Having trouble with Nemesis bosses

I don’t think that’s the main issue, though it might also be a little confusing to some people.
The main issue is you have no way to know why you took so much damage.

Probably (haven’t played the game or anything) they have a multiplicative system for resists instead of additive?

why would “the amount” be any more obvious/less vague for players to figure out if it was 50? what makes 50 magically easier to understand than 80? - it’s effectively an arbitrary nr regardless ?
“cap is cap; get cap”

Oh yes that is an issue too, but that won’t be solved by a different res system.
Although to be honest, most damage types have very clear colours and if you died standing in a certain colour, and the res related to that colour is a bit low it isn’t that hard to put two and two together. But someone might need to tell you at some point indeed.

Yeah, it was described in the posts under mine.

“Cap is cap; get cap” is definitely the easiest and best way to go about it
I have found when talking about (math) concepts to people that the easier the numbers are the easier it is to inherently grasp the concept. When your res is at 60% I can see how it feels weird that you are dying. The concept that you take twice as much damage as you should really isn’t that naturally logical to people.

I am grasping at straws here maybe.
My point was sparked by the comment from the LE developers about not dying when your res is a little low. So for some reason those numbers are some sort of an issue.

ps: all not that important. I was just confused and a little annoyed about the LE system pretending to be something different

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that’s not the confusing part tho,
As Bas said, and has been mentioned many times, the issue is feedback; players have 0 idea to know what actually killed them
This is true at 0 res 50 60 80 or 90 res in GD
We have 10 dmg types, 1 which works extra intrinsic, FX is not a clear indicator of what dmg type you receive, in addition to frequency or “sheer onslaught of enemy attacks” aka FX fiesta
When someone is at 60 res or “insert arbitrary not capped value here” we guesstimate that’s the reason they are dying simply because it’s an aspect of defence that can still be stat improved, but in reality we rarely truly actually know why that player died.

Which is why the concept of dmg amount take/“what arbitrary nr is the cap set to” is also largely irrelevant to newer players, because, taking your example, if the cap was set at 50, we would still take the same dmg as now,
Thus no matter what the cap value is dmg taken/mitigated remains the same, nothing changed except the arbitrary value, and most importantly; the feedback remains the same or “not there” so they still wont know what’s going on or what the impact is other than “cap is cap; get cap” - because that’s all we can do/fumbling in the dark we can just follow the wall to guide us

It’s largely the same with other types of stats, even if lesser degree of importance, when we have a chase value, we chase it
speed cap is 200; get 200 speed if you can
Movespeed cap is 135; you try to get 135 movespeed
^(these are actually examples of why Crate devs dislike some stat caps )
DA threshold is 3000; get 3k DA
OA threshold is 3000; get 3k OA
^no one actually question(ed) whether or not it was real or not or necessary or even accurate in usefulness (it’s not), but it’s a fixed nr to either aim for or “must” get
HP, Regen/lifesteal, Armour/absorb, DR etc etc, we have arbitrary min values for almost everything even if the stuff isn’t acting the same direct set value way, we’re always chasing some imaginary values.
Resist just makes it easiest of all because it’s fixed in terms of effectiveness and obtainability, but the nr doesn’t really matter because in either scenario you have to know the chase nr/cap, and you have to get it, wont change anything if it’s 25-50-115, the cap is there, it’s obtainable and game scaled after it; so you get it
(the player must identify the value existing regardless what the value is, and then get said value)

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I reacted to a post mentioning a solution was to change the res system to the one in LE.
I am sure that there are other more pressing problems, like the one Bas mentioned, but I was not reacting to those

You make valid points here, but I was just discussing the res system and how the one in LE is not inherently different from the one in GD.

yeye, just pointing out, changing the value wont change the problem, because the value/value mechanic isn’t the underlying issue or confusion creator

Fair point. I think I might have introduced some noise in my argument.

Regardless. Yes! More feedback!

If resistance system was brilliant as in LE, we would have a fraction of the current “I’m having troubles” reports imo because players wouldn’t take double / triple / quadruple damage because of missing some resists while leveling.

