Retaliation damage questions/FAQ

Grim Dawn General Discussion
1

Hello!

I’m trying a retaliation build, but as I’m playing I find I’m lacking some knowlegde about retaliation. As such, I ended up googling, and boy-o-boy, I am not the only one asking questions but I did found most of these questions/answers lacking, some of the questions are referring to the old forum so the page no longer exists. So here I go, asking similar questions I guess or confirming some things. Asking multiple questions in one go so hopefully all answers/questions are now in one post. If a post like this exists please let me know, I wasn’t able to find it (most retaliation searches get me into builds).

You need to be hit by a melee attack for retaliation damage to return, so dodging won’t return the damage. However, do you return the ret damage when you block with a shield? Or is there a difference with a fully blocked attack and partially blocked attack?

Can retaliation damage crit and is it affected by enemy resists, or is it a flat amount of damage just returned (the way it works in diablo3, if i recall)? (In others words, do i need RR in a ret-build? or only for the % ret added to atttack).

Does the new stat % of ret damage added to attack help me gain on life-steal or is the added ret damage just a flat bonus added afterwards? Example, say if I have a weapon damage 100 dmg, and 1000 ret dmg, and 10% life steal. Assuming righteous fury does 100% weapon damage and 10% ret damage added to attack, would I then steal 20 life on hit, or just 10 from the weapon damage attack portion?

Does damage conversion also apply to retaliation damage? Does this go for armor piercing on weapons as well, converting the physical ret dmg to piercing?

If I have 100 burning damage, and 100 burning retaliation, do both burn sources get applied when in battle with a monster, or will one remove the other (thinking of the 10% ret damage added to attack here as well, then i would do 110 burning damage on attack + 100 burn damage from ret?)

Many questions, but hopefully it helps clearify this for many ppl!

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Yes.

Retaliation damage cannot by itself crit but skills that apply Retaliation damage added to attack can crit.

Yes, as is the case for resist reduction. You want it to increase Retaliation damage dealt.

On it’s own no as it does not pull from your weapon or weapon-based effects.

Just from the weapon portion here I believe.

ADCtH inherently on the skill should apply to any Retaliation damage added to it though, e.g. Sigil of Consumption with 6% Retaliation damage added to it.

Global conversion yes. Early on in FG, transmuter conversion didn’t work but when I tested it a few weeks ago for someone else, it seemed to apply just fine as well.

Edit: Tested again and can confirm that transmuter-level conversion applies.

Armour piercing is a nope.

If both Burns come from separate sources (e.g. different skills, your weapon and presumably your pool of Retaliation count as one source each) then they should stack.

1 Like
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Alright! Thanks a lot for clarifying this. Seems some of my assumptions (or hopes) were quite wrong! So as it cannot crit, I guess offensive abilty is not really a priority then, except for hitting with Righteous Fury/other attacks? :smile:

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Anything RATA-based, so besides Righteous Fervor, that includes devotion procs with it like Targo’s Hammer or Fist of Vire, gear procs as well etc.

5

Maybe you could put it like this: In most current retal builds, OA isn’t a high priority stat. Definitely not useless, but it’s not something you would deliberately build for… Make sure you have enough OA to hit reliably. Raising OA to “crit levels” doesn’t make much sense for most retal builds.

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Quite simply if a build doesn’t make use of RATA it’s going to be a subpar build for general cases. Pure retal has never and will never be a remotely serviceable build by design. Either you unmask the RATA ghost and realize ZOINKS it’s old man flat damage or you contribute to the legion of retal warder memes.

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Apologies for reviving an old thread, Since this appears to be the most recent FAQ I felt I should clarify the OA question for new players. If that’s not you feel free to skip this.

Retaliation damage can be pushed to extreme levels but it’s not reliable. You only trigger retaliation damage when you get hit by (or block) a melee attack. That means enemies that rely on ranged attacks, spells, Damage over time, auras . . . A lot of enemies are just going to ignore how spiky you are and kill you dead.

We get around that by triggering other attacks when a trash mob hits us. We can’t control when they go off, or who they target but you’re going to get a lot of your retribution damage from things like counter strike or vindictive flame going off.

We further increase our damage by adding retaliation damage to our attacks. Retribution adds 9%, Aegis of thorns and reprisal add even more. That lets you get some of that massive retaliation damage consistently and against the targets you choose. That’s really important and it can crit.

You further improve on this with Devotion skills that can proc when you get hit or block with your shield. A lot of your damage is going to come from skills like Targo’s Hammer, Trample, and Fetid Pool.

So when it comes to Offensive ability and Defensive ability you are walking tight rope. If you can make all of these other skills crit they can spike for even higher damage, and show up in clumps of destruction every few seconds . . .

The trick is to get hit (and hopefully block the damage) as often as you can without dying, and if you can crit on top of that great. A physical retaliation build doesn’t lose anything by focusing on phyique and cunning . . . but if you are focusing on acid or fire you might want more spirit . . .

And gear has to be focused on staying alive, always. Resistances, armor, and healing, come before more retaliation damage, and that comes before that juicy critical attack you might get 12% of the time.

Of course, disclaimer, I’m one of those insane sorts who only plays hardcore solo self found so . . . your priorities could differ in what I consider the “practice game”.

Hope that helps. :slight_smile:

8

No longer the case. After some patch Attribute % damage bonuses is not added to % Retal damage.

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Thanks! :slight_smile: