I believe this is the real successor to Diablo 2

Grim Dawn Gameplay Discussion
1

I have put many hours into this game and haven’t really had the chance to gush about it. I think it is one of the finest ARPGs ever made and is the definitive successor (at least for now) to Diablo 2.

There are so many things this game does right, the amount of customisation in this game is astounding. Not only do we get 6 classes, but we can mix and match to our hearts content to create our own class pretty much. The devotion system, which was a massive surprise to me as I didn’t follow development very much but when I first saw this I was blown away.

The loot in this game is done perfectly, you always feel excited when you see a blue item drop, and then even better a legendary purple item drops. It never fails to feel rewarding and this is something so many games struggle with. Diablo 3 no longer has this since you get legendaries out the yazoo, same with Torchlight 2 (which for some reason decided to have a real colour clash between its rarity of items which doesn’t help, plus the sheer amount that drops makes it almost tiresome. Just like in D2, the best items here grant you abilities and proc that are worth having and theres always sought after items to chase after with more being added all the time.

Difficulty, I have played many ARPGS and this is the only game that really makes going up difficulties feel fun and rewarding since Diablo 2. The tuning of the items that drops, the difficulty in mobs, the frequency and density of the mobs it all scales perfectly I think. Diablo 3 difficulties just add more hit points, though at least they increase the item drop chance but other than that it never feels any different and Torchlight 2 just got this plain wrong (Nothing changes regardless of the difficulty). I am happy that the guys behind this game get it, and I look forward to going up each difficulty with each and every character.

The sound, graphics and responsiveness of the game is all top notch. PLENTY of variety in its art style and enemy types, and I just love the MI’s that drop what you see, there has been a few times where I have looked at a giant mob swinging a mace or axe and thinking “I want that” and then it drops.

I’ll stop here as I have realised that its become more of a review than just a thank you post. I just haven’t really got anyone to talk to about this as my friends are all console players and so it makes it hard to hype up games they can’t play. Thanks for this great ARPG, this is one of my favourite genres and its good to see this come to life once again as it felt like for so many years Diablo 2 held the monopoly on this genre, and now we have plenty to play and all good in their own way, but finally we have that true D2 successor (at least in my eyes).

Thanks Crate

2

Six. :wink:

/10char

3

Oooh yeah! Thanks :stuck_out_tongue:

4

Grim Dawn cannot be compared with Diablo II.

Diablo II featured a simple damage types system and a balanced attacks/enemies system around it.

If you skip the new damage that has been later added and that never made much sense and unbalanced the whole game (the “magic” damage), you have in the original concept this perfectly clear and efficient system:

5 damage types: physical, fire, cold, lightning and poison.
With more or less the same numbers of attacks for each one of them, which enabled various and balanced builds.
Same with the monsters: their resistances where overall pretty balanced over those damage types, you have more or less in middle game the same number of monsters resistant to one type of damage than any others, and in late game more or less the same number of monsters immune to something than to something else.

The drops were also balanced as well: you had pretty much as many items dropping for barbarians or necros as you would have for amazons or sorceresses.

But in Grim Dawn, nothing of this can be compared: you have physical, piercing and fire attacks all over the place, and barely not more than a single one for lightning, poison, eather or chaos (and please, I mean real abilities from your character himself, no cheap conversion applied from regular default attacks or skills granted by items you then have to rely to the whole game). You have tons of bonuses everywhere for physical, fire and acid builds, and can hardly reach 2/3 of those bonus if you ever decide to go chaos.

You have damage types that will enable you to go through the whole game with no problem (physical, trauma and vitality), and some others with which you won’t be able to kill more than 1/2 of them (bleeding). Most serious enemies in the game will have damages based on resistances you are struggling to improve (vitality/eather/chaos), and won’t stop dropping the same kind of items (nightblade’s stuff, harry potter’s stuff, on and on and on).

Oh, and in Grim Dawn you have two completely different bonuses for fire and burn, and two completely different resistances for cold and freeze. And you also have physical/trauma/bleeding/vitality and eather/chaos which are redundant of each others, but acid and poison which are considered the same kind of attack while the damages are completely different.

And in Diablo II the currency was necessary throughout the whole game to repair armors and reload ammunitions, not just the first 6-8 levels to buy potions, and then you start piling up thousands of “iron bits” with absolutely no use for them.

Grim Dawn cannot be compared with Diablo II. Diablo II was a masterpiece of gameplay balance and replayability, while Grim Dawn is much more focused on story and atmosphere and uses the gameplay as mere mechanics to make that universe alive. The developers have obviously learned very little from that video game reference and are not aiming to make a successor of this kind.

Where Grim Dawn however made positive improvements over Diablo II: multi-classes, graphics, display settings and camera management, new/genuine story and consistent background/atmosphere, augments/devotions (although I consider those mechanics as cheap ways to handle the damage types mess), shared stash, no more identification process.

What Grim Dawn hasn’t used from Diablo II: simple and clear fight system, random levels, attacks/resistances balance, drops balance, cinematics, womanly women characters, “you have been killed by” when you died, death penalties, mercenaries, gambling, a quest giving you a guaranteed item for your class, a quest letting you name one item of your gear by your name, items with many component slots, quick loadings and no crashes, enemies with survival behaviors, levels with very typical layouts/structures.

5

GD is definitely DII successor.

Now if only Zantai would confirm the necromancer already :rolleyes:

What it lacks is a major plotting villain (there probably already is one, i am just waiting for him to be revealed)

The only illogical thing in GD is the Avatar of Mogdrogen attacking you, i mean seriously. I restored your shrine, saved your people and you thank me by trying to kill me - well fuck you too buddy :eek:

6

Well to be fair, you pretty much call him a wimp. Which he is.

