[Feedback/suggestion] Sets dedicated to DB fall short of non-set DB builds

[sir_spanksalot]

Over the past month, I’ve tested the 3 sets dedicated to DB (i.e. rah’zin/harbinger deceiver, voidsoul sentinel, and clairvoyant’s cabalist)- failing far more often than succeeding.

And no matter which way I try to optimize this puzzle of a spec, non-set DB builds win every single time.

The reason for this being is that by breaking the item set, you get to maximise the strongest thing on DB - i.e. DB spam (assuming, of course, that you can find the energy to sustain it).

But more specifically, each of the 3 aforementioned sets fail in more specific ways.

Harbinger:

Nothing wrong with this set at all. It’s just not going it to be a top tier spec.

My one complaint is that you simply don’t have the energy to sustain 26/16 DB on a deceiver, forcing you to use DB as 1 pointer for the occassional nuke/unreliable source of RR.

Suggestion: Adding reduced energy cost to DB on the 3 piece set bonus would be nice

Voidsoul:

Literally offers you no CDR anywhere on any of the 4 set items. This in and of itself would be fine if the damage provided was substantial. Sadly, this is not the case. Using DB on reaper felt like shining a laser pointer at the paw of a kitten.

Furthermore, the lack of AoE on voidsoul’s DB makes it cringe-worthy.

I suppose the design philosophy was meant to have aegis or FoI compensate for crowd clearing but… both those skills have they own unique set of issues.

Solution: Give DB enough damage to make it live up to its name, or give it enough CDR to make it truly terrifying

Clairvoyant: Aether cabalist GT

Preface: This build was aimed at trying to stick to the true intention of clairvoyant’s design for the cabalist - i.e. reap spirit + DB nuker. I also wanted to use aether Bone Harvest to somewhat try and make a pet/caster hybrid (@maya - Would you even consider this a hybrid?)

Results - (3 + 1) clear in 7min 30s

My favorite of the 3 DB dedicated sets, clairvoyant’s makes DB a force to be reckoned with.

My issue with this set actually lies with reap spirit.

As you can see in the GT, 26/16 reap spirit does 300% WD with approximately 1200 flat aether damage.

This is essentially negligble for 2 reasons:

• Reap spirit only hits a single target
• Its damage as a single target skill is just underwhelming.

All things considered, aether bone harvest here feels like it does more work than reap spirit does which surprised me.

Suggestion: what would be really cool here is if clairvoyant could transmute reap spirit into a player scaled pet.

[mad_lee]

Solid suggestion, Spanks.

It’s what I kept telling about skills with long ass cooldown. They should nuke HARD. Because otherwise they can’t compete with spam-spells and melee/ranged autoattacks. 300% wd + 1200 flat with 2,5s cd sounds great untill you realize that you can dish out 5x that amount in the same time frame with auto-attacks or spam spells or even dot spells.

[sir_spanksalot]

untill you realize that you can dish out 5x that amount in the same time frame with auto-attacks or spam spells or even dot spells.

Or until you realize how easy it is to miss with reap spirit when every single target is pinballing off each other

[Maya]

(@maya - Would you even consider this a hybrid?)

Personally, no. Since it doesn’t look like the Pet is contributing much to the total DPS given the rather low pet bonuses.

But I am more or less convinced at this point that a proper pet hybrid is not possible, so we can call it one if you want

[sir_spanksalot]

DON’T YOU PATRONIZE ME, YOU BIRB.

Tbh, I kinda think of the pets as DoT? That way I won’t have to waste nukes on trash that’s already low

[Maya]

DON’T YOU PATRONIZE ME, YOU BIRB.

Tbh, I kinda think of the pets as DoT? That way I won’t have to waste nukes on trash that’s already low

[Nery]

Nice suggestions, Spanks!

I have tried myself few DB builds, but you can’t see them posted in the forum

Chaos DB: Problem with this cult version is high energy cost and lack of unified support to it. Also DB isn’t as usual enough nuke to carry the build, you need more. But chaos don’t have many piano damaging skills, AoE item/devotion procs. For example Oblivion/DB in my test was 8+ minutes in Crucible. Void Soul without CD should not even support DB in my mind.

[xOMOCHIx]

+1. As I mentioned when I gave Clairvoyant feedback a few days ago, RS + DB is clumsy. I want some buff.

Suggestion: what would be really cool here is if clairvoyant could transmute reap spirit into a player scaled pet.

I’m glad if this happens, but Z has denied it in the past.

[IDEA]Item to convert pet bonus reference

I’d rather just make all pets player scaling than make up such a complicated and easily abused mechanic. (That first thing is not happening at this point. The current system is way too ingrained in the game’s mechanics)

[sir_spanksalot]

I’m glad if this happens, but Z has denied it in the past.

[IDEA]Item to convert pet bonus reference Ideas and Feedback

I’d rather just make all pets player scaling than make up such a complicated and easily abused mechanic. (That first thing is not happening at this point. The current system is way too ingrained in the game’s mechanics)

T_T

Welp. Maybe the necro side of things could be changed to something else besides reap spirit then. I wouldn’t mind if it did support aether bone harvest. That would be pretty cool too.

