Hi,
I have 400h in the game but no complete sets because I’m constantly re-rolling (aka altoholic). I want to bring a character to max level though with which I will farm the campaign and SR.
My question is whether or not a Physical Blade Arc build without any supporting set is possible or easily out-classed by Forcewave? It seems Forcewave (even with Tremor) just has way more damage by default and even much more AoE, leaving Blade Arc useless unless you play a damage over time build.
I recall there’s also a pierce Blade Arc around if you want try something outside of physical, forgot who made it. In terms of raw power, Blade Arc is way above any Forcewave build.
I believe you can, besides, the lvl 90 faction item armor have many that support blade arc and forcewave if you dont have many item. Can’t check on the grimtools yet as it is currently on maintenance
I can’t tell because grimtools is on maintenance, but doesn’t that build use specific build-enabling items?
Anyway, I don’t know if I miscalculated but Forcewave seems to have much higher DPS (with Tremor) than Blade Arc given the same weapon damage and ignoring any other gear. Can anyone confirm?
Nope, you don’t need to use any of those items to be effective. Those are just the best possible options. Also GT is loading fine for me.
Blade Arc can reach upwards of 180k DPS, something Forcewave can never reach. Not to mention 110k+ flat damage on Blade Arc, while Forcewave is glad to reach like 60k.
Blade Arc is currently the strongest physical skill. Physical Forcewave can’t touch it. As for if it’s a thing without specific gear support, nothing in GD is a thing without specific gear support.
That can’t be right, as Blade Arc only gets 78 flat physical from Laceration while Forcewave has ~176 (with Tremor factor). Also, Rending Force gives Forcewave +175% Physical Damage.What am I missing?
Blade Arc has much higher weapon damage.
On higher levels enemies tend to surround you more and more and Blade Arc being a multitarget circle attack leaves Forcewave far behind.
Blade Arc currently is the only viable skill for pure 2H melee action. Even builds based on dmg types which are not supported by Soldier are strong.
But yeah, getting extra ranks in the base skill is vital, especially for physical dmg.
Blade Arc has 165% while Forcewave has 200%
Blade Arc has 245% with skill mods. Laceration is also much more than 78 physical damage on ultimate ranks.
But that’s comparing apples to oranges. Assume that both skills are at the same rank. Sorry which skill mods do you mean that would make it 245%? I am getting my numbers from grimtools.
Gutsmasher and Mythical Unchained Grasp. Having used both in several builds, Blade Arc has a much higher damage threshold compared to Forcewave.
You are also missing conversion from Blade Arc related items, which greatly increase the amount of flat damage Blade Arc can achieve. Forcewave items don’t have much conversion.
Okay, so TLDR is Forcewave is stronger than Blade Arc if you do not have any gear, but Blade Arc can reach much higher damage with good gear?
Nope, Blade Arc is stronger regardless if no items or with appropriate items. If anything, Forcewave needs more support than Blade Arc to have adequate damage.
That doesn’t seem to be the case if you just compare the numbers in grim tools
You are looking at numbers and not actual ingame experience. Giant difference coming from experience of playing both.
You are also either doing wrong math or underestimating the effect of Tremor. Tremor has a way more negative effect than you are leading on. It’s why there’s such a gap of damage between both skills.
That’s true, and Forcewave has much higher AoE making it arguably better in gameplay.
I can share my formula, though I doubt anyone wants to check it, just sharing it anyway.
Forcewave: =(B1*1.45 + (199+258)/2*2.75)*B2*0.77
B1 is weapon damage, 1.45 is Weapon Damage multiplier (including Tremor), 2.75 is Physical Damage multipler from Rending Force, B2 is attacks per second and 0.77 is “Total damage modified by -33%” from Tremor.
Blade Arc: =(B1*1,65+78)*B2
A bit simpler, B1 is weapon damage and B2 is attacks per second.
If B1 is 400 and B2 is 3, Forcewave deals 2791 DPS while Blade Arc deals 2214 DPS (Physical only, ignoring DoT, although adding DoT does still make Forcewave come out on top).
And it doesn’t. Blade Arc has much higher AoE than Forcewave, at least in melee range. Forcewave hits in a straight path in front of your character, while Blade Arc hits in a 280 Degree Arc up to 8 targets.
The 33% Total Damage modified penalty is at the end of calculations, so the penalty is much higher. It doesn’t just eat flat physical damage on the skill itself, but every other source that goes to Forcewave as well. Your math is probably wrong.
Again, looking at numbers is pointless. There are so many other factors that go well beyond simple numbers. Me and others have tested both supported and unsupported for both skills and Blade Arc has an higher damage ceiling regardless.
I feel this conversation is getting kind of pointless, so pick whatever you want. As long as you have fun.
Apparently 1-0.33 is 0.67 and not 0.77 
Anyway, including % increased physical damage from gear, Blade Arc does scale slightly higher, so you’re right and I made a mistake. Important to note that without any gear on, they are roughly equal, while Blade Arc scales much better because its bonuses do not get the *0.67 multiplier.