonable explanation should be okay right?

To someone who said a WoW guide doesn’t need to have videos and therefore shouldn’t be needed for GD either - sorry but I don’t see why a WoW guide needs a video for explaining rotations. In the end there are maybe 1 or 2 optimized rotation priority lists for a character like say Fury Warrior. But there are dozens of builds for, say a Commando, and the builds have a lot more complexity than a WoW guide, so yes a video is more relevantly important for a GD guide than for a WoW guide. Whether it’s mandatory or not it’s up to you, and I apologize if my guide implied that.

That’s all I’m going to say on the subject. I’ll come up with a v2.0 guide based on some of the reasonable suggestions made by posters in this thread.

To be fair, if the namecalling goes on and on I’d like for this thread to be closed and further, hopefully a more reasonable discussion to be made in another thread.

And yes, no more drunk posting for me :smiley:

48

I think most of the hate is due to this comment:

IMO, while I agree with most of your guide, I think this comment of yours is just stupid. Posting times in title is no different then putting something like “Ultimate Viable” in title. Posting times is just a more accurate way of saying ultimate viable. Ultimate viable is really vague, how viable is viable? Kill times/clear speeds easily answers that while implying the build is ultimate viable at the same time. Also I don’t see how it is egoistical especially when the kill times jajaja for example posts are not even the fastest or best kill times. It’s not like he says his builds are the best ever or anything like that. What other ways are there of objectively stating how good or viable a build is?

tl;dr, kill times in title = same as “ultimate viable” in title, just more accurate.