Pure Demolitionist feedback

Hello there !

I have been playing for quite some time now, with a huge pause shortly after release because of computer failure. Since it was only my “leisure” PC I didn’t make the repairs a priority, and I ended up having it back to play grim dawn just 2 weeks ago.

And how the game has changed ! For the best imo.

Anyway, back to my topic.

I wanted to try a pure Demolitionist build, since I had tons of gear (notably most of the Ulzuin set. I don’t use the rifle though). And I just finished leveling him to 75 to put all the gear I wanted on him. Leveling was super easy up to now, and since I am vergeared now, I expect it to continue that way.
Here is an approximation of current spec : grimcalc.

The build is very agressive and control heavy. Health is low (under 6K at full gear lvl 75), but it works quite well actually. Seeing as how everything dies at a single sight, I will probably change my devotions to be more defensive (currently under a very generic Meteor shower setup).

There are actually 2 points I would like to point out:
-: Full demo works incredibly well
-: Energy is a huge problem… but for only one or two particular points that I am now going to develop.

Basically, the general gameplay is this:
-: There is a pack of monsters.
-: You throw a BWC
-: everyone dies
-: there is a second pack
-: You throw a cannister bomb
-: everyone dies
-: repeat every 5-7 seconds.

When there are tougher monster:
-: throw a stun jack to monsters that dare come close
-: throw grenado if they still dare be alive

With tough bosses/heroics (regular heroics are already dead at this point):
-: Start kitting and make work of that sweet Ulzuin’s Chosen passive
-: Be out of energy in 12 seconds
-: Spirit potion
-: Be oom in 8 seconds
-: Wait for potion cd

Let’s be clear: I have no quarrel with Ulzuin’s chosen as long as you really build for it. It’s still kind of weak compared to other ults but whatever.
I also have no quarrel with drinking potions. That’s normal gameplay. But as someone who actually put effort and spent 12-18 of hours playing with Ulzuin’s Chosen at its “max” potential: it doesn’t work out in the end.
Stun jack energy cost is fine.
Cannister bomb is fine too, since the skill is really powerfull.
But Grenado’s energy cost is terrible (and I didn’t fully maxed it). I actually avoid casting this skill as much as possible because I am actually thinking: “Why would I cast grenado now if it litterally replaces a Cannister usage in the next 20 seconds ?”
I kindly remind you here that my build is only consisting in skills with cooldown, so the energy issue should be diminished compared to a spell spam build !

There is a start of a solution to this problem: wear caster gear only. But as far as I know, there is no caster gear that boosts the “grenadier” part of the demolitionist, right ? And the Ulzuin set sounds perfect (gun excepted. And it’s still good) for this gameplay. But honestly, considering the speed at which energy goes away, I am not even sure doubling my regen (meaning gaining at least 250% raw energy regen stat) would completely solve the issue.
Another start of a solution would be to invest ~40 points into arcanist for max IEE and Arcane Will. (but that’s still not enough and damages the “max Ulzuin’s Chosen potential”)

I would be fine with running out of energy once in a while for very challenging fights. And just this would mean reducing Grenado energy cost to 0 (I tested this by… not using grenado :slight_smile: ). Ideally, I would really like to see an energy regen component added to Ulzuin’s Chosen, be it a proc chance or a static bonus.
The idea is to make Ulzuin’s Chosen proc a positive thing, rather than a " that’s nice, but I can’t really use that free grenado/cannister/stunjack :frowning: "

Hmmmm, try to get legendary dual pistol set that boosts canister and grenado? Also shaman mastery for pact of Mogdrogen? Should help with energy regen while not influencing ulzuins chosen?

Also I have canister bomb only char. God it feels awesome when reuse triggers 7 times in a row

Energy regen seems to be the worst thing about pure builds. When running BoT/SoT on my Occultist Summoner I usually use energy regen elixirs (cheap and easy to make) so I don’t have to worry about energy potion CD.
And it’s not because of stats - it’s funny people assume that because stacking stats is easy. It’s because pure builds are about finding a combination of skills in one single mastery that gives you a build that won’t need any other skills from other masteries. The implication is that pure builds usually have more skills to spam - which means significantly higher energy use.

