Grim Dawn Version 1.1.6.0

I don’t get the lightning damage to cold here for pets. The skill bonuses encourage a Trickster but I don’t think I am picking Savage and the Storm Hound in a Trickster pet build over Primal Instincts even with the conversion. Further neither item really has bonuses for Occultists if I wanted to make cold Ravens instead. Meanwhile the only way to turn Primal Instinct Swarmling fire damage into cold damage is with a Dreeg Mark of Chills which has no Trickster skills on it but does have Occultist (and Inquisitor skills for some reason) on it instead.

Would it be possible to get one of the Winter King items changed to fire to cold conversion to play nicer with Primal Instincts since Tricksters do have fire damage pets but no lightning damage pets?

Nice nice nice UwU

Rank 20 of Fighting Form to get the 4th target on Cadence is way too high for most builds to achieve. Ultimate ranks of FF do almost nothing for most Cadence builds (10% damage every 3rd attack = 3% average damage) and most builds can’t afford to dump 8 points into a useless node. Factoring in +1 to soldier, most builds get targets 2 and 3 for 3.5-4 SP each.

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I rewatched the first season this week so that I’d be ready for today. Then…patch notes arrrrggghhh!!

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And we LIKED IT :slight_smile:

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There are three GD updates that I’m very disappointed with.

In version 1.0.0.9, the monster’s resistance to abnormal state has increased to 500%, and the play method of controlling the enemy has completely disappeared. Constellations share cooling time, and multiple triggers disappear.

Version 1.0.7.0: full of malice against the CDR flow mage. At that time, the mage reluctantly relied on this method to squeeze into the first echelon.

Version 1.1.6.0: throw many special effects equipment into the suit.

If all powerful builds are weakened, there will be less diversity. On the contrary, to ensure more effective play methods, there will inevitably be some very strong construction. Unless they are strong enough to destroy the whole game.

At present, the only one that really wants to destroy the balance of the game is the counterattack build, which is just like the official cheat machine. As long as you start this kind of play, you are almost invincible in the whole process and have no enemies.
如果所有强大的构建都削弱,会导致多样性减少。相反,要保证更多的玩法有效,就必然会出现一些很强大的构建。除非它们强大到足矣破坏整个游戏。
目前来看真想有可能破坏游戏平衡的只有反击构建,它就像官方作弊器一样,只要开始这种玩法,你几乎就是全程无敌,没有敌手。

In version 1.1.5.0, you seem to want to restrict counterattack construction by improving the healing recovery ability of monsters, but it actually backfires, which strengthens counterattack construction instead. Because the active attack ability of counterattack construction must be enough to kill the enemy, otherwise this system will not be established.
在1.1.5.0版本,你们似乎想通过提高怪物的治疗恢复能力来制约反击构建,但实际是适得其反的,这反而加强了反击构建。因为反击构建的的主动攻击能力必须足够杀死敌人,否则这个体系它就不成立了。
目前看来,要缓解这种不平衡,实际上是要降低怪物的治疗能力,并同时降低反击构建的输出能力。这可以让反击构建在拥有无与论比的生存能力时无法同时拥有足够的攻击能力,从而在保证它的体系成立的前提下不致于破坏平衡性。
At present, to alleviate this imbalance, it is actually to reduce the monster’s healing ability and the output ability of the counterattack build. This can make the counterattack construction not have enough attack ability at the same time when it has the survival ability without comparison with the theory, so as not to destroy the balance under the premise of ensuring its system is established.

