Let me get this straight. People complaining about mode(s) while pushing for changes based upon data of there said modes?
Don’t point at bugs or janky issues. They are not new and have had legitimate attempts to fix them.
An argument could be made where people thought the game was/is complete. Then, from that angle, I stand corrected.
I love new content as much as the next person but would rather see existing systems/issues get solid polish as opposed to another copy paste area/zone, that is of course if this game IS NOT content complete.
All of the large words used to describe CR/SR by the OP —-> . <—- salt grain
I have to agree with you here. SR is very fun, the random factor makes each run seem a bit different. It can be an incredibly frustrating ragequit experience, or a satisfying mauling of enemies. (I will say I can understand the the frustration about the inconsistency for testing purposes). The loot is good too; I just wish the MI’s were a bit more….idk easier to gauge which ones will drop? The next patch will help with affix bias tho so at least there’s that.
No! You? Never! (Kidding ofc I like your write ups, even if I almost never read them completely )
Honestly as a casual hardcore player, i enjoy the story mode alot more than crucible/sr. i only do them because they’re faster to farm high end gear. Crucible is a bit wasted overall because we only do that one smaller arena anyway. SR feels more compelling, if only a bit clunky with the random floor exit spawn mechanic, makes it annoying when you’re trying to speed run, but SR for me is actually engaging since it challenges your build so much.
keep in mind most of this comes from a (very) casual player/pilot
ngl, i wasn’t even “aware” of this until specifically pointed out, with timestamps, years later after i started playing
by aware i mean as a casual player i didn’t notice it specifically even if maybe subconsciously been aware, or otherwise noticing other enemies slightly/more minorly sidestepping melee swings (like the little skeleton feckers doing a weird shuffle)
^this actually goes for a lot of “bad” mechanical/gameplay interactions, easiest mention is the XY wps being poor both compared to other wps or potentially 0 wps replacement
it’s simply just a higher level of play/attention where my "casul"ness simply isn’t spotting it
*that’s not me defending it or saying it’s ok it’s there if XYZ can be fixed or improved, but maybe more pointing out that it’s possible it’s “directly” affecting a number of players much less, thus maybe not the reason ex Crucible isn’t streamed as much.
If i had to guess, from a casual/“avg” player standpoint, Crucible is just a lot harder (for us). Imo, it’s currently the hardest game mode, while also being the most punishing in terms of rewards, which means, flaws/mechanical interactions or impacts aside, it’s just much less incentivized to play it;
and is actually why i hugely appreciate the players that do demonstrate high level of play/builds in it, because otherwise i simply couldn’t tell XY things apart, be it fight interactions, build tweaks/impacts, or ex the AI behaviour(s), tho the last one being least consequential for me ofc.
TLDR, you guys are so good/“too” good at the game, you simply notice things other players don’t, and as result gets impacted more (consciously) by them
i think SR is prime for special stuff
i even earlier/in a different thread suggested to atleast add shattered variants of bosses ealier/on lower shards instead of sr80+
adding additional theme map/gimmick rooms like a shard with “shattered boss onslaught” in addition to ex maggot/kravall/seeker rooms, would be cool
-and i don’t think it would be unfair if those were included, “if players struggle”/complaint, on ex 65 and above, since those are already the SR range where players should expect challenge.
heck i even suggested maybe considering revisiting the idea of linking bosses 2by2 at some point
so further tweaks/additions or considerations to SR as endgame mode and challenge scope/impact i think is good and fitting
*i’m not a high SR climber, i don’t enjoy the raw stat impact of the Death’s Waystone shards/80+, increasing enemy dmg/offence and health by XY is not my idea of fun/challenge, hence why i’m also thinking those/any SR additions or special bonus/gimmick challenge considerations should be applicable to players in the regular end range/65-76 shards
i mean, why are those 2 connected? at all?
endgame is a specific set of activities, usually is for all such games, levelling is merely the (potential) process of reaching endgame
the question that could be posed is whether or not there is any fun in not levelling, but that is probably the very point, to some people levelling is just a time waster/“not their fun”, meanwhile to others levelling is the (main) fun part, and endgame is just a brief pastime
I wonder if there is any game when you just create your char in the main menu, already leveled up, you relocate all the skill points and than put it on rng generated maps to test it? And there is nothing more behind it, just making chars in UI and testing it.
Maybe it would be a fun game for some? Maybe its a great idea for mod for GD? Where so called endgame is basically the game.
most games don’t do that, not because of player service/there wouldn’t be any players not wanting it at all; but because there wouldn’t be any money from it, because it reduces player time needed to play and retention, GD doesn’t have to worry about that since it’s not a live service game or f2p, and devs openly allow modding ofc
but you can see it partially implemented in how various games will let you partially skip or access endgame quicker via level skips/transfer tokens etc; heck even GD does this in vanilla with merits and xp boosters drastically cutting the levelling time down
You are right. The main cancer of game industry for me - game as a service. But that just me, old boommer Good to (still) have GD and D2R to play from time to time.
