FG has movement skills which will allow you to play the cast and kite builds a lot better. I’m looking forward to it.
Just for the record, Crate has to create enemies which can pose as a threat to all build types. For ranged builds these are the chargers. These types of enemies don’t really exist until you reach Act 4 then they’re all over the place. You can’t expect to stay at “ranged” at all times in the game and that was the point of my post earlier.
I posted this 2 years ago. OFF is good until you reach the later parts of Act 4 and have to deal with Rage/Flesh Hulks and they can only be stunned/slowed.
The AoE on OFF is way too high to ever be a spammable skill. It works on 90% of champions just not bosses. Rage Hulks/Flesh Hulks and Harbingers are immune to it. (Oddly enough, champion versions of the above are not).
I’ve been fooling around with various theory OFF combos using the set.
While it could be a fun play, it would be nice to see more support for converting lightning and other various damage types to either cold/fire/phys - for skills in the various supporting masteries.
Other than the freeze and cold damage, the exciting thing about OFF is that big fire/phys %RR…when the freeze actually works.
OFF could be fun as a extra bonus, but you will need another focus for the hard stuff. And the most interesting for that focus would be 100% fire and/or physical in an attempt to take advantage of a heavy investment in OFF - for the %RR. And when OFF doesn’t work, this focus must be able to struggle through the fights in a reasonable way.
Well, that’s an opinion, although you stated it as a fact. I don’t see why I can’t spot a rage hulk and react in time to prevent its charge by freezing it. If I fail to react, I deal with the consequences or I build around it in other ways (mitigations, stun-removal etc) - but note that I’m building around an exception, not the norm.
And yes, OFF is fine early, then becomes pointless - we understand that - it’s exactly what I’m questioning. Other games have ranged builds that are primarily played at a ranged distance, so it is perfectly possible.
Yes, that’s one of the attractive build ideas with OFF having fire RR - a build that uses OFF to make a fire skill work well. Even if some are immune to the freeze, if the fire RR still worked it would be interesting. And a fast clearing build in many situations where the enemies are not (all) freeze-resistant/immune.
Freeze/slow are such fun mechanics, I’m always surprised that devs are resistant to it (excuse the pun).
Actually I meant that I don’t mind that the RR is only in play when OFF works.
If the %RR were to work regardless, it would have to be toned down something fierce. Currently it’s over 100% fire RR at max. ultimate and physical RR can also be quite high.
But imho what is lacking is the conversion support for other skills when using the full set and mixing other items. The conversion I’d want is into fire and physical.
The freeze window may ultimately be very very short with some bosses (and none on others). It would be fun to be able to profit off that split-second or more for double fire, for example.
But the conversion supports (with full set) are pretty hard to find, currently. And with many split-damage skills, it’s probably better to just work on converting to one of the types and effectively getting ~100% more damage without OFF…which ultimately means the optimal use of OFF is to throw a point or two in for an extra cold damage attack.
Then I guess we’re talking about two different things. I’m not sure a conversion works for OFF since:
How would it freeze if it’s changed to fire/phys? I mean in real-world terms it wouldn’t really make sense (since cold freezes, fire does the opposite) so the conversion would probably need to drop the freeze anyway.
If you could convert to fire and have fire RR as well, that makes it a bit of an all-in-one skill.
Ideally you want to freeze with OFF, then hit with a different skill that is largely converted to fire and or physical. I’m not talking about converting OFF or changing it.
That certainly wasn’t clear to me in reading your posts. Why does it have to be converted to fire? Why not just hit with a ‘normal’ fire skill?
But certainly it was my expectation in any possible future OFF build to freeze with OFF and hit with a fire skill (aoe or single target, depending on the situation) if the RR from OFF actually worked - if conversion is needed to be able to do that then, yes, I’d agree with you (I can’t remember the skills in GD well enough to remember the aoe fire options).
I kinda have to disagree. It’s like you learn an instrument, only to drop it once you finished, because normally you learn an instrument to actively play it. For me the Question is: Why should i farm for BiS Gear, if i don’t have afterwards content to use it? That’s pretty useless in my opinion and would be more of an “fake content” because it’s nothing more than an mere carrot on an stick to engage folks to hunt for loot… (like levelconcept without limit > Paragon) so i have to disagree, Endgame is part of the “real” / “true” Content.
However unlike the guy above i have to say, with Shattered Realm alone this will fix this anyway, because due the “endless” nature of it and that it gets harder and harder, you actually have a proper use for your best equipped Characters.
You might disagree, but it’s what the devs have stated for the game. Zantai has said that they feel like at some point a character is done, roll a new one.
Having said that, I’m glad that you feel the Shattered Realm will suit your need.
not sure that is a good comparison, might as well compare it to a book, once you read that you put it away, you do not keep reading the last chapter over and over - but of course that does not support your argument
Endgame is an MMO concept to keep subscribers, and I find it mind numbingly boring
Why should i farm for BiS Gear, if i don’t have afterwards content to use it?
then don’t, simple… IF (and that is rare enough) I do that, I do so because I enjoyed the char and want him to be ‘finished’. I only do so if I truly like the game though, in most ARPGs, I cannot be bothered to once I have completed the campaign
However unlike the guy above i have to say, with Shattered Realm alone this will fix this anyway, because due the “endless” nature of it and that it gets harder and harder, you actually have a proper use for your best equipped Characters.
if that suits you, go for it, I will instead try a new build, to each their own
I’m not saying that Zantai or Crate won’t think like that, but the Quote which you used is pretty out of context and have absolutely nothing to do with my argument, or where i “disagree” with.
His two Major Points of his topic / answer was:
First: That they don’t want to have an Loot / Equip Circle similiar to endgame in MMORPG’s where you have like 10 Dungeons, but you can’t do them all, because you need to tackle your first dungeon and grind on that, so you are equipped well enough so you are up to the next dungeon where you gather the next gear so you are well equiped for another Dungeon and so on.
Second:
Endless Progression in sense if this asking / wishing / complaining to have no levelcap or something like an Paragon-System.
He / they want in both cases that for building up your will be something which you can aim for and have somewhat of an end, and not circled around or endless. My Argument however was it wouldn’t make sense, to add endgame gear and so on, if there isn’t an proper use for it. Or do you really want to tell me, that Crate put so much work into these Items, Balancing add Skills and such only for it beeing an mere decoration so people like mamba can say “well now i have this amazing epic mastersword… now i’m done with this character”. I’m pretty sure their intention for this equip and BiS Build is to give you tools so you can beat / do the content which you are offered([secret]bosses, nemesis) etc. Also it would interest me, if they don’t want that, why add an endless dungeon with an softcap instead of an “big dungeon” with an Hardcap?
@Mamba:
Sorry, but i really have to disagree with you, because building up an Character isn’t comparable to finish a story. It would’ve made more sense if there would be an argument here, that Grim Dawn should be rely on Games as a Service an add constantly new Storychapters and such, even if the story itself would be finished…
However building up an Character is like my mentioned learning of an instrument or learning of an language (except the time you are forced to) if you don’t want to use it anyway. That’s pretty waste of time…
no problem, we can agree to disagree, this is all just personal opinion anyway, there is no fact behind this, just different tastes
because building up an Character isn’t comparable to finish a story. It would’ve made more sense if there would be an argument here, that Grim Dawn should be rely on Games as a Service an add constantly new Storychapters and such, even if the story itself would be finished…
However building up an Character is like my mentioned learning of an instrument or learning of an language (except the time you are forced to) if you don’t want to use it anyway. That’s pretty waste of time…
this I completely disagree with, the notion that endgame is the real game and anything before is basically you putting on your sports gear before you then get to actually play the game.
The campaign is over by then, that is the story part. You are done with the book, but you enjoyed it so much that you don’t want to leave it behind. In game terms that is you not moving on to the next game, but trying to find something to do still.
And where that concept started was with MMOs which had an interest in you not moving on either, as you pay a monthly fee to keep playing. So they came up with more grind to keep you around longer, as the company’s endgame is to keep you paying indefinitely… I am not interested in that grind however, so ‘endgame’ never interested me in the least
Frankly I’ve always wondered why the -RR on OFF is tied to the freeze, I always felt it should have been separate. In terms of actually freezing bosses though, I think it should be possible, but it’s something you’d have to make an entire build around, and then some. Being able to just choose an item or devotion or do, pick OFF, and freeze bosses is just an obvious pitfall that devs are pretty clearly walking around.
Glad someone posted in this thread. I’m in the final stages of testing a brand new OFF breaker. OFF is pretty good as support for mid-tier builds, especially for main game. Changes to high level enemies’ cc mechanic are not likely as it takes time to figure stuff like that out and Crate’s probably got other things to do than to tweak mechanics because of one skill (sorry if I sound too much like Crate’s spokesman… I just surmise). What OFF needs is more frostburn or easier access to skill bonuses to Absolute Zero as it’s very hard to get it high enough. And a splash more freeze rr on gear other than Mageslayer (but compatible) or lowering some bosses+ freeze res by just a little bit (5-10% max). You can already freeze some nemeses sometimes but only for a fraction of a second - not enough to even throw one punch. I will write more feedback once I post the build.
People have suggested it many times and they always gave the same answer: “It’s called CROWD control, not BOSS control”. You may not like the answer, but that’s how it is.
And if that mechanic would be implemented, someone would come up with an exploit. It happens always.
Yeah, I have suggested in my own post thread in the past and I also understand that they are not going to change.
I don’t struggle with crowd control so I don’t use OFF and BT. It is just that.
However, I only think that it is a good thing if it gets better and is used frequently.
I am reminded of Equilibrium Relic which has 25% chance of 60% elemental resistance.
It would be neat if enemies could have a base CC resistance and then more difficult enemies could have a % chance in getting more where you can manipulate both the chance and the yield. I only mention this as creating some sort of new mechanic where cc’ing a boss gives it more resistance might prove to be more difficult.
For myself cc’ing a boss or difficult enemy should be possible but with varying results. The Undead Nemesis could have a high starting base line for freeze resistance and then on top of that a high chance of gaining more resistance in that respect - you can still possibly freeze him but the chance would be understandably low.
Balance wise, for such changes/improvements, it is far too late in development and I would only expect such a thing in a mod of some sort.
