I am pretty sure the cow is the only entity that is allowed to be consistent between different lores. Can we try to brainstorm some skills for the Cow Hunter? It might be more fruitful, as somebody could make a mod for the mastery and we might finally get Soiled Trousers as BiS for a build.
Jokes aside, i really hope they fix Throw Feces, Noxious Poison Bomb and Greater Fire Blast. Those skills are deplorable even when combined with end-game stuff. The cast speed on these things is really bad and even the throwing range sucks. I’ve tried many combinations but none work
Back to the topic of Cows, well Diablo II did that. How about this?
Praise the Bunnymancer!
1 Like
I think the conclusion is never form a party with a Witch Hunter as a Witchblade or Warlock. You may be hunted!
Your tone.
It’s too bad we don’t have a spell hunter and witch breaker class… that could be fun.
This thread is providing endless entertainment, I love it.
But so far none have addressed the central logical conundrum:
- If someone uses witch abilities, are they a witch?
- If so, aren’t Witch Hunters who use witch abilities witches?
- If so, wouldn’t they have to hunt themselves?
I think most of you are thinking of witches and Witch Hunters as sort-of political entities that may use the same Witch-God-derived powers. In that sense, there is no logical conundrum. Witches use those powers for evil (presumably) and Witch Hunters use them for good (presumably).
If the “Witch Hunter” class name is to be retained, I would love the in-game lore to define what exactly are witches and Witch Hunters and do so logically. That will clear up any misunderstanding for people who define witches and Witch Hunters in the more common and traditional sense, i.e. in the spirit of Malleus Maleficarum.
WRT to Spellbreakers, that is another subject, but Spellbreaker Moira could possibly address that issue.
It has been addressed, you even mention the solution…
I think most of you are thinking of witches and Witch Hunters as sort-of political entities that may use the same Witch-God-derived powers. In that sense, there is no logical conundrum. Witches use those powers for evil (presumably) and Witch Hunters use them for good (presumably).
If two persons use the same ability for different purposes, does that make them the same (e.g. Mafia Assassin and Elite Sniper) ?
As long as the answer to that is ‘no’ there is no conundrum, so obviously, this is the case here…
If someone uses witch abilities, are they a witch? Sure
If so, aren’t Witch Hunters who use witch abilities witches? Sure
If so, wouldn’t they have to hunt themselves? Sure
Reminds me of Gregor Isenhorn. An inquisitor using Chaos powers to battle Chaos.
mamba:
It hasn’t explicitly been addressed by anyone else. Everyone just kinda said “They use witch powers against witches!” without addressing whether using witch powers makes one a witch.
Also, a witch may be defined as anyone who uses witch powers. So though witches and Witch Hunters may have different alignment, purposes and motivations, if they both use witch powers then they both may be defined as witches.
You got that wrong, Eisenhorn is part of Ordos Xenos, charged primarily with anti-alien activity. It is not uncommon in GW lore for Ordos Xenos inquisitors to use chaos artifacts and Ordos Malleus inquisitors to use alien artifacts.
Only if they float.
1 Like
Dioarchet wins. I hereby present you with this trophy for successfully employing masterful logic to point out the flaws contained within the lore of this fantasy realm. May this conundrum forever cause you sleepless nights.
well, obviously it does not make you a witch, otherwise you would not hunt them down but join them 
Didn’t think it had to be more explicit than this
Devs, hot fix plz. Class name contains logical inconsistency! :furious::furious:
Ok, so I’m being facetious. But even when I saw the title of this thread I was thinking “…really?”
I’m sure the devs have bigger challenges to address than an assertion of inconsistency in the use of a title that happens to be used in other fantasy lore. Grim Dawn and Cairn has it’s own lore; there’s no reason it needs to follow the traditional trope of the “Witch Hunter” used in other universes.
I mean no offence… But c’mon guys.
Fixed /10char
Well i’m pretty sure this is just one of those casual discussion threads. So the participants are just here to sort of chip in. No one (including the OP i presume) thinks this will do anything. So this thread imo is what the internet is about - dick around.
Btw can someone clear up how Shaman + Nightblade = Trickster?
Who are you who are so wise in the ways of science?
And of course, it is really hard to just ignore the subsequent lines
BEDEMIR: And that, my liege, is how we know the Earth to be banana-shaped.
ARTHUR: This new learning amazes me, Sir Bedemir. Explain again how
sheeps’ bladders may be employed to prevent earthquakes.
Conclusion: Things do not need to make any sense to be great.
Not necessarily, one needs only to renounce his Witch Hunter title and duties. Witches are generally described as solitary and don’t need to form groups (they always worked alone during school projects). Besides, most witches are women and women can’t stand each other.
Actually I’m being half-serious - I would like some more lore to explain the nature and role of witches and Witch Hunters in Cairn. My expectation is that witches were formerly the only ones using witch powers and anyone using those powers would be considered a witch. They became enemies of the state through some form of criminal activity such as abducting children or simply not paying taxes. The Imperials formed Witch Hunters (synonymous with Inquisitors perhaps?) to…hunt them. These Witch Hunters quickly realised they would not be effective if they didn’t know the witch arts themselves. So they learned them. At this point the definition of witch would have changed to those using witch powers but are also enemies of the state. Meanwhile the Witch Hunters remained law-abiding taxpayers.
We lore now.
I see it more likely that some members of the Houses of the Nightblades were hired to hunt Witches in some capacity, potentially for private matters and unofficially. Nightblades seem the resourceful sort; why not turn a prey’s power against them?
Scribe Osteram’s notes describe witch-hunting as one of the duties of the inquisitors of the Luminari:
It is also interesting the Scribe used the terms “crusade” and “heretic” since those have religious connotations, particularly relating to state-sponsored or state-sanctioned religion. Did the Imperium have a state-sponsored religion? There is no other evidence to support it. There are plenty of deities, but no mention of which one the Imperium preferred, if any.
doesn’t matter… even if you renounce the WH to become a witch, that still means you could use the skills and be a WH, you just chose to become a witch instead, so having the skills does not automatically make you a witch