I think that is the issue of this thread. GD is not a ‘testing simulator’ and I for one certainly don’t want it ‘fixed’ so that it is. “As a min-maxer, I want each run to be identical so I can ensure the maths checks out”…
It’s hard for me to sympathize with these “professional build-testers” and the spirit of this thread. Seems like people that have grown so obsessed with theory-crafting and min-maxing that they’ve made themselves miserable, and in return they want to make everyone else miserable, including the devs.
I don’t level characters, why would I need to do that. I am a build creator, if I had to level characters every time I wanted to test a build I would be never able to learn the game so much/test and create so many builds.
I mean, feedback is always good, and Crate has shown they are willing to hear it, but this thread started with inexcusable language.
There is nothing “dysfunctional” about Crucible. I don’t like that game mode, but I’m aware that it is the way it is because of design decisions that have a reasoning behind them.
I like Grim Dawn and have spent many hours playing it, creating builds or just writing/reading comments. If we talk about end game, FG have expanded that by adding SR, totems and extra dungeon. Can the current state of things be improved? Sure, but I am not sure how it can be done or does it even make sense to touch major concepts at this point. I am sure experienced players have their own vision of how the game modes should look like, and I am no different. Here’s my two cents, but I don’t want to impose my personal view on anybody.
Crucible: game mode I actually like. The thing is, it’s not approachable to most of the players. Or at least not the level of we’re playing, Gladiator 150-170. You have to unlock lots of waves, and dying at any point is detrimental. Since the game mode is balanced around buffs/beacons, it’s hard to sustain tributes if you’re sporadically dying. I would suggest rewarding the player with tokens, upon completing certain waves in Crucible or have vendors selling them for iron instead of costing tributes, every time you want to start at high wave like 150. This way, one death can’t hold you back, but still cost you something. In terms of gameplay, monsters approach to you have always been questionable. Mobs stuck in corners, acrobatic dodges, lack of aggro, etc. If you use the ice beacons, the monsters are just in awe of it and don’t bother chasing you at all. I don’t even know if it’s supposed to work this way, or it’s a bug. If we talk about overhaul or extra waves, I would like to see fast and dangerous foes, without fillers. Not sure if that’s going to work. I also agree with OP about mutators, they don’t make sense in that environment.
SR: game mode based on randomness. Different spawns, maps and mutators makes it fresh. But all of that randomness, it’s hard to balance it properly. Some spawns can make SR quite frustrating or maddening experience. I read, that this is going to be addressed in next patch? I like the boss chunks at current state and like various levels like the tone with switches or the maggots. Furthermore, I would like to 3 chunks per shard, but more unique ones similar to these two.
Fully agree on Cruci part with tokens. I don’t do it that often because a death requires again all that tribute farming that I just give up on a certain point and move back to SR for farming. If we could get tokens by completing x amount of waves etc which would be tradeable between characters, that would be for sure more encouraging.
IMO, Crucible is mostly fine. Sure, there is still a room for improvements, but i still enjoy it.
Shattered Realm, on other hand, is just bad and frustrating.
First, as was mentioned, RNG in monster spawns and their density is far too much. Some areas are too barren, other have environmental damage without any increase in monster density or something else to compensate, etc.
Second, it takes far too long to get to higher shards on a new character. It’s just a very long and boring grindfest to get to SR 60+, where the real challenge begins.
Third, there is no epic loot after SR80+, only puns. I know that SR80+ main goal is a d*ck-measuring contest, but that doesnt mean you should leave players without loot whatsoever.
Fourth, why in the seven hells we receive loot only for the last 2 chunks? The longer the run, the more loot should player receive in the end. Just like in Crucible, or campain.
Fifth, why do mutators never change in SR? That’s absolutely silly.
Sixth, why buff shrines require that expensive materials for that little buff, and inflict penalties as well?
And so on. To me, SR is just a very big failure.
I like to level up my builds from scratch in GD. First it’s because campain is pretty good, and second it’s because it allows me to better understand said build and get used to it. I dont mind using cheat sometimes to get a mandatory epic/legendary for my build that doesnt drop despite farming for days, changing a secondary mastery because i feel it isnt as good for the build as i initially thought, or even getting an extra 100 Ugdenbloom or Chtonic Seals of Binding, that are nothing but frustrating to grind, but are required in massive quantities for crafting. I just try not to overdo it, because i know that when things come too easily, they dont bring enough enjoyment either. There should be a balance in all things.
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Good to (still) have GD and D2R to play from time to time.