However, this is only a temporary solution. The real reason is that you gave up the abnormal state system in version 1.0.0.9.
然而这也只是权宜之计,真正的原因在于1.0.0.9版本你们放弃了异常状态系统。
However, this is only a temporary solution. The real reason is that you gave up the abnormal state system in version 1.0.0.9. If the player can control monsters, the defense advantage of counterattack is no longer the best and only one, because all builds are in close combat and all people are looking for defense.
但这只是权宜之计,真正的原因是您放弃了1.0.0.9版本中的异常状态系统。如果玩家能够控制怪物,那么反击的防御优势就不再是最好的也是唯一的了,因为所有的建筑都处于近战状态,所有的人都在寻找防御。

What actually surprised me was the erosion of many regular builds. Especially the construction of many mage classes, such as Ray. I don’t quite understand why the Mingming defense is a relatively weak mage, so it always weakens his damage. In the case of poor survival ability, shouldn’t he get higher damage?
真正让我吃惊的是许多常规建筑的侵蚀。尤其是很多法师职业的建造,比如射线。我不太明白为什么明明防御是一个相对较弱的法师,所以它总是削弱他的伤害。在生存能力差的情况下,他不应该得到更高的伤害吗?
There are also some minor corrections, such as Reaver’s Claw. 20 physical damage is almost useless. Besides it will hurt my heart and make everyone unhappy, I don’t think it’s necessary.
还有一些无关痛痒的修正,比如掠夺者之爪。20点物理伤害几乎就没有作用了。它除了会刺痛一下我的心,让大家不高兴一下,除此之外真是没有必要。

As I mentioned more than half a month ago, a lot of forum construction is focused on speed. The output calculation method of GD is linear. When marginal income is increasing, the more marginal the growth is. The output capacity of four buffs is increased a lot, so it’s not objective to weaken the build with this as a reference. This is also the reason why for a long time, many constructions have clearly shown that their comprehensive ability is not high, but they are still weakened.
正如我半个多月前提到的,很多论坛的建设都集中在速度上。GD的输出计算方法是线性的。当边际收入增加时,增长越边际化。四个buff的输出能力增加了很多,因此以这个作为参考来削弱构建是不客观的。这也是为什么长期以来,许多建筑明显地表现出其综合能力不高,但仍在弱化的原因。

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Zantai, was just curious to why a LOT of flat dmg sources were deleted from the devotion tree, it did have a serious impact on my panetti’s mage hunter…the only reliable source of flat elemental dmg was from devotions and all but 2 of the ones I use were taken away…so I’m a little worried at how much of a dmg loss that is considering it wasn’t overly powerful (but fun as hell to play). I do use the Mythical Spellgaze which adds %WD to Panetti’s spell so it does benefit from flat dmg sources…unless it’s only benefitting from 18% of the flat dmg bonus? To my knowledge as long as something has a %WD bonus, you get the full flat dmg bonuses from whatever sources you grab it from. I could be wrong

Just curious, not overly pissed or anything because I love this game too damn much lol.

Also was curious about the awesome change of components not dropping partially anymore, just completed…at least that’s how I read it…great change…does it help free the system up for easier coding or something?

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Nothing saying you have to make use of all of bonuses at the same time. You could pick Shaman for one of your masteries as that extensively supports pets and Occultist for 1-2 Cold Familiars.

The bonuses to Nightblade are there for non-pet Cold attackers, e.g. 2-handed Korba Trickster.

Patchnotes I can’t test since I’m at PAX. Something to look forward to next week!

cccsennn is one of the best players and builders in our GD tieba community which has nearly 100k followers, over 1.3 million posts; also i can say it is the largest group of GD players in China。He has many experiences in this game, he also loves this game, so am i. We try to use our poor English to give out the thoughts and suggestions here to GD designers in which we hope the game can be nicer and smoother. wish the best.

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/shrug. I always figured that the bonuses were just as much there for Trickster hybrid cold pet builds. RR shred with the Veil bonuses, while you fight in the middle of things. Sort of like how some Ritualists play out wading into things with Bone Harvest. Just the Trickster has fewer baked in class pet talents in exchange for that RR shred. Heck I even made one back in AoM though I haven’t updated it for Gods.

Lightning to cold adds nothing to this sort of build. Fire to cold does. May as well ask for it especially since there is redundancy between the two items.

The devotion changes are … Great! Imaginative and lots of tweaks to the poorer devotions. I never thought of sticking valuable %racial damage into them, either. Good stuff.

Great looking patch.

Also, Hell hounds seem to have seen a lot of love. tbc.

