Slightly curious Ceno if you have made a pet build as well? As a first character without the use of a shared stash?
My own personal issue with this thread (not disagreeing or agreeing) is simply looking at the provided guide and the items listed in which case there are a lot of what I deem to be wasted stats if relying on just pets which generally isn’t the case with other builds that are on the forums.
Searching Gracefuldusk item database there seems to be only like 21 or so pure pet base items (player defensive stats + pet stats without player offensive stats) and this counts duplicates from faction gear.
4 augments and 1 potion.
There just isn’t nearly enough support for a pure pet build as chances are there are some other random stats that aren’t useful thrown in for some reason.
Are pet hybrid builds popular? Do they make sense in using or are they too much of a sacrifice when trying to juggle two completely different offensive stats. What is the purpose of a pet build and how is it’s design intended when it comes to itemization/devotion? Devotion constellations/skills also have this oddity as well when it comes to promoting hybrid pet builds.
Personally I can see the frustration in trying to acquire pet gear when generally you have unwanted stats pinned on said gear, lack of gear in general (1 feet item for pets with empowered version, 2 gloves, 2 pants, 2 belts with one empowered version, 2 shields, just a few examples within rare/epic/legendary search), and prefixes/suffixes that also either have unwanted stats combined with pet stats or are completely lacking in some item categories (Head has just 2 at high levels, Shoulders 0, Chest 3, Gloves 0, Legs 0, Feet 0 - and the Head/Chest affixes aren’t promoting pure pet builds either).
Again the Hidden Path should hopefully promote pet builds a bit more but in general the combination of player offensive stats and pet stats on items while having cunning/spirit not effect pets at all has always been a bit of a concern to me and having a lack of items that just benefit the player defensively and pets can be a bit frustrating to see.
Took one to ~65 2/3rds through Elite without shared stash usage. Stopped because I got bored with the build itself because pet builds aren’t really my cup of tea, not because I started using the shared stash. I didn’t consider loot drop frequency to be especially different from any other class styles. I generally play every character self-found until I reach 85 (assuming I get it that far), then I’ll start sharing stuff around between characters. If I take anything along the way it’ll be a component for a Devotion Shrine.
How can you disagree with someone’s statement about loot drops for a pet based build when you only have made 1 character and haven’t even gotten it to 85 then?
For that matter I wonder how many other people disagree without touching on a pet build…
And I’m not intending to be harsh in my comments - just that I don’t respond to threads should I not have the relative experience with what is being discussed.
From my other large post and looking at the item database it is rather now clear to me that pet builds seem to be lacking in direction both itemization wise and devotion wise.
I am confused as to whether pets are meant to be used simply by themselves or with player offensive skills as well. If the former that isn’t quite supported by itemization/devotion. If the latter then I can see how itemization is as it is.
Ok, I’m going to try to be as civil and polite as I can, because I think there are a few things about the game that you’ve misunderstood, and while I’m still not convinced that you got absolutely nothing, not as in poor quality, but absolutely nothing as you’ve claimed, I can see well enough that you seem frustrated, so I’ll try not to antagonize you by (much more) finger pointing.
It came across as an attempt to skew the numbers in your favor by citing that it took 800 of anything for 100 crafts, they took different mats, and out of 100 attempts, you didn’t try to get 1 scepter out of 100 tries, so when your claim turned out to be that vague and perhaps fallacious at first glance, any further statements were much less credible than they might otherwise deserve. People exaggerate when they get frustrated, if that’s your case, I apologize for accusing you for the worse.
Also, that mace? Black Hand of Sanar’Siin? It’s an epic, not a legendary. So unless you got to the legendary smith before lvl50, you’d never get it crafted from him. I mean, legendary blacksmith, yes? Do I have to be more explicit than that?
4 drops out of 500, people might sympathize and offer to help, 4 drops out of 40,000? Not only will people find that unbelievable, but when you -swore- that it was a fact? Yeah…no. You were trying to present numbers to players who have logged up to over a thousand hours played in this game, so when you exaggerate, you aren’t likely to get away with it. And thus far just about all posters have reacted with doubt to your claim on the numbers, so yeah, I’m sorry but would you expect others to not call you out on your “fact?” You were just declaring that your 40,000 was an irrefutable fact a couple posts ago, do you now understand why you aren’t getting much support?
