Drop Rates and Game Balance Discussion

Is it only me or is this guy just trying to tell the DEVELOPER to stfu because he knows better than the DEVELOPER and the DEVELOPER doesn’t know shit about a game he DEVELOPED. Or in other words, a child is teaching their father how to make kids.

Just what the fuck…?

A child could teach their father how to make kids though. There are a good number of scenarios where that would make perfect sense. Like, infedility on the mother’s part, sperm banks, teaching how to make kids in a test tube, father was drugged and the sex happened without his knowledge etc…

no its just you xD

And the conversation gets weird again. Before briarthorn asses and now this. I’m watching you.

Me too. This conversation seems to be getting a long way from comparisons between the base game, AoM and FG items.

1 Like

:o

But… there isn’t anything weird about glowing briarthorn butts. I am picturing something like fireflies have. Green/Yellow soft glow. I also wouldn’t be against making them a bit more rounder.

Or atleast give them a tail or a bit of fur, but you know, made of leaves and branches and stuff.

As it stands now, their butts seem odd with the rest of their body. As if… there is something missing, a void that needs to be filled.

Alternatively, I will take illusions for pets so that I can transofrm all of them into mini Kubacabras :smiley:

On a serious note though, will pet illusions be ever a potential possibility, Crate?

I hope not. If you want to dress up your pet play Monster Hunter World. :stuck_out_tongue:

T_T

Well… I remember seeing a new pet that looked like a raptor in FG, so I guess Monster hunter is coming over here instead :cool:

There are 411 legendary items in the game at reqlvl 94, of which 196 are divided amongst 50 sets.

103 legendary items are craftable, although blueprint drops are a bitch without the crucible dlc (or just gdstashing yourself to unlock all recipes, which I find an actually reasonable way to live.)

Now, the problem is not that drops are too low. No. the problem is that the drops are extremely diluted, and the discrepancy is way too big.

Yes, Crucible gladiator can get you great amount of drops in a reasonable time IF you have a gladiator farmer, which needs a set which needs a crucible farmer to get in a reasonable time. In fact, given the glad rewards and the effectiveness of average (sub-8min but preferably 7min or less) crucible farmers with multiple legendary drops per run, you get to the drop rate of…

Yes, crucible has 3 to 5 minutes per high tier legendary. (Yes, even level 94 legendaries are divided between common and rare pools) Not uniques, not your 95th copy of The Final March or Sellecor’s Shoes or Shellshock Epaulets. I’m talking about warborn, valguur’s, Malakor’s, Runebinders, Ultos, and the good stuff.

so I guess you want crucible drops to be nerfed to one legendary every second 150-170 run to match campaign (Usual rate of 1 unique + 4ish epics per 12-15 mins)?

Now the real problem with this current campaign drop rate is that it locks you out of most builds due to how the power of many builds you see are locked behind select, impossibly hard to get gear without any kind of intervening steps to get there. In fact, many skills flat out aren’t viable without specific sets. OFF is a prime example. You either have mageslayer’s (or the other legendary amulets which give less -%freeze res), or you don’t use it. Same goes to all channeled skills (due to how their design doesn’t fit grim dawn’s game flow and adds additonal attribute dependency that makes gearing / building all the more difficult), Briarthorn/Hellhound (1point distractions or aura posts without set).

Raven is strong but half it’s power is locked behind one of the 411 legendaries. You heard me, exactly half. It still is strong enough to get you through the regular bosses (Although legion voidcutter does a lot in these scenarios since the dramatically lower clearspeed makes you get hit more often which triggers the good proc, which will be nerfed to the ground to make sure non-necro pet builds don’t have reliable crutches of the same potency as hagaraz.)

Oh yeah, and you can’t transmute for mythical will of bysmiel either, since it’s not a set piece. Celestial Smith: I have yet to calculate the expected wendigo spirit cost at Bella Fald for getting the amulet I want, but it’s anywhere between 450 and 600. Forgotten Gods will only make that worse unless the crafting cost is cut by a thirdsixth or so.

Now, one thing about droprate that needs to be mentioned is faction gear. You get revered, and you get some sweet stuff for that level. And yes, level 90 game is in every way easier than level 100 if you have not the top end gear, since enemy stats go up ten levels in that interval, while you stagnate at the same faction gear. Because there is only a very small chance that you get what you want in that time, even if you do BoC and SoT runs.