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Going to do my best here since there is obviously a language barrier…

The full-scale solution would be to have diminishing returns on Crowd Control, which was simply beyond the scope of the project to do at that point. That said, there are several builds now that use CC to succeed, including one that has progressed very far in SR solo.

No Devotion skills share cooldowns, so not sure what that means. There were a few skills that had buggy or abusive behaviors with certain constellations, and we did remove those. However, some were fixed down the line and were put back.

Cooldown Reduction and Cooldown Resets are still an incredibly viable playstyle, and casters do very well in endgame, so not sure what we did that was so worthy of disappointment.

I think part of your concern lies in very different standards of what is viable and what goals you are aiming for that we simply have no desire to balance the game around as they are intended for the extremely focused players.

That said, if you have specific builds that are no longer playable at endgame, you are welcome to post your builds and what changes you felt cause problems for it now.

We get told by one person or another that we destroyed balance every patch. Mad_lee probably screams it into a photo of me over his bed every night.

Like I said, if you feel there is a problem, post your feedback and we can consider it. We had an entire thread going for months where players could post their input for item changes in v1.1.6.0 and all of it was considered. Much of it was implemented in some way.

I’m well aware that Retaliation builds do well in high SR, and that is not really an issue considering they don’t do as well in other types of play, but if you insist that we need to put them in line with others…

I do not recall any deliberate changes to monster healing, much less changes intended to affect Retaliation builds specifically.

In summary, if you have issue with game balance, post your feedback. We will read it, we always do. We may not always agree with your definition of balanced, however, so keep an open mind.

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With 18% weapon damage, you would get 18% of the flat bonus, so I can’t imagine the change hit you very hard.

This is literally the only thing Nightblade does for pets - Veil of Shadow.

Many players have tried getting a hybrid pet-player character to work including Winter King Trickster over the years and the fact is it’s difficult and generally just not worth it. You go through more effort than a conventional character build trying to balance all sorts of stats just right for what is going to be average at best.

If Winter King Trickster with pets were going to be a thing, it needs more than what it has now, a lot more.

Well, that would explain why the sheet dps was not going up very much when I finally grabbed those bonuses, at the time was expecting a WAY higher increase, now I know and that will help me with future builds…thanks for the tip / reply.

Pro tip, for skills with less than 100% WD isn’t worth pursing much flat damage, % boost or spirit/cunning is better way to increase your output. Still small portions of WD increase damage and also can life steal a bit. Both best options for different PRM builds - Mage Hunters and Binders have also other means to survive. So Spellgaze helmet is very good but mostly due to AdctH mod to Panettis. Hope that helps :slightly_smiling_face:

Which is more or less my point. Fire to cold while not much is something more even if at 50% conversion. 150% Lightning to cold not so much. But yes more would be needed on top of that to make it more than a mediocre build.

It needs a lot more than just Fire->Cold pet conversion - that is my point. The conversion isn’t going to change all that much about it nor is it going to make Nightblade any more an appealing pick for pet users. It doesn’t address that specific issue at all (though, at this point, I don’t see it getting addressed either as it’s been requested many times over the years with no changes or mention ever made on the subject :man_shrugging:).

Lightning->Cold pet conversion at least makes a full on pet user that for example goes Conjurer more appealing and gives it options to play around with. And as Cold pets has needed more help for sometime now, it’s a welcome change.

Long time player and forum lurker here, first time posting. Coming from other games with millions of users and thousands upon thousands of posts a day, I have always found it interesting to see a smaller game where an actual game dev regularly responds to all the griping comments people throw out. I’ve seen the salt go back and forth for a few years now, and this comment topped it all off and made me register an account:

“We get told by one person or another that we destroyed balance every patch. Mad_lee probably screams it into a photo of me over his bed every night.” -Z

Spent a couple mins laughing like an idiot in my living room with my girlfriend yelling at me because I wouldn’t explain why I was laughing and I made her wait to watch a show on Hulu until I finished reading the patch notes.

That aside, I dig the changes. At the risk of bringing some positivity into this hallowed place of whining; thanks for the last 4 years and 1,500 hours of gameplay Zantai and the Crate team. Fantastic game.

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