No, you misunderstood. That 2M bits isn’t all I had, that’s the leftover after repeated runs, as in, your iron bits will only accumulate the more you farm. I’ve used far more than 7.5M from crafting and salvaging already. And unless you cheat, there are only a couple efficient ways of “legitimately” farm, trove/smith is one, nemesis is another.
No that wasn’t your data and that wasn’t the point either, but for anyone who could read the numbers it was obvious that the drop rate on mats in terms of time invested versus result was better than anything else in the game. So like I said, one of the best farming runs is to do the forgotten god trove, which gets you nearly 1 blood/brain/heart per run, and you’d also come across several spawn spots that might have various boss packs to kill for additional loot. That’s how you farm those rare mats much faster than any other methods, and you’d also earn more than enough iron to fuel the legendary crafting. Unlike what you’ve kept insisting, trove runs aren’t meant to directly farm legendaries, it’s a bonus if you get one to drop, but the main point is to get fast rare mats and iron for crafting.
So when you first stated that you got over 100 legendaries via the blacksmith, and then appeared to have no idea on how or why trove/smith run was done, it left few possibilities: either you were using some other vastly inefficient farm routes for the blacksmith, which could be the source of your frustration, or you could be cheating without actually doing the runs.
Btw, I may have a different concept of fun, but my pet build is nearly decked out in BiS while you are here lamenting over poor loot table, so…maybe others and I with decked out characters did something right and RNG isn’t being difficult to just you or your build? Food for thought.
And there it is. I’m not trying to insult you here, but yeah, I farmed “legit” to get everything I have from the blacksmith, so when I asked you those questions previously, I was trying to determine whether you were “doing it wrong” or just cheated to get stuff. As your answers got increasingly dodgy and vague, I had to consider if you were just being intentionally dishonest. FWIW, I don’t care if someone cheats in a single player game, but I react strongly to attempts to lie about it and pretending to be legit. Maybe that wasn’t your intention, but your posts didn’t put you in a better light. The exaggerations on the numbers, the vagueness on how you utilized the blacksmith, and the constant usage of “legitimate” all pointed to a guilty conscience. Once again, maybe you had no intention to do any of that, but on a forum where your words are the only way for others to perceive you, they were poorly presented and perhaps horribly misleading on your character.
Well, that’s the thing. Remember that I linked all the possible prefixes and suffixes on a ring? Same deal for any other piece of equipment. Also, there are 15 classes in the game, each with more than one possible build, and they all have relevant gears too. So you are talking about odds that are massively in your disfavor here. Out of all the possibilities, you want an exact combination or a specific drop, and you think the RNG is poor because you couldn’t get what you want on a single class of a particular build? Does that sound reasonable? You should make a case that the loot drop in this game is inferior to D3’s smart drops, although I think a lot of people will disagree on that, too.
Yeah it sucks to not get what you want, but take a look at the trading threads on the forum, it should be absolutely clear that you aren’t the only one not getting what you want. Some people prefer to farm, some trade, and others cheat. I’ve tried to explain it to you several times. Clearly you aren’t meant to play and pray to RNG, or maybe you are simply used to D3’s smart drop, so this RNG feels particularly brutal and unforgiving to you.
Also, it just sounds odd that you think the RNG fails a specific build, as if the game innately discriminates a class/build with regards to drops, which happens to be yours, no less. I mean, out of your collection of 120 legendaries, how many are BiS for another build? Does that mean RNG favor it much more than your pet build? Have you played the wrong class?
Well, I guess this is where our play style differs. We follow the same build, and I didn’t get all the BiS in one fell swoop, yet my HC alt is still alive…? My advise in that regard is to get revered with factions, buy writs, and make another character, preferably a build that has some legendaries waiting.
Wow…uh, I mean absolutely no offense here, and I’m just a layman compared to your level of expertise, but surely with your education you would understand RNG better than anyone else in this thread? So why are a bunch of average posters disagreeing with your experience and calling you out on your numbers? For that matter, you could definitely impress the crowd if you do an advanced statistical test to show the likelihood of getting a specific drop, like that Subjugator’s Ruby Ring of Meditation you’ve got on ya.
Um, I don’t know about you, but I practically dedicated years of my life to D2, I find it hard to believe that you didn’t spam meph runs for loot, and that’s mostly D2 vanilla. Baal/cow for LoD, anyone?
