update and my dissapointment with it and general rant

FoI cannot even past SR 75 and it gets nerfed while AAR stays untouched why?

It’s fine to have an opinion, but you should also be open to change if your opinion is based on false speculation, and not concrete facts.

Yes it can. It can do naked crucible with ease, which means at least SR 77 - 80. I’ll post my build when it’s ready.

AAR has been nerfed too. Not enough IMO, but it’s been hit with several nerfs in both 1.1.5 and

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Well, it’s particular Problem(if you want to call it problem at all) which Grim Dawn / Crate face because they introduced two Tiers of “Uniques”. You can’t make Blue Items as Powerfull as Purple Items, because than Purple would lose it’s value and we could scrap the Item-Tier / Rarity alltogether.

That’s why atleast i never thought for Blue / Epics to be proper Endgame-Gear. Maybe some Niche-Items which fill Niche Rolls, but never to be on the same level or better than Legendary. Because if they would do that, the “Legendary” in Purple Items wouldn’t make any sense anymore. I thought for Blue’s since the beginning that this Items are “Journey-Items” which follows your side until you achieved a certain level where you slowly progress to swap them out for Legendary. Similiar how Magic/Yellow works with Greens / Rare’s. That’s kinda a more “Natural Progression” to me.

For me it also never sounded that Crate wanted to update Epics to be on the same Level as Purples, but rather to polish and overhaul them so the Journey / Leveling (playing Campaign) feels better / more varied, and to have a smoother transition between blue and purple.

/Edit: I’ve to add, Green / Rares (MI’s) are on a different spot, because they aren’t uniques but Randomized Items with Affixes. It does make sense for them to have the potential, if you are lucky with the rolls, to get items which are as strong or better than Purples. And even than it’s a trade off for having better stats instead of some unique boni which Purples have.

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Incorrect. Blues have some of the best standalone items for the slots. Some blues are still trash for no reason tho.

Agreed about Rotgeist. But its problems, melee side of it, are awkwardness of PS spam with low AS and unconverted Torrent, the set itself has nothing to do with it.

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Blue items were never ever meant to be as powerful as the purples. Some of them may have great stats for your current character level and can be a cool placeholder until you find a better item.

The same argument applies to why yellows are not as powerful as greens (and yet, some are amazing at lower levels) etc.

The boost to the blue items though, I enjoy as I am one of those players that experiment with different playstyles. For example I have characters that I only allow yellow items. Ditto for white, green and blue etc. (Hell, even CLASSLESS)

The community that play their own defined challenges appreciate the new blue item stats, especially if they are running a character that they limit to blue items only!

Not every character and item have to be god-like in the game. If that was so, then what would be the point of build experimentation and progression?

If you need that sort of simplified play style then you don’t have to look much further than the unspeakable horror of the well known dumbed down disaster of D…3 !


I agree with your points, but is there a reason as to why you’re replying to me?

I think what makes blues great are the stats they offer. Eastern set comes to mind, for example.

Another advantage is the conversion they bring.

However, they fall short of purps because of a lack of skill mods. So where they shine is if you can fit a 2 piece epic set to benefit from the set bonus stats, or use a stand-alone item for conversion.

@MikeHeydon: No need for apologies mate

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LOL - not sure who to reply to on this site sometimes. It was just that your comments were correct for the topic and I just clicked on the reply. Maybe I should have clicked the reply on the top topic?

Apologies, but your comments were right on target.

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This is part of what I was looking out for on the blues change as well - for them to support or open up the possibility of niche builds that currently aren’t supported by Legendaries (even some random skill bonuses in places would go a long way).

The other thing I’ve noticed in the blues re-evaluation is that parts of them that were literally never used or touched before have been rightfully removed, e.g. that Aether Spellbinder off hand that for some reason also has pet damage on it? The pet damage is gone now.


I recall Zantai saying that the intention wasn’t to make blue items as powerful as purple. Mostly they wanted to make the epic tire a good option for leveling and for budget endgame builds. Most early-game epics particularly were so underwhelming that you would rather use a yellow item. I think that this patch indeed improved most of them. I’m seeing myself equipping more blue items than before. So, honestly, I think that the main point of your rant is kind of moot.

And for me, any build that can go beyond SR70 is is on a healthy spot.

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  1. At no point did we say that was the plan, so if that was your expectations, you’ve misinterpreted the previews.

Epics were always intended as entry-level items that serve as a stepping stone to build-defining Legendaries or exceptional Monster Infrequents. What we did do though is update Epics to better serve that role and give players still progressing a leg up into the endgame (and a more enjoyable leveling experience through better drops).

  1. Cooldown Reduction and Attack/Cast Speed are incredibly potent attributes that are given out with great care.

  2. With Conversions availability, there are limits to how much gear exists and how it interacts with masteries/other gear. We can’t just throw Conversion on every item and hope for the best. Conversion can make or break builds and can stifle how certain items are used if placed carelessly.

  3. Rotgheist and Radaggan are doing what they were made to do. That said, Rotgheist is getting some Energy Regeneration soon.