7

funnily enough, my elemental resists are usually lower than those three… I generally have a hard time getting all res up to an acceptable level in Ultimate (requires too much farming to me)

And you also have physical/trauma/bleeding/vitality and eather/chaos which are redundant of each others, but acid and poison which are considered the same kind of attack while the damages are completely different.

not sure how Physical and Vitality or Trauma and Vitality are redundant. Do you base that on the name and your impression of what damage type this would be in real life ?

Also not sure why you then consider Acid and Poison to be the same

And in Diablo II the currency was necessary throughout the whole game to repair armors and reload ammunitions

thankfully we do not have to deal with those kinds of nuisances any more, good riddance…

I get it, you like D2 so much you even praise the crap parts… well, to me it was good for its time, but has not been king of the hill for 10+ years now

8

after you continued insulting him even after he warned you…

9

Well,
Let’s see what we did

-Protect Rhowari (complete strangers to us besides the fact they’re humans)
-Restore his shrine (not for personal needs but to help)

Let’s see what he did

-Stands there enjoying the scenery while a few feet away from him the aetherial corruption is consuming his precious beasts.
-Not caring to explain anything when clearly its his followers (Rhowari) who are in trouble

All we said was “Maybe you’re not as powerful as i thought” and he gets out-right rude. No seriously, i don’t mind a God talking to me that way but this guy. No chance.

I am going to quote an Occultist here “Show me the beasts that Mogdrogen spared from the hunt”

Had it been one of Three who would’ve insulted me then i would’ve refrained from engaging them

10

Aren’t gods like this? However i’m familiar with just ancient greek mythology, and i’d say this one Avatar is portrayed pretty much accurately:p

Too bad they didn’t go full canon and he doesn’t one-shot player after you dared to confront him

–
I even have an idea. Debuff wich gives a negative amounth of health via CharacterBonusAttributes
Nothing will save those mortals:mad::mad::mad: Not even weak lame ass cheats.

11

Full canon suggests Mog isn’t even a god. He is a titan created by gods. Also, Chthon rightfully called him out on his bullshit - he doesn’t do anything, except standing and enjoying the scenery. A selfish child who can’t control his emotions and has anger issues isn’t worthy to be called a god.
Oh yeah, while on this topic I have high hopes for things like getting Korvaak’s or Ch’thon’s asses kicked by our character. Maybe even a few others. Be honest, when gods leave your world without a single word - won’t you feel betrayed? I think humanity’s rise has only just begun, not only it’s suffering.

We can still freeze health pool, you know.

And yeah, Grim is definitely D2 successor.

12

Nicely put

Ahem coughs :rolleyes:

In my own defense i just need the blood you guys owe me so be a good mortal and take that knife :slight_smile:

13

He used to…the HC players did not appreciate that.

14

… good old times :rolleyes::rolleyes:

15

I meant general pagan gods’ canon, i don’t know much about gd lore, sorry.

Sounds Exactly like greek god, actually:D

Don’t want to go offtopic
tl;dr: nothing will save char. nothing.

16

Eh, mortals had no control over the process of life creation, they are a product of the said creation themselves. Thus, as living organisms, they naturally resist any threat to their lives. If you want to actually blame somebody, It obviously must be Empyrion. And even then, there is a certain theory about him and Korvaak, you know the one… Can a god, corrupted by outside forces, still hold such a title? We shall see!

And shouldn’t this discussion be in Lore section anyway?

17

Lol, you took it too seriously

Just give me your blood :stuck_out_tongue:

Serious lore discussions should definitely be done in the stickied lore discussion thread

To keep this thread on topic

Yes GD is the real successor to Diablo II.

Now Zantai just needs to reveal the Necromancer :smiley:

18

In all honesty, looking from the perspective of my 28 years of gaming experience, Grim Dawn is the closest ARPG which can be considered Diablo 2 successor.

I am fairly certain that the Expansion will cement its position, and would i even dare to think - surpass it? Time will tell.

19

I’ll be honest…I never played D2. I was young when it came out, and frankly, my parents thought it was Satanic…and technically, it was about Diablo…

Regardless, when I got older I started into games with Tower Defense, and then moved to ARPGs when D3 ROS was brought to my attention. From there, to POE, from POE to here.

So I only have 3 ARPGs worth of experience, I can’t comment on D2’s “greatness”, or Titan Quest. I can comment that this ARPG is better managed, better balanced, and has better depth and replayability than the others I’ve played. I think of ARPGs as Loot and Build focused games, where you find an item, theory craft a build for it, and go see how it goes. This game, to me, fulfills that. Every item without + Skills seems to have multiple possible uses, and I’m only expecting more to come up when the Expansion comes out. The loot balancing is wonderful for SSF play, and there’s no benefit other than company to Multiplayer, which IMO is how it should be.

Generally, I think Crate has taken other ARPGs, and removed some of the largest problems. There are a few left, the game’s not perfect…But it’s the best I’ve seen so far, by far.

20

I agree. I have played many arpgs but Titan Quest/Grim Dawn are my favorites. I enjoyed Diablo 2 LoD for years but I always hit that brickwall of immunities. The limitations on Ladder only junk just made it worse. I will say this, the lore/atmosphere of Titan Quest was the 2nd best to me (Diablo 1, omg so good). The updated gameplay/quality of life features on Grim Dawn make it “better” than the older ones to me, but I’d play an updated Titan Quest in a heartbeat xD.

I like how to developers are relatively candid about things and can joke around with players. The updates are surprisingly quick (I come from Blizzard side of gaming) and I love how the builds aren’t super restricted like in other games.