Hey, everybody. Since at the moment the game is changing physical resistance to armor, I think we should change the physical resistance of the guardian and devotion Rattosh the Veilwarden to armor. For the reason that physical resistance is collected extremely poorly and small values are almost useless.
For example, let’s take this build, created under 1.2.1.6. The build has 15% physical resistance, but in fact we see that it is of little use, because it is lowered even in negative(-%) values Cabalist, Level 100 (GD 1.2.1.3) - Grim Dawn Build Calculator
But armor stacks and increases perfectly from different sources and additional sources will give more benefit to the build than crumbs of physical resistance.
2700 is already a good value for vitality caster, before this value for such builds was no more than 1400-1500. But still in conditions of SR and super bosses - these are still small numbers. Yes, the vampirism of this build allows you to hold the blows of super boss Callaghadra https://youtu.be/ia6286uP8-s but it is a very dangerous game. So % increase in armor on aspect of the guardian and devotion Rattosh the Veilwarden will give a much bigger boost than having physical resistance.
More on the topic of vitality devotion. Wendigo devotion used to have a parameter % physical resistance, it was removed, but % armor increase was not added, is it possible to fix this and give Wendigo devotion % armor increase, at least 7-9%?
Similarly lotus devotion has lost % physical resistance, there is an option to give it a 4-5% increase in armor.
In the amount of physical resistance that is left in the game now, from it just makes no sense, it is better to have more sources of armor increase to disperse this parameter to higher values, which will give in the end the maximum profit for the build, than crumbs of physical resistance.
@AlexGoldFish_322 isn’t exactly wrong here. Surface level it does look like that, though I am sure Crate has divine wisdom when it comes to decisions like this.
Another important factor is when armor and %phys res is applied during the chain of damage mitigation and the amount of armor that would need to be added to compensate the change in removing phys res.
At some point the numbers start to look ridiculous (like Diablo 3 levels).
We also don’t have a complete picture of FoA so who knows what’s going to or is influencing the phys res changes.
I do, personally, find it odd that there is a resistance stat that cannot be soft capped (at least).
I wouldn’t advocate for removing it because it allows for some additional build crafting in a fashion that is not a bloated mess (PoE1) or decisions a patch of mold could make (D3-4).
Although I understand Crate doesn’t owe us an explanation on why something is occurring…but sometimes it’s just good to understand the context of why a change is happening (unless this has been explained before and I missed it).
Agreed. I also have no clue what’s going on. If it was explained anywhere it wasn’t on the forum. It’s not an obvious change to make, especially considering how physical damage works. Maybe this somehow makes it easier for Crate to balance things? Would be nice to know what the intent is and why.
I can’t find the original post right now, but one of the reasons for the recent changes to physical res and physical damage of mobs is to reduce the disparity in physical res stacking between build.
Funnily enough, before the patch some niche builds were able to cap physical res while still doing good damage…
This is a screenshot from the game when the mobs lowered my physical resistance. This is what I’m driving at, that such a small crumbs of physical resistance that are now accumulated in the builds, in practice just go into the minus and there is no use for it, the addition of armor would be more relevant in the current conditions of the game.
I think you’re missing the fact that if your physical resistance was 0%, it would go further into negatives, increasing damage taken even more.
I would rather question why monster physical RR still exists (even if much more rare than before) if some builds struggle getting into two-digits physical resistance numbers nowadays.
I suppose this really comes down to whether Crate is attempting to completely remove physical resistance from the game or not. Looking back at my notes tracking (mostly) comparable builds across different patches, the 1.2.1 patch saw median physical resistance drop from 39% to 25%. This patch saw median physical resistance drop another 5% to 20%. Reducing incoming physical damage by 20% before armor gets applied is still somewhat meaningful. It’s an additional layer of defense that comes into play more against big physical hits. Layers of defense that overlap are pretty common in Grim Dawn.
i don’t know what the numbers are
against “weaker” enemies armour probably reduces more, but against harder enemies, Calla/Ravager, vs low base armour, phys res helps more
But since i’m hardly a maff-wiz i’ve no clue where they “intersect” on some avg, let alone how that applies in practice with the build/armour rating diversity in the game (feel like i can/am still making builds ending up at sub 2k armour)
I don’t know how to approach it, and honestly have little desire to run 50+ builds this time to figure out where things stand/feel. What i do “know” is, Zantai has proven time and time again he’s willing and able to dial the numbers to where they “need” to be/end up ok afterall, with community feedback/to or from suggestions like these, “apt or not”, zoning in near enough that desired sweetspot.
Is replacing phys res with armour on rattosh the right call, i can’t say, i think many Vit casters probably end up with low’ish armour rating potential still, - and i really don’t feel like checking much/“confirming” personally this time
But, if it does get replaced, and some low armour vit build ends up clobbered, i am certain Z will rectify it appropriately if so
(or collaterally direct intends some builds to get a rougher fight against Ravager/Call than current )
*my biggest concern is actually if the enemy phys dmg nerfs impact Veteran/applies to Vet too much, but that’s probably secondary to the main aim this PTR/the endgame balancing if so
As someone who uses both Aspect of the Guardian and Rattosh devotions, those Phys Res are very much meaningful and I rather not see them replaced by Armor which would be worthless for my builds, unless casters and pet builds get to roll around with 10k armor with no class/mastery restrictions.
For example, this is a pet build with not a negligible amount of phys res and yet horrendous armor in comparison. Given how much armor it would need to gain if phys res gets removed, for comparable survivability, yeah… no.
and this is a caster with some actual focus into getting phys res -
What builds should not worry about survivability is the builds through pets have always been and are some of the strongest in the game, that in the solo could previously close 160-170 SR(in the old format SR). Do you really think they need anything else and should be targeted(laughter). Even having 0 physical resistance and say 2500 armor - these would be some of the top builds of the game for solo play. I would have gone through a brutal nerf on all of the game’s pets a long time ago, as they SLIGHTLY stand out from all of the game’s builds. But the developers, for some reason, have a different view on the fact that the pets are several steps above any builds of the game.
someone mentioned it in another thread, which funnily enough then applies/is the answer to your wondering
The reason pets were never hammered down is because of the way they game was “measured”, and pets had tankiness, which is extremely useful against celestials; and high SR.
But, in a game that was measured by performance = clear time (cruci 170 at the time, now sr 75-76/30-31) pets lost out drastically for years. This was probably also contributed by player builds having more AoEs and the game/performance measurements largely had a potential benefit gain from lots of AoE
So basically it was a sort of semi “compensation” slow, but chonky
and pet players were largely fine with that/didn’t demand pets clear cruci in sub 4 minutes at the time, but enjoyed then clearing sr 150 instead
*tho Zantai didn’t enjoy it, so if/when pets got collaterally/"accidentally2 nerfed and went from 150->130 after dmg changes he wouldnt’ shed much tears
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