Up to now pure Demo is pretty much the only build I’ve never tried/heard from. I’m curious why you’re leaving your HP at 6-7k, which IMO is downright suicide against Nemesis mobs. Previously this wasn’t an issue, but since the devs adjusted the amount of grind you needed to get Nemesis status you should definitely start planning for them.
Besides constellations, there are also a lot of augments/components with +HP/+%HP and the new yellows/greens can even spawn with 500+ HP affixes (among other useful bonuses, like resistances). Of course you’ll have to juggle that with +energy stuff like Ectoplasm and energy augments, though.
On my builds I personally went with either those or energy absorbed from enemy spells (because since I’m stacking survivability I might as well gain energy while taking damage), usually from the Runic Bracers (one of my favorite items).

The low hp was mainly because of a focus on offensive, but now that I saw the damage output I am comfortable with taking a much more defensive approach. In constellaions at least. As an additionnal benefit, I get a good deal of energy regen.

But the problem still remains: Grenado cost is way too high (300+ energy) to use every 2.5 seconds by anyone and you can’t use Ulzuin’s Chosen main benefit (the cd proc) for more than 3-4 seconds.

After giving it some thoughts, the ideal solution imho would be to give UC: xx% chance (same as the cd proc) for -100% cost reduction.
It would respect the enjoyable “roulette” feeling of UC. I actually think that would be enough to bring UC up to par with most other passive ultimates.

Sounds like fun. Over time it comes out to about the same as if those were flat bonuses. I think UC would be nice if it offered flat CDR to the demo tree, damage boost, and skill cost reduction, it’d be a pretty cool tier 10.

UC feels like a hedge / peverage skill for sorcerers, though. I could see doing a grenado sorcerer with UC going well to overcome some of Maivens and combining well with iskandras elemental.

Also keep in mind i dont think uc is exclusive (is it) so it can be used with OTHER exclusives. Not that there is at immediate synergy (looking at you star pact) for somme crazy grenado action. Go skyfire!

Hope you got spirit pots.

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I don’t know if UC is an exclusive skill. But even if it isn’t, I don’t think you can make it work with another exclusive. That would mean you invest 100 points into masteries, 22 into ultimates, and from 50 to 90 points into the stun jacks/grenado/cannister bomb depending on whether you decide to use grenado or not. This just doesn’t leave enough skillpoints for utility and defense.
If you go for UC, you need to fully invest into two of its concerned skills at least . So you can’t really go for another ultimate skill in another mastery.

Even if UC is not mechanically an exclusive skill, it’s still the most exclusive skill in the whole game. Because it actually costs at least 62 skill points.

You could spec into arcanist and grab inner focus without many master points. That would help with the mana problem and give you more OA. Or you could spec into solider also without much mastery to grab military conditioning for the extra health. I think the mana usage is downright annoying and needs to be fixed. This is a problem with a lot of builds even when you put a lot of points in spirit. It makes me just want to play melee sometimes because there is nothing more annoying than having to use mana potions constantly. Who want to put on a bunch of caster regen gear to play a demolitionist?

This was my thinking as well. With 34 points unspent in your build, you can solve your energy problems and your squishiness problems very easily with 15 points into Arcanist mastery to unlock Inner Focus, Arcane Will, Mirror, and Mavens.

I appreciate that you like the purity of a single-class build, so if the whole point of this is Pure Demo period, then have fun your way… but for me, it’s more fun to use all the tools available to be as effective as possible.

Thanks for the piece of advice. I know I could go for more health and/or mana regen by picking another mastery, but I don’t for 2 reasons:
-: Survivability is fine as it is. Demolitionist have so much control that 7 K is way enough for all the content the game currently throws at you.
-: Even if I would magically gain another 100 mana regen per second (which is difficult to begin with !), this build would still not be able to sustain itself at all times against the few tanky bosses who survive more than 10 seconds. There is a core fun factor issue in Ulzuin’s Chosen.

If you are interested, I have a guide for this kind of pure demo in the build compendium. It works pretty well. SoT and BoC are pretty easy, but the end bosses are a bit of an issue… because of aforementionned energy issue.