But hey, you know some of you mentioned Lokarr, Roguelikes and crucible for pinata-ing and completing your sets. You know what? Show me the faction and affixless/common affix MI/ cheap blues builds that you have for farming them. And also show the clear speeds, piloting, and looting too, so we can all have a taste of the build variety that exists even before BiS hits the fan.

Grim Dawn is a “diablo-like”. Diablo-likes inhabit the Arpg genre. Emphasis on the A, for Action. More specifically than that, diablo’s are strongly about the loot hunt and the character building aka theory-crafting (or were, until D3) and it’s roots are strongly tied to the rogue-like genre which carries a strong tie-in to RNG and to “grinding”.

If you want an RPG that’s what Final Fantasy is for. Nothing wrong with that but I’d rather keep the soap opera out of my diablo’s. When I want Final Fantasy I play Final Fantasy.

Gladiator 151-170 typically yields 8 legendaries. On a typical crucible build it ends up being between 1 and 1.5 per minute.

That’s also not entirely accurate. If the alternate was wearing no amulet at all, and you used no other skills, and didn’t bind a Celestial Power to Familiar then sure, but between Primal Spirit, Blizzard, and other amulet options like the Eldritch Conduit with familiar affix or Sovereign Ruby of Domination the difference in build performance is nowhere near double, it’s 25% at most.

Regardless, I do get what you’re saying about it being hard to farm all gear you need when starting from scratch. The ironic point is that if you are already a skilled Crucible pilot then you can farm Crucible with crappy gear, but to get enough piloting experience to do that you need to start by practicing with builds that are already fully geared and more robust/powerful. The fact that it can be done doesn’t usually help those who would benefit from doing it.

I don’t really know what could/should be done better. The end game of pretty much every ARPG is “farm items to complete a build to farm items faster, at which point you don’t need to farm anymore”

There are plenty of such builds posted in the build compendium IX (http://www.grimdawn.com/forums/showthread.php?t=79419) under “Builds for Beginners”.
When the Forgotten Gods is out, I will release 6 or so more such builds :wink: If you are interested in previews, PM me. I know someone else was working on another build as well.

Also you have the Krieg Set that is farmable in Elite (you target Valaxteria, Terrnox and Fleshwarped Krieg once you are level 94 or higher, in elite, yes) perfect start for any solider, necro or arcanist based build (I kinda wish there were more sets like Krieg set… like its farmable but its still not top top tier things)

BTW the amulet that gives +1 summon limit on Summon Familar (the Raven) is in the list of possible legendary quest rewards. I think I have gotten 4 or 5 of that one just by playing many chars lol

Amen brother!

While i’m all for making Cunning and Spirit more attractive, that’s a terrible idea. The entire game isn’t built around the three stats, they are a very small part of an huge puzzle. Making so going full Physique means you do no damage is a terrible, atrocious idea.

Not to mention, every mastery gives points in all three stats. Every build has cunning and spirit investment to an extent.

Also, the Diablo games are also guilty of this. Vitality is the preferred stat and the one a lot of people invest the most.

I was talking about the drop rate while playing through the campaign. Not sure what that has to do with crucible at all, the drop rate is higher there, just like it is when I farm bosses / roguelike dungeons. So no, this does not mean I want to drastically reduce the Crucible drop rate

Now the real problem with this current campaign drop rate is that it locks you out of most builds due to how the power of many builds you see are locked behind select, impossibly hard to get gear without any kind of intervening steps to get there.

that is not a problem, as you do not need such a build to complete the campaign. The build shows you the optimum you can attain, not what you should reasonably expect your gear to be with no effort.

Grim Dawn 2 with Unreal Engine 4, sounds like a good dream to me.
Let’s make it happen! :slight_smile:

1 Like

100% aggree with that… Would be a wonderful game if it wasnt for the stupid low drop rate for legendary… Incredible! Makes you want to quit playing this otherwise great game… Devs should do something about that.

LOOOL… After countless hours of play, always the same legendary drops!. Impossible to complete a set. New feature to transmute for another piece of a set is trash. You can craft a helm and transmute for other pieces of the set, but you have to play 10000 hours to gather the mats to make the fucking helm…

Low drop rates are part of the incentive to play. You may have played for 1000 h and there still something to find, achieve, check out.

this discussion is like a bizzaro world to me.

Drop rates are too high. I played for maybe several hours after the new patch and already got a number of legednaries I never saw before. It’s bonkers