Dude, do I have to type in all caps for it to kick in? You’ve got 120 legendaries as you stated earlier, you probably have several future characters who don’t even -need- to get drops! Check your items, browse all the builds that catch your eyes, and hopefully you’ll have much more fun the second time around.
Because I haven’t noticed any irregularities relative to the item progression of other builds. And looking on gracefuldusk, I would not expect that experience to change in the final 10 (item)levels; in fact, there seem to be more higher-level pet gear than midrange pet gear.
What I think both you and Tarkus are neglecting, DeMasked, is the point that others in this thread have been trying to make. An item that drops does not need to be a ‘pet item’ for it to be an upgrade on a pet build. If I got Divinesteel Hauberk to drop and I was formerly using some Faction pet chestpiece, you bet your ass I’d make the swap to DH. You take what you get in this game, and if you do, it’ll help you get more stuff that may be more applicable to your character. (DH may be a bad example because it’s actually pretty OK for pets. :/)
You know how many Fire items I’ve taken on Cold characters, for instance? If this is a problem with pet builds progressing, its a problem with the progression of all characters, and I don’t especially see many complaints.
Perhaps you haven’t noticed any irregularities because you only made 1 pet build?
As I stated before. I am merely looking at the design goal of whether a player should be going for a pure pet build or a hybrid pet build because the former isn’t supported that much and most pet builds on the forum (if not all) are pure pet builds using items that don’t fully support such a build.
It’s the overall design that I am wondering about.
Your Divinesteel Hauberk fully supports a build that utilizes Ulzuin’s Wrath/Fighting Spirit. While with many pet items/affixes that isn’t the case as usually it will have some sort of % damage for the player and then pet stats after.
Can you make a pure pet build that has just pet stats and if needed player defensive stats without player offensive stats? Is such a thing supported?
As for other itemization concerns there is just the probability in getting pet stats on gear being either low or non existent. Leggings for example if you search the database you can easily find stats that support any other damage types more so then pets which is for the most part non existent except 2 items (epic/legendary) and zero affixes. Gloves? 2 items that’s it and zero affixes. Boots? Rifthound leather boots / empowered version and zero affixes.
All these categories support other damage types infinitely more and that is what I’m ultimately talking about.
Using a fire item for a cold based build is easier to do so and of far more use since you can have OA, Spirit, Cunning, % Total Damage, Procs, Defensive Stats and so forth while with a Pet build having any relevant Player offensive stats is generally a waste should you be going for just pets - there is a finer line for a pet build compared to other builds when it comes to what is useful and what isn’t.
In the end the result is still the same when it comes to itemization supporting non pet builds far more easily then pet builds and since that itself factors into loot drops one could easily say that the loot drops for a pet build can indeed be lousy compared to other builds which are a lot more supported by itemization.
Suggestions of using items that don’t fully support a pet build (which should be possible) is merely a band aid to an overall problem.
Pertaining to pet builds, “The drops are terrible.” can indeed be the case and the item database proves this point in multiple ways.
Seriously this is like the blind leading the blind, except Ceno openly admits that he doesn’t play a lot of pet builds.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but pet builds DO get a lot of support from the game.
Devotion-wise, one of the strongest pet devotions (the Shepherd’s Crook) is by far one of the easiest to get in the game (nevermind the fact that pets can equip offensive devotions so almost every devotion near the crossroads is also great for pet builds). It also seems that with every patch more and more constellations are getting +pet support nodes.
Item-wise, there are several affixes designed specifically for summoners (especially Subjugator’s - a yellow affix) and they’re not particularly rare. You won’t find the entire list of Subjugator’s/of x accessories in Graceful Dusk because it simply doesn’t bother to tell you every possible combination. And for the record, Subjugator’s/of x items can easily be BiS for summoner builds.
Faction vendors also give you plenty of pet support via gear and augments. Hell you get a free 100% pet damage bonus (40% uptime) just by being friendly with the Rovers (Wrath of the Beast Tincture).
And you DO NOT just go around equipping as much +%pet damage gear as you can. Consider elemental damage. As you pointed out, just because your build does elemental damage doesn’t mean that you should equip as much %elemental damage from gear as possible while completely ignoring every other aspect of your build like OA/resistances/HP/etc. Leggings, in particular, grant some of the best defensive stats.
You should pay better attention to your own analogy.