[Nordos]

I would like a rework of Reap spirit, personally. It is a jack of all trades, master of none - basically, it wants:

• pet damage
• %aether modifier
• high weapon damage

And it needs kind of all of it to be really good, yet for most builds it is already hard to combine two of these aspects (a dedicated caster often has low WD, and next to no pet support), in which case Reap Spirit falls short by a lot. In my humble opinion, Reap Spirit should outshine a Doom Bolt in Single Target damage when you go full caster, but that isn’t the case (anyone who played the clarivoyant set should know that Doom Bolt deals more damage against bosses than reap spirit)

[sir_spanksalot]

I think reap spirit should be solely a pet skill if you ask me. it’s not like pet players are drowning in excess build diversity.

Unless you count @maya who just straight up does weird shit because he/she/birb can

[Evil_Baka]

basically, it wants:

• pet damage
• %aether modifier
• high weapon damage

And it needs kind of all of it to be really good

You can build Reap Spirit to focus on the caster part (2nd/3rd point in your list) ignoring the first point or use it on a pet user for the first point and ignore the others.

Nothing about it says that you have to do all 3. When you pick up any other skill like Phantasmal Blades, do you try to build equally around the Pierce, Bleed, Vitality, Cold and Chaos damage? No, you pick the ones that interest you and either convert the others or ignore/deal with them and take what is useful to you.

In my humble opinion, Reap Spirit should outshine a Doom Bolt in Single Target damage when you go full caster, but that isn’t the case (anyone who played the clarivoyant set should know that Doom Bolt deals more damage against bosses than reap spirit)

As of now, I think of Clairvoyant as putting more of an emphasis on AAR/Doom Bolt here with Reap Spirit as secondary support. So, I can understand Doom Bolt hitting harder.

Diviner is a set that really puts the emphasis on Reap Spirit and tries to make it into a primary skill. It even helps casters build up weapon damage some more with the free 50% Elemental/Vitality damage converted to Aether which pairs perfectly with Soul Harvest.

[sir_spanksalot]

@Evil_Baka: With all due respect, I did try my best to maximize reap spirit here. The GT is in the OP.

However, it still feels very underwhelming

[Evil_Baka]

I agree that Reap Spirit on Clairvoyant is underwhelming, and that’s natural if you ask me when you compare what Diviner does for it (not as much damage but still good amount, flat CDR instead of RNG CDR, great conversion). That’s what I was getting at.

I actually wouldn’t be opposed to Clairvoyant swapping Reap Spirit support out for Aether Bone Harvest either and leaving Reap Spirit spam to Diviner.

[Valinov]

i dont believe ive ever shared this build with anyone on pm’s but this probably is a good place to leave it.
https://www.grimtools.com/calc/JVl6LoxN

[sir_spanksalot]

i don’t understand why you don’t just use the diviner’s offhand for perfect vit conversion. You’ll also more or less get the same CD on DB, well further benefiting reap spirit.

[Evil_Baka]

i don’t understand why you don’t just use the diviner’s offhand for perfect vit conversion.

To be honest, I was actually just thinking about the Chaos->Aether conversion on the Shoulders/Chest. Looking at yours and Valinov’s Cabalists, you don’t really take advantage of it (hell, both of you put more points into Second Rite than Solael’s Witchfire).

What would be your opinion on changing the conversion from Chaos->Aether to something else like Vitality->Aether instead?

Completely unrelated to the topic: Since when does Chain Lightning have 70% weapon damage? Might have to start toying around with that.

[sir_spanksalot]

hell, both of you put more points into Second Rite than Solael’s Witchfire

Greater flat on second rite + vit res…but you’re probably well aware of this

What would be your opinion on changing the conversion from Chaos->Aether to something else like Vitality->Aether instead?

I’d leave the shoulders as it is as some builds may be reliant on them for conversion, but change the 4 set modifier on DB to 100% vit to aether.

I also wish clairvoyant helm would add something sexy to DB. Both AAR and reap spirit are given 2x skill modifiers on the items, and an additional third upon set completion.

DB just has 2.

Furthermore, the reap spirit modifier on the clairvoyant helm worse than worthless. I would rather it be not there so it doesn’t clutter my screen when I mouse over the hat.

Since when does Chain Lightning have 70% weapon damage?

Since always

[Evil_Baka]

I’d leave the shoulders as it is as some builds may be reliant on them for conversion, but change the 4 set modifier on DB to 100% vit to aether.

Didn’t think of changing the conversion on Doom Bolt’s modifier. Would definitely be easier and make sense. +1.

Furthermore, the reap spirit modifier on the clairvoyant helm worse than worthless. I would rather it be not there so it doesn’t clutter my screen when I mouse over the hat.

Agreed. I would move the modifier to another niche/underused Legendary for anyone crazy enough to try and do a Vitality Decay caster, as i’d say Clairvoyant really does not support Vitality damage well/is all about Aether nukes. Would be better if Clairvoyant Hat adds more steroids to Reap Spirit there.

Since always

I swear for the longest time it had like 35 or 40% weapon damage and was neglected by everyone (like Acid Purge) .

[sir_spanksalot]

i’d say Clairvoyant really does not support Vitality damage well/is all about Aether nukes

Yes and no: https://www.grimtools.com/calc/O2G4xrnV - the scepter is actually the best item for vit DB spam.

I think this might give @superfluff’s DB spammer a run for its money.

EDIT: I do wish the %vit on the scepter was of equal value to its aether counterpart though

Would be better if Clairvoyant Hat adds more steroids to Reap Spirit there.

That or #aetherHarvesterOfBoners

I swear for the longest time it had like 35 or 40% weapon damage and was neglected by everyone (like Acid Purge)

You might be right. Either way, it’s been changed for some time though.