THIS is what I was reacting to
But as I said, that system is just a confusing version of having 43% flat resist.

If GD had only 43% resist it would have the exact same effect on people dying. It would solve the problem of most people dying, probably, because there is less damage incoming (Max 175% vs. max 500% now).
It would not solve the problem Bas brought up because you still would not know what you are dying to (if you died).

Furthermore, having only 43% resist means that Ultimate would be much easier than it is now, especially at lower levels. Right now, being 10-20 percent off is quite an issue and I found it can be quite a puzzle to fix that until you hit level 70 (and revered with some factions).

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devs would just tweak it so the dmg and threat is teh same, and the value wont matter
you’d need to change the entire resist system/formula, not just the nr
tqfan already said LE had 75 res, which is close to GD; but their system doesnt’ work the same, ie it’s not the numerical value that’s the issue

or; if devs want dmg to be dangerous/lethal; it will be so regardless what nr in the res system we use

This is only half true.

We CAN compare LE to GD, but we need to convert, because indeed the systems are different. If we convert we see that they are not close in threat levels at 0% resist at all.
Both seem to be linear resist systems that work exactly the same in the end, but the way they present it looks different. However, because they are the same at their core (as far as I can tell) it is possible to convert the systems to see what the true resist of one game in terms of the other game is.

In GD terms, LE has ≈43% resist.

if you want to convert the other way around:

In LE terms, GD has 400% resist

Assuming both games are tuned to the amount of damage you should take at FULL RESIST (let’s call this “acceptable damage”), there is huge difference between the two.
Because inherently the system in GD allows for characters to take 500% of the acceptable damage (if they have 0% resist), while the system in LE allows for characters to ‘only’ take 175% of the acceptable damage (at 0% resist).

While I agree that ultimately a whole game is scaled around the different systems that make up the game, there is a difference between using 43% resist and 80% resist in the sense that it is much easier to die when not paying full attention to your resists (e.g. having lower resists) with 80% res than it is with 43%.

I also don’t think this should be changed, but getting oneshot is just easier in GD than LE, which I can see could add to the frustration.

I also still agree that the solution would be for the game to be more informative when you die (or take damage).

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i get the math behind your notion, what i’m saying is “this aint it”
it’s a design difference; LE devs don’t want dmg scaling to be letha
GD devs want XY dmg to be dangerous/lethal either/both at max res and without max res
so it’s not as simple as you make it “just cut res cap in 2/3rds”; because that’s making the assumption devs want us to take that not 500% dmg; but they want us to take a crapton of dmg
hence why the entire system would have to change and not just he value, because dmg scaling being dangerous is such a core design of GD’s difficulty/scaling, or as you said

but; “devs don’t want it to be easier

We’re veering off what I was trying to say. It is just a small isolated thing I was trying to discuss

tqFan suggested that the LE system was better. I only wanted to show what the LE system would look like in GD. And I tried to show that values do matter as long as they are in the same system.

I am not assuming anything on the dev’s part, nor am I suggesting this is the solution.
Obviously if the devs wanted a different game they would have made a different game. We can definitely agree on that.

That mofo got me once in HC Ultimate when my lightning wasn’t overcapped-enough. Never again!

Valde doesn’t debuff your res anymore btw
enemy RR stuff was dialed back with the introduction of sunder, so now it’s just Benji traps, Mossi OFF, both susceptible to reducts by CC res, and then ofc Reaper’s ghosts

On my latest character I encountered Kuba quite a few times now (from about level 80ish on I think?), and killed him every time with a healthy combination of attacking and running. Yesterday at level 93 I encountered Valdaran.
Got close to killing him twice, but in the end one annoying combination of abilities got me every time. I decided that the XP loss wasn’t worth it and restarted. I could have tried running past him on the bridge he was standing on I guess.

All in all I must say that I really like the new Nemesis spawn method. At lower levels there is definitely a thrill in something spawning near that is potentially lethal (even if the rest isn’t anymore) and in endgame it is nice to not have to go from spawn point to spawn point to find them.

I always found it funny that Aetherials and Beasts, the two factions you’ll almost certainly hit nem with first, have some of the most inescapable nemeses.