Like any other build, a pet build has to balance pet damage with defensive stats and group buffs and debuffs (instead of OA/cast and weapon speed/cooldowns/etc). Like any other damage type, pet damage also has its benchmarks bonus-wise (with maxed base pet skills and buffs/debuffs at least 600% should be enough just to get you by in Ultimate - note that 4x Subjugator’s and maxed Shepherd’s Call already puts you at roughly 400%)
Pet builds actually have an advantage in that many components/devotions also grant group buff/debuff skills, and these are easier to get compared to specific legendaries.
It sounds to me like you’re basing your post almost exclusively form the Lazy Pokemon Master build. Well that build was designed so that it relies almost exclusively on pets for damage. The reason why it stacks pet damage at the expense of practically everything else is because it was designed to be played that way (hence “lazy”).
Pet builds sure get support but not completely (unlike other builds) to make it a pure pet build which is generally what most pet builds go for.
Shepherds Crook is probably the closest to fully supporting a pet build but still has 10 Cunning on one of it’s constellations. The only use that has for a pet build is matching gear requirements but otherwise isn’t something that is sought after for a pet build (pet stats / player defensive stats generally).
Raven - Has Spirit which again can be useful for requirements but then also has Offensive Ability + Energy Regeneration which isn’t as useful.
Again the combination of player offensive stats with pet stats which suggests a hybrid pet build which is something that isn’t seen as much as a pure pet build. Bysmiel’s Bonds, Mogdrogon the Wolf, Dying God, etc… all have this in common when it comes to supporting a hybrid build but not a pure build which is more supported by other constellations which you can more easily fully utilize with builds.
Itemization? Once again you have categories that either don’t have any prefix or suffix that supports pets directly (unlike other damage types) or you have affixes that combine offensive player stats with pet stats which doesn’t make sense compared to other damage types where such a combination of 2 damage types can at least be more easily made use of.
Sure you can go for defensive stats but so can other builds which are more supported directly to their damage type. Fire build can get fire damage/resistance in any category but pets cannot in some cases.
Then you have the lack of affixes in general.
Searching pistols I look for “bonus to all pets” and it comes with only 2 variations of suffixes “of Bestial Rage” and “of Binding”. Searching “fire damage” yields far more results for both prefixes and suffixes.
So… chances of getting a pistol with pet bonuses should then be less then getting a pistol with fire bonuses.
Faction vendors also have the combination of offensive player stats with pet stats which is one reason why I often don’t use many of them because I’m using pets as my damage and not some hybrid damage build.
Stat wise of course you don’t just go for % pet damage. You want pet stats in general and then player defensive stats. However most items/affixes seem to throw in offensive player stats for some odd reason - something that other builds don’t have to suffer.
Does your fire damage need to worry about the evil pet stats jumping in all the time? No. Because you have items that focus on fire damage only and if any other damage is there - can be easily supported by base stats and other stats that can boost it. Pet stats aren’t effected by OA, Spirit, Cunning, % Total Damage, etc… and therefore have less useful combinations itemization wise.
Leggings can indeed have defensive stats. They also have % fire damage stats/affixes but zero pet stats besides 1 epic and 1 legendary item. So why should pet builds suffer this lack of affixes while every other build has that potential in having affixes that actually support that build?
Unlike other builds pet builds have a harder time in acquiring gear because there is less gear that fully supports a pet build and a lack or complete neglect of pet related affixes where other builds have those affixes in abundance.
Less pet affixes/items = less chance in getting items that are needed like any other build for a pet based character. Defensive player stats can only get you so far with a pet build as progression will only get slower due to lack of damage which any other build has a far great advantage in acquiring.
Show me any other build (besides the vitality damage ones, which are universally seen as the least item-dependent builds in GD and are apparently being slowly nerfed one increased resistance mob/boss at time) that can also get by given these handicaps. And you can try running it through less than optimum conditions while you’re at it.
I would recommend playing a pet build several times before you type comments like “…Offensive Ability + Energy Regeneration which isn’t as useful” to a summoner player. Good OA is basically the foundation of hybrid summoner builds and many summoner builds are heavily dependent on spamming certain skills - free Energy Regen is always welcome.
