Well I know the developers intend that Torrent doesn’t add to single target but it’d be a nice addition if it did.
Ultos builds have zero reason to go for cooldown Primal Strike and Thunderous Strike builds are either using WoF or VoS which btw would work much better with Fire Strike.
Torrent has it’s limitations since the AoE is restricted to certain number of targets unlike Explosive Strike which can hit “x” number of targets provided they’re within range
I don’t mind the limitation but the least bit of consolation thunderous strike builds can get is that Torrent adds to single target.
What weapon limitation is that? I’m unclear on that point. I was under the impression that after the last “fix” to it, Melee and Ranged Primal Strike were exactly the same.
The recent “fix” made it so that Torrent doesn’t add to single target damage unlike Explosive Strike (Fire Strike’s modifier) which adds to single target
AH. Thank you. I forget that was even there TBH. Yes, I can 100% support removing that then…I can’t honestly say that I’ve seen a time where that was needed/justified as of yet, but I haven’t tried every weapon locked skill.
TBH I barely use 1Hs for attack skills. Just for casting with an offhand, really. If I’m swinging a weapon or shooting someone, I like to hit hard, and hit once…And that’s where 2Hs shine. Not that 1Hs can’t do that, OFC, just that 2Hs are usually better for that, if you are only looking at a single strike, and ignoring things like attack speed and what not.
I voted for Torrent-hit-single-target.
Also i have opinion:
Rework Primal Strike on a Cadence manner, give it 4-5 strike-to-discharge rate (3 sec current cd, reducing by some items to 2.5 sec, ~1.9-2 attack per sec for TH users), for example.
Maybe also add some synergy between Savagery charges and PS discharge rate.
And please, keep PS for TwoHanded weapons.
Yes but that is unrelated. From one side you have Torrent and its limited targets, on the other side you have Primal Strike hitting unlimited targets in a small radius. In this regard Explosive Strike and Primal Strike are not so different.
I’m currently using PS to level through normal/elite, I’m afraid that in its current state that is what the skill is best for.
Not that you can’t make a build with PS that can clear most things, but coupled with the Ultos nerfs, this skill just isn’t competitive with the attack replacers.
It definitely needs some buffs. All it has going for it is decent AoE coverage, but the high Energy cost coupled with relatively low damage, there is just no gameplay reason to use this as an endgame skill.
It’s definitely odd that some of the coolest LOOKING skills are among the least loved skills functionally. Doom Bolt, for example? Until its recent buff, it was meh at best, but looked sick. Primal Strike looks amazing, all lightning all over the place…And yet, it’s meh. Yet Cadence, which looks pretty boring IMO…THAT is freaking awesome to use in so many ways.
Stopped playing for awhile, just did a quick check.
My Ultos Warder lvl 76, Primal Strike
40k DPS, full Ultos set, non-Ultos pieces are mostly defensive, offensive devotion setup (Revenant, Widow, SotH).
My Ultos Warder lvl 76, Savagery
50.5k DPS, same setup. Haven’t used extra points that I got by going Savagery instead of PS, could had used to raise DPS even further with, say, Brute Force.
You might say that it’s okay because PS is an AOE skill, but Ultos set already gives two quite powerful AOE procs. If I had used Wyrmbone instead of Runic Bracers I would have had three quite powerful AOE procs.
Savagery got significantly better DPS, and since in GD solving lack of AOE is easier than solving lack of single target, Savagery has an upper-hand. Also Savagery got zero energy issues, PS has some.
2H melee high end PS probably does less damage than 2H melee FS. FS has 150% WD and 21% Total from the transmuter, while PS has 140% WD and -35% Total (!!!). Although some of the DPS came from electrocute, it means that flat damage is stupidly high on PS, enough to offset lesser WD. High chances are if 2h-only restriction was to be lifted PS would become a fantastic 1H ability, probably the new meta for shield builds.
Now, on how PS could be changed.
First of all, the way it’s now, removing the restriction means that the skill will be probably too good for 1h, in which case it’s a guaranteed further nerf and PS becoming a dead skill for 2hs. I’m a fan of 2hs and I don’t like that. The solution is to increase %WD and reduce flat, but that’ll make non-CD PS a very similar skill to Firestrike.
As for making Torrent hit the main target I to be honest don’t know if Thunderous Strike total damage penaltiy actually affect Torrent, in which case Torrent working on the main target might result in PS even overshadowing Savagery, which is probably why it was fixed in the first place w/o just passing it as a feature. If total damage penalty works on torrent as well then making torrent affect the main target is still a decent upgrade, probably enough to significally close the gap between PS and Savagery.
My personal solution is
Leave the base skill as is.
Implement the ability to bind devotion procs to Torrent separately from PS. Would be damn fun.
Attune the base skill’s damage so PS was just 5-10% below Savagery in DPS. The boost needs to be biased towards sub-ultimate or slightly-ultimate levels.
Maybe I’ll come up with other ideas later, but for now that’s it.
These two sit well with me. I hope a mod can add this option ("Implement the ability to bind devotion procs to Torrent separately from PS. ")to the poll
I don’t get why Crate removed Torrent’s single target capability in the first place. It’s terribly ironic I complained about it not having single target capability over a year ago, then Most corrected me on that, then it was removed and now we complain about it once more.
Crate could have just nerfed Torrent’s damage a bit and offloaded some of the energy cost from the base skill onto Torrent. Or something like that.
Instead they made Torrent a 1-pointer just like Ulzuin’s Wrath.
Good post.
Another point to consider is that Savagery/FS can use WPS, which PS can’t.
The WPS generally only require a handful of points (or even fewer, with +skills) and they basically add an extra attack on top of your attack replacer.
Feral Hunger for example grants a good chunk of damage, but more importantly, it can cover your sustainability needs (frees up Haunted Steel slot for more damage conversion or Riftstone).
More leech = less time needed to dodge = more overall DPS.
For DW you can use AQC and Execution which are huge damage boosts that actually do work against the main target, compared to Torrent.
And the WPS add QoL as well: you can put Devotions on them that don’t need to be refreshed too often, such as Eldritch Fire so you can play by holding down your only attack button.
Compare that to having to use another skill to get a 15% base chance Devotion off, you might have to cast Flashbang 2-4 times before it works = even more DPS lost.
TL;DR: PS takes more effort to use to attain fewer results, reminiscent of most Arcanist spells.
Quite frankly there isn’t much incentive to go PS unless i decide “i am going try something different today!!”
Which is very disappointing in my opinion
Same applies for Scourge Relic
Btw I think this poll won’t help as even the addition of Torrent to DPS calc wouldn’t mean much imo. As Dragon said AoE solving is relatively easy. Now I don’t want PS to be as good as Savagery in terms of Single Target but something like WPS devotion binding to Torrent like Dragon suggested would be nice
