Nice thread you have here. Would be a shame if it went like all the rest…
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Correct me if I’m wrong, but you don’t see physical Cadence among timed Celestial kills, MQ kills or dummy kills, either.
…often because they don’t know any better and play physical Cadence! 
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why calling them? I can prove it even by myself as lvling with Cadence (even more, I lvled with S&B - long ago) was my worst experience in GD. you have 1-3 targets while FW has long distance and BA has multiple targets.
Also, both FW and BA have in-built crit damage which Cadence has not.
Small word about other types of Cadence I’ve tested (all - slow and not impressing even in MC/SR):
- Elemental - has 1 transmuter and 1 weapon to be built around - Malakor’s Infusion. Just weak and outperformed but has 1 advantage - procs that do some helping job.
- Chaos - super-bad. Huge numbers of % and flat but it literally sucks. When it comes to fighting even 1 Reaper in Crucible (or, imagine, even MC/SR), it becomes an everlasting fight. But there are also other enemies and bosses around you. 2H is glassy af. S&B Witchblade with 2! green items (double-rare shield and defensive medal) is still too glassy for a “tanky” char.
- Cold - dunno. Never tried it but probably should also be worse than even ABB.
What I suggest, is to either add in-built Crit to Cadence, or add more targets to Cadence-related items.
I know about the suggestion to add targets to Fighting Form but I doubt that every build would have extra points to invest into it.
Speaking about Ele Cadence (small addition), some more (MORE) flat is welcomed.
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Good feedback, thanks, man!
It only really “works” works with Deathmarked set and it used to be pretty decent. But it has fallen behind the curve with Crucible buffs, melee nerfs and DM nerfs. I think right now it should be just ok. Power of the set and the mastery should still carry it somewhat.
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Anyone ever try lightning Cadence with Stormreaver?
yes, @AlexGoldFish_322 with Shattered Set on a Warder. It was super tanky and around 6:30 in Crucible timer. But I think you understand it wasn’t Cadence that carried that build.
Ummmm. Shattered set gives less damage than warborn for sure. Considering warborn still clears full facetank I don’t think it’s also the defense of SR set. But knowing alex, is it with pharma?
Sounds like the cookiest of cutters. LD would be better, I think. More Totem. Screw Cadence and +2 to soldier. Or normal Stormreaver vindicator with Savagery - but with soldier - would probably be better than Schmadence.
Perhaps not now but back during the AoM era, Physical Warborn Cadence was one of the builds shown capable of tackling Mogdrogen/all versions of Ravager and Crucible comfortably.
Let’s not remember how it was when the trees were big but judge by current state 
Crucible monsters go on a strike refusing to come out of their spawn holes to protest the abuse they receive at the hands of so called “pro builders” (they prefer the “pro butcher” moniker amongst themselves).
interesting definition of “fairly good”. Although I’d say it’s inherently better between 45-55 than 60+ assuming you get 55/55 earlier, due to how enemy scaling and skill point handout works.
I think he meant endgame gear, which is kinda the point of endgame gear, to trivialize MC.
Aand that is what I read once the words start flowing together and my eyes gloss over…
Would be nice if both WPS of Soldier change/buff into something more useful, overall they are both weak compare to others WPS.
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Came back with a different approach on this. Totally reverted from Divine mandate towards Oleron’s Rage thus getting more points into it for more damage. As for the way it feels, it actually feels better than divine mandate. You crit more often thus having better sustain compared to the Divine Mandate spec. Here’s a video with the GT link in the desc.
And it’s still able to do all those things, I’m sure, if you build it accordingly. But, on the other hand, most builds can do it if you build them accordingly. And 9 out of 10 of them will be faster than physical Cadence.
Or maybe we’re wrong? There are many things that people were convinced of for years that weren’t true. Like that 3+1 is the fastest tribute-sustainable way of farming Crucible. But if we are wrong and there indeed is a reason not to buff the most central skill in soldier mastery, the skill that should be a powerhouse of physical melee prowess, then what is it? Because as far we can see from builds posted, physical Cadence is one of the weakest melee builds save vitality, even chaos and aether - the dmg types associated with casters - are stronger at melee.
Idk if this is melee enough for you but even vitality is stronger.
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Hard to draw a line between what’s pure melee with procs and support skills and what’s a hybrid and what’s a caster with melee as sustain support… But the truth is that most melee builds have to hybridize with casting to some extent achieve better results. Maybe the fact that physical is very bad at that due to the armor problem (except your half-Octavius proccy paladin for some reason) is the reason why Cadence and other physical builds are not very competitive?
afaik, Physical BA with Gutsmasher does 6:30 and below. Phys FW should also be OK but need proofs from ones who played it (@Nery, I summon you).
Back to topic. Phys Cadence in a specially dedicated set does 7-7:30 in Cruci with 2 RRs in both masteries while Krieg Battlemage with 0 RR does sub 6 mins. Only this fact should say that something is very, VERY wrong with it.
And speaking about other types of damage, as I’ve said some posts above, cold Cadence may be on par with phys but elemental is still slower (even with vjuhs and procs) and chaos is 8-9 or more mins in cruci. So, I still insist that problem here is a bit more global rather then only in Warborn’s bad shape.
Hmmm…hmmmmmm…
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Thought you could outwit an onion eh?
Can you test my spec, please? I mean I know you want Oleron’s for AoE but I feel like my spec might be as fast in your hands. And should be safer.
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