I said numerous times I am basing my post on that build and I don’t know about other builds because I haven’t played them extensively. For that build alone I stand by everything I’ve said regarding the loot drops. Gear with pet bonuses simply doesn’t drop enough to make leveling that build enjoyable. At least not for me. Sounds like other builds have more options for good gear. And I haven’t even gotten into the details of the pet bonus gear that does drop. How the extra stats on it are frequently not very good for a pure pet build. But since this build is an option, and it seems like it a fun option that people enjoy, having some gear drop for the build would make playing it more fun instead of so frustrating.
I’ve made several pure pet builds and OA doesn’t help at all for my build as my character rarely if ever uses skills. I only stated “isn’t as useful” because of the + Energy Regeneration which is just slightly useful when in most cases you’ll either be fine energy wise or just pop an energy potion every now and then depending on your build.
I already admitted that I haven’t done much when it comes to hybrid pet builds (which apparently you have) but my statement of their being fewer guides for hybrid pet builds then pure pet builds I would think to be correct.
I have got quite a few pet-related Epics & Legs from my drops & crafting via Tyrant’s Hold Smith. I have either salvaged the Epics or traded away the legs ( Beastcaller pieces, some rings & amulets etc). Then again, I am not playing a pet build but a few characters such as Blademaster & Retaliation Warder. Maybe it’s RNG?
I love the game as it is & drop-wise, I think Crate should improve the drop rate for Ectoplasm & chipped claws because you need them to craft so many items. My 2 cents.
Okay Tarkus you’re pretty stubborn about this but man the point of the game isn’t to have the best gear by the time you beat Ultimate or reach level 85. I don’t even think the point of the game is to have the best gear at all.
The point of the game is to do exactly what you did. Then have alts do the same.
Now since there really isn’t any end game, you can keep trying for your BiS items for your pet build or start a new character based on any drops you may have saved. Then when you eventually find those BiS items, you can be prepared for when Hidden Path comes and Survival mode when they implement it. And future expansions and high end areas.
I don’t know why we spent 5 pages going back and forth here. This game wasn’t designed the way you want it to be honestly, I don’t think we should be able to get gear that fast. I have 1 BiS item for my Conjurer bleed build and I’m level 85 and in the middle of Ultimate and I’m still doing pretty well for what I do have. I plan on farming and seeing where that goes, and if I get tired of that I will just keep chugging on and if I beat the game okay, then I will keep farming until I get the gear so I’m ready for the next areas.
So I hope they never implement loot to where you get it that fast. This game needs as much longevity as it can muster. If you don’t find it fun, unfortunately it’s time for you to move on.
We’ve gone on for several pages, but for some reason folks still aren’t getting my main point. Nowhere have I said I want the best gear by the end of the game. I’ve said nothing to that point at all. What I’ve said is that as I progress through the game and see tons of loot dropping all over the place I want at least some of it to be relevant to my build. Going through 85 levels and getting a grand total of 4 pet bonus drops for 7 slots is frustrating. Seeing chest piece after chest piece drop and none of them having pet bonus is just not fun. All I ask is that while I go through 85 levels I get some decent pet bonus gear for each slot. I don’t understand how this is not a reasonable request. How about a few magic items? Or a couple of epic items? Doesn’t have to be legendary, but how about something? That’s the point I’m trying to drive home. To play a build through 85 levels and three difficulties and almost never see pet bonus gear drop is just not right.
If they add a similar mechanic as “smart drops” to Grim Dawn because of cry baby shit like this I am gonna be pissed. Even with build or class dependent drops, your first character shouldn’t have best in slot gear all around. I personally find the drops, the way they are now, to add much more longevity to the game because having a few nice pieces for another class combo will get me to make another character.
Maybe I am being to blunt, but if the game required best in slot gear to beat it, and you didn’t find any of those pieces along the way, then maybe a gripe is warranted. The truth is that the game can be beat with the right combination of what you find, or have easy access to, along the way.
I give up. I’m tired of repeating myself. People ignore my major point and keep arguing against points I’m not making. Thanks for the amiable discussion. Some good stuff here. But no one is going to convince me 4 build-relevant drops in 85 levels for 7 slots is good game design. If the build is in the game there should be drops for it, and pure pet builds are in the game.
With all due respect man, you know I have at least tried to read and respond carefully to what you’ve said thus far. I think several others have answered to your main point too.
