Conversion in cindertouch is beautiful, don’t omit it please. It used in a lot of wacky build and specs, omit it to just cater for cyclone is absurd.
On the other hand, conversion on dawnshard armor is actually not quite useful. If that conversion is not there, I can actually use it for hellborne build because it provide fire retal. But other ppl use it for another reason and they need that conversion, so don’t just change it.
Also, play another item/set/mastery. Don’t waste your time thinking how to nerf things pls. You make this like a very in urgent issues while it’s not. 5:40 with banner is a pretty normal thing for a top tier set.
But I agree. Cindertouch is best left alone. If you want to hurt Cyclone, target the set itself or the skills it relies on, and then use other items to buff those skills up as appropriate if the need arises.
No. We are saying it’s quite a few things clicking and working together and creating a strong synergetic spec. Strong synergetic build is much more than the sum of all the parts that make it strong.
Nope, and I don’t want to touch it. As I said in the other thread those constant balance changes are making the game frustrating for me. The motivation for creating new builds is also gone, I have created so many top-tier really great builds that got nerfed it’s really no fun to create anymore. And I feel responsible for ruining fun for players who get their average normal non-minmaxed specs nerfed based on my guides.
But sub-6min builds are still falling into the (if not totally) broken category according to Crate’s standards, right?
Yes, this possibility is why I hesitated with suggesting the change. But what if we added some other whacky stat to the Hauberk, like a 10-15% atk speed bonus only for people that use offhands? That might be fun
So you’re saying that builds like this can’t be nerfed because they are synergystic? I mean, you have to get in there somewhere if you want to reduce its performance, and a single part of an admittedly greater sum might just be enough in my opinion
Yeah, that sucks… But this is actually a big part of why I created this thread: I want to basically get ahead of the nerfs & ensure that they don’t completely break anything.
Keep your friends close, but your enemies closer, right?
I mean, I can’t speak for everyone on the forums, but before I started posting here actively a lot of the builds I made myself were inspired by some kind of build on here – and it really didn’t matter if the source build was nerfed to the ground already, because you can always recycle some, if not many of the great ideas posted there. Especially from creative builds like yours
I don’t know what rock you’ve been living under, but this hasn’t been the case for many months now. Cruci does impact game balance. Period, end of discussion. This is something I’m virulently unhappy about, but it is a fact nonetheless.
I am saying with some super strong builds it’s just very complex. Like with Retaliation builds right after FG was out it was pretty obvious that Crate fucked up math on Retaliation to Attack values and added an extra number before decimal by mistake. But when you have a build that has multiple things working for him - it’s much harder to nerf all those things without breaking the balance for lesser builds.
Thus, back to topic: Does anyone have an idea how this Cyclone ‘nerf fiesta’ can be steered into a direction that leaves both builds with and without the set in a reasonable position?
The one that seemed to meet the least resistance up until now was to remove the % conversion on Divinesteel Hauberk, possibly in exchange for X (I suggested whacky off-hand-linked atk speed).
But that is just one of the things I suggested; any alternatives?
I have no idea. Game balance was in a great place in 1.1.3.0. Some specs/outliers needed to be adjusted, but that’s it. Instead it’s a different game every patch now so I really don’t know. You will get x or y nerfed but then next patch there is another round of buffs to some bosses/nemeses and suddenly that x or y nerf that made sense before has now made your build trash.
Yeah, I heard echoes of that. Shit was ridiculous even when it was released with those “fixed” values tho.
So if we’re saying Cyclone & Co. only became OP with 1.1.4.0, we’re kind of back to the Thermite Mine issue, right? Because that seems to me to have been the biggest change for these builds…
Nope, I meant that game balance was in a good place: like Crucible/Shattered Realm difficulty, less bugs, etc. Cyclone was OP before 1.1.4.0. I mean, I was one of the first people who posted a Vindicator based on that set.
Thanks, & sorry for spamming – I’m still a bit of a forum newbie
Jesus, people, I’m not trying to walk over builds here and nerf-stomp them into the ground! All I want is balance. A Cyclone set that still does Crucible in 6:30, beats high shards & is a ton of fun to play (I really love the playstyle).
So I’m being a little self-critical in regards to the builds I play/sets I use. And when I find something that I feel is not quite balanced (and, yes, this feeling might coincide with that of Zantai & Co. a little more than with others), I try to think of a way to change it. Then – if I can – I try to actually test the changes I thought of. To see if they are, in fact, reasonable or not. Because I’m pretty sure that, as much as they might want to, the people balancing this game really don’t have the time do that with every single build/item.
But before I really start shouting here, maybe we can get back to some actual reasoning.
I only tested Cyclone EoR & followed a few build threads on EoR stuff, but I’m pretty sure the skill itself is fairly balanced right now. The reason Cyclone is a little broken is because of something/everything else coming with it here; and I stand by the viewpoint that nerfing damage conversion might be a viable way to counteract this fact.