  4. FoI literally got big buffs in v1.1.5.0, so only thing I can think of is a nerf to a very specific Inquisitor conduit necklace, which was warranted.


I think that perhaps lowering some of the epic lvl requirements might be something to look at, though.

Are the 50/75/94 barriers arbitrary in GD? What if you made epics 5 levels lower?

Balance - I suppose. But they often seem like they would be more exciting as a 5-10 level gap-filler. I know there are various tiers of epics, but so many seem to be “over-priced” in terms of level restrictions and effective use by the time a character qualifies. Compared to the alternative gear, that is.

An example off the top of my head:

  • The 3-pc Eastern Robes set is available at lvl 58 and it’s pretty strong for that lvl with a lot of bonuses for that level (can allow for full overcapped TSS base node with other stuff). This is good.
  • Something like the 72 tier 5-pc Unholy Covenant set is very underwhelming (even individually) for lvl 72 and 5 piece is probably just as hard as some of the 4-piece legendary sets to find. This is bad for this higher level. But at level 60, it might be interesting and not so bad.
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Don’t forget there are some at 82 and 84 as well. Faction epics and rares come at 90 too.

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thanks for the reply Z. I appriciate the idea behind of what you guys decision making is.

when it comes to conversions I feel like adding more conversion types would allow unorthodox class combos to merge from the shadows like apostate. You can see that in the build compendium there is bigillion warlords, shieldbreakers, infiltrators but not that many apostates etc… maybe you guys want to do what you did with morgo set and reaper to those under performing class combos.

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You still need to consider natural class synergies. Defiler got blightlord and you still don’t see defilers here cause the synergy just sucks. That’s the same with stuff like Apostate where binder is just better for most aether and ritualist/cabalist is better for most vit. Bonemonger apostate is quite good tho, there’s just not much updated builds.

Morgo set had to stuff in a lot of stuff just to make reaper look good. And even then trickster is a better fit for it imo.

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Idea of blue items often is to act as temporarily replacement of legendary gear or to be used for leveling. Very often proper blade can be better than inappropriate purple.

As for conversion most of the unique builds that rely on it are dependent on weapons for conversion. You said no elemental to chaos? Well Blood Orb have 100%.

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You can also net 50 - 70% ele/chaos conversion using voidsoul

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My Cold TSS Druid is a counterpoint to points 1 and 3. It uses no less than 5 blue items, and is an example of what can happen if conversion is made too easily available. It can be dangerous if it allows for skills with multiple damage types that aren’t designed to be fully converted to reach that point.

There are some inaccuracies in op but I agree with the general tone of the thread. has been fantastic when it comes to new content but (imo) a big fail when it comes to the intricacies of balance changes. Too many things to count. LET THE RANT BEGIN. :ghost:

  • 3 Wendigo Totems competes with the Mortar conduit for the title of the biggest blunder. The former was fixed but the fact it even happened is telling. The latter wasn’t even hot-fixed. Slap in the face to all the legit players who had grinded for this conduit just to see copy-pasted stats and a mod that’s basically a blank.

  • The two biggest dps freaks - AAR and Mortars - nerfed defensively instead of offensively. (AAR wpn dmg nerf - the biggest nerf - is a hit to sustain mostly, and the biggest change on Mortars is the -60-70% res and -3% max res because of no Conduit). World record on AAR beaten after the hotfix (second nerf) which is telling. Lightning Mortars stronger than ever (just glassy af without the conduit).

  • From lightning, Box was nerfed of all places. Best lightning vindicators hardly felt anything. Top-tier power creep continues. It’s ONLY the niche builds that felt this one.

  • The Revamp of the Million Blues… Most popular endgame blue Final March buffed. Archetypical blue Bero removed from endgame. Many blue sets removed from endgame except a few surprises like Eastern getting even more oa. Silver Sentinel nerfed, power RoH still got no alternative concept (but 11th set for Shadow Strike). Weird stuff. With some exceptions, blues that were already strong and good for endgame were buffed, and those that desperately needed something to be viable were nerfed to endgame irrelevance.

  • Phew, and this isn’t even half of it! Just two more. Explosive Strike. As if there wasn’t another abusable mechanic just two nodes away… FoI conduit, not a biggie like the Mortar thing but also kind of a blind nerf: “FoI got strong? Grab the first thing and hit ‘em!” (Fact is only Solael crossbow setups got strong after FoI buffs, other users of that conduit didn’t, so it’s not the conduit. Btw that “strong” FoI is still strong, and others are still crap.)

  • Okay, okay… one more. But a big one. None of the arcanist overbuffs reverted. Freaking sorcerer melee is stronger that saboteur, etc.

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mate…you realize that most of your rant (while valid) is tangential to the points made by OP, yes?

This isn’t true. I’ve been tinkering away at my arcanor mageslayer. It does ~6:30 buffed bannered, and about 9min naked with ~80% consistency.

That’s good imo

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It’s consistent with the title, though, isn’t it?

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