But there’s not much to say beyond “The numbers you gave sound extremely unlikely, because that’s not what I’ve experienced in xxx hours of playing.” That’s coming from several people with a lot more hours played too. It’s also why I was asking you to give more details on your crafting and gearing standard, as well as providing more evidence to further your main point. I understand that you claim to have only received 4 drops with pet bonus from lvl1 to 85, and I can acknowledge your conviction in that claim, but what else do you expect me to do to confirm a “because I said so” other than comparing it to my own experience? It’s the same way multiple posters did too. That’s why we are stuck as far as that point goes.
Look on the bright side, though, you do have an impressive collection of legendaries, and I’ve also linked a couple active trading threads in your other post, so take it as a peaceful gesture that I’m trying to help you to get your BiS setup. I know we still haven’t resolved whether loot table and RNG for a pure pet build are piss poor or not, but to be honest that’s a dead end for now, so I’ve tried to get you to move on and tackle the next point, which is decking out your character via other methods, or to twink your next alt with what you’ve got.
Regardless, hopefully you can trade for some upgrades for your pet conjurer, and/or make some alts that have good stuff waiting in the stash. Yes RNG may have sucked for you this time around, but at least you’ve done a lot to even the odds, so to speak. It can only get better from here.
You know I do expect you to believe me. And let’s leave the crafting aside. I’m an older, retired statistician. I just do this to relax. I have no reason to lie. Would I bet my life it was four drops? No. Maybe it was 5 or 6, but I guarantee you it wasn’t 10 or more. I know I got a ton of pet bonus off-hands, a few belts here and there, a few rings and amulets now and then. Forget about the off-hands. All I want is something close to the number of drops I get for belts, rings, and amulets for the other slots. I can’t prove my numbers. I don’t record my playing sessions. I have no reason to make this stuff up. So yeah, I"m asking everyone to believe that the actual numbers are at least close to what I state. And whether the exact number is four, five, or six is irrelevant. For the pure pet build the drops are terrible. Even if you do zero farming, just playing the game to level 85 should provide at least some drops for each slot. Not saying they have to be legendary, just something. And I guarantee you that didn’t happen with this build in my play through.
Regards,
Tarkus
P.S. I’m pretty sure most of the people who read the forums have played this game for a while and enjoy it. Those who don’t like it have probably quit already. The developers admit there are few pet bonus prefixes and suffixes. If all prefixes and suffixes have the same chance to drop, that would prove my point. But I don’t know that for a fact. If you have a build where 10 prefixes and suffixes are valuable and there are only 5 of them for pet bonus then you’re going to get double the drops for the non-pet build. So unless they’ve made the rate for pet bonus prefixes and suffixes greater than some others it’s always going to be an issue.
You know the saying “on the internet, nobody knows you are a dog?” I mean no offense to you, it’s just that maybe you presume what’s inherently true to you would be equally convincing to a group of people who don’t know anything about you, especially in an environment where anonymity allows for far greater fabrication and half truths. So when you make a claim and declare it irrefutable, and then the numbers start dwindling, as well as revealing some inaccuracies like trying to craft an epic from the legendary blacksmith when you were already getting legendaries from him, well, it wouldn’t help other readers to believe you. Regardless, if it were true, then you had -extraordinarily- horrible RNG that no one else has experienced thus far. Sorry to hear that.
I do think what you said about the lack of pure pet prefix/suffix in comparison to everything else makes some sense though. That’s what I can get behind, and it opens the way to solid arguments. Perhaps if you came out with some kind of statistical evidence via your expertise in that field, you’d gather much more support than doubts. I know I would’ve taken it seriously right off the bat.
Speaking of alts, since you mentioned that you were thinking to make a melee/ranged hybrid, have you checked out the 2h piercing primal strike conjurer? You can trade for the rifle if you haven’t gotten one, and the build is meant to switch between a melee and a ranged weapon depending on the situation. It should also be a lot easier to get gears for the damage type and class skills/build stats. I personally have one that’s around lvl40 on HC, still alive, and it powers up fairly fast too.
people ignore that point because quite frankly it is not true, no debate here at all.
I find 4 pet items in a 2 hour session. They may not all be upgrades and most are yellow, but that is so far away from the numbers of your claim that I can only dismis it as nonsense.
I didn’t consider loot drop frequency to be especially different from any other class styles. I generally play every character self-found until I reach 85 (assuming I get it that far), then I’ll start sharing stuff around between characters. If I take anything along the way it’ll be a component for a Devotion Shrine.