[Feedback] Warborn Cadence is still bad (examples with videos inside)

[Maya]

Meanwhile Physical Pets be like

[mad_lee]

Meanwhile Physical Pets be like

that timer is a bit depressing, lol

[Maya]

Meanwhile Physical Pets be like

that timer is a bit depressing, lol

Yup

[romanN1]

Sure. Pls send me the file

[mad_lee]

_Warlord_Cadence.zip (1.4 MB)

And the meme Dervish just for lolz

_Zoya the Dervish.zip (732.4 KB)

Another funny thing about those builds is that Warlord feels squishy despite War Cry and armor and whatnot. And Dervish feels like a wall, almost, lol.

[Superfluff]

And Dervish feels like a wall, almost, lol.

which is why JoV used BM for his hardest runs.

No surprise there

[mad_lee]

which is why JoV used BM for his hardest runs.

No surprise there

I have quite a bit of experience with melee Nightblades and with gimmicky melee Nightblades as well. Gimmicky ones always felt squishy, irregardless of damage output (like fire Dervish with two Souldblades and Justicar or custom Pierce Trickster).

Heck, I remember playing a tankier spec of Venomblade Dervish and it didn’t really feel as tanky.

But this Warborn Dervish feels very solid despite mediocre damage output, all while Warlord feels super shaky despite more fat on paper.

[Superfluff]

But this Warborn Dervish feels very solid despite mediocre damage output, all while Warlord feels super shaky despite more fat on paper.

if there is a good core, NB is a great defensive mastery. In your case your dervish has War cry basically so doesn’t need much soldier and gets nice stuff like Shadow dance. Not a bad trade at all, for this or other builds really

edit: and fumble!!!

[mad_lee]

Yeah, my guess is that Physical devotions/items synergize very well with Nightblade’s defenses. Like usually Nightblade’s dodge/evade/fumble alone are not enough to make a solid tanky melee char, but as soon as you add high armor + hp + damage reduction that comes together with Physical damage it becomes really really solid.

Eh, if only Physical damage wasn’t gimped by armor bug so much.

[Nery]

other physical builds are not very competitive

afaik, Physical BA with Gutsmasher does 6:30 and below. Phys FW should also be OK but need proofs from ones who played it (@Nery, I summon you).
Back to topic. Phys Cadence in a specially dedicated set does 7-7:30 in Cruci with 2 RRs in both masteries while Krieg Battlemage with 0 RR does sub 6 mins. Only this fact should say that something is very, VERY wrong with it.
And speaking about other types of damage, as I’ve said some posts above, cold Cadence may be on par with phys but elemental is still slower (even with vjuhs and procs) and chaos is 8-9 or more mins in cruci. So, I still insist that problem here is a bit more global rather then only in Warborn’s bad shape.

Physical Forcewave Warlord is more like 7 minutes in my playing but spamming skills are not my strong side, so probably should be little bit faster. Forcewave feels little weak compared to BA for physical but still you have better AoE.

[romanN1]

Back with more feedback on the two requested setups. The dervish indeed feels tankier due to the avoid and fumble. The warlord is tanky too, the problem is he kills stuff around way too slow thus you get hit more and leaves the impression he is not tanky when he in fact is.

[mad_lee]

Back with more feedback on the two requested setups. The dervish indeed feels tankier due to the avoid and fumble. The warlord is tanky too, the problem is he kills stuff around way too slow thus you get hit more and leaves the impression he is not tanky when he in fact is.

Sick testing, thanks! So timer is similiar to your Warlord, right?
And Dervish seems to be slower but not by much. Thanks a lot again.

[romanN1]

Yes, just about there. As always rng plays a huge roll on the final time.

[romanN1]

More testing coming with some improved setups.

Oleron spec

LoE spec

LoE spec tweaks for more damage

[mad_lee]

Oleron being worth defensively AND offensively, same old same old.

Interesting choice with Bear devotion, is it really worth it? Also, neat move with green +3 DM Kaisan, didn’t even know it could roll that.

Also, I guess because of the armor bug Seal of Mights are not so valuable, are they?

[romanN1]

Maul hits pretty hard and procs fairly often and helps with consistency as an extra layer of damage. Yeah the amulet is pretty BiS for maximizing cadence. I picked up double seal of blades mostly for the life leech and pierce rr, so i can further replace the life leech component on gloves with whatever was needed between ugdenbog leather or spellscorched.

[Temper]

Would it be possible to add a debuff to cadence or as a proc for set completion? Something that could provide -%phys resistance for attacked targets (i.e. that couldn’t be applied aoe) would improve single target damage without increasing aoe, doubling down on the set’s strengths and making it more competitive in MC and crucible. It would also open more build diversity, maybe encouranging non phys rr classes to build this way.

[Xervous]

This is mechanically impossible. You need an actual debuff to apply -XX% RR. As in the game engine simply can’t do it. You can get -XX RR, but not -XX%

[Evil_Baka]

Would it be possible to add a debuff to cadence

What Xervous said.

or as a proc for set completion?

Extremely unlikely if not impossible given it already has a player buff as it’s set completion bonus. At most, it could get it on one on the weapon or head but again, I doubt it’s going to happen.