When ypu think about the amount of the items; it is still not easy to get everything. I play since 1.1.5.2, though I also see a lot of improvements about drop rate/source and also expansion of the whole gears. So yeah they adjusted, they also added new things. And the result? Game still time needy.
I understand most people doesn’t wanna spend time in farming but when you ignore all the add-ons and tools; the game and it’s play style depends on leveling, spending time to kill monsters to get rep etc, farming, create alts and repeat.
No more time needy than any other diablo-like. It’s in the genres DNA.
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What do you expect the game to do? There are over 1000 unique items and let’s say a boss always drops 2. You still need 500 runs to get them all and be lucky they don’t repeat.
LoL, that’s what I’m talking about and getting lynch for; farming, leveling, exploring is in the GD’s soul which is arpg.
And the justification of GDstash users(ofc they are free to use, I’m just questioning their reason to do) farming, leveling etc is boring, time consuming and who need that so use gdstash!
So not sure what you’re talking about. Because I’m trying to defend legit playing as people say time wasting leveling, farming here. I’m saying these aspects are important and they’re the foundation of the game!
You should read the previous posts before posting any comments 
I don’t find levelling up boring, but I do farming for stuff so I don’t do that. I suspect I’m one of the few players on the forum who doesn’t use things like Lokarr’s set, XP potions, etc, to level up faster and I enjoy playing through all 3 difficulties.
Players who use GDStash don’t have to justify their reasons for doing so to anyone. It’s their choice and doesn’t affect anyone else unless they’re stupid enough to use heavily modified items in multiplayer games. Devs have said time and time again the game is moddable so players can play it how they want to. If that’s different to what the devs have in mind, that’s fine. How they enjoy the game is their choice.
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You’re perfectly right. They don’t have to and I don’t normally ask anyone why they do so; but since here we are in a thread related to that; people already did those and I read their reasons so just commenting. And I never said no one should use GDstash so please don’t act like I did.
I’m just defending the aspects of the game people said they’re boring and time waste that’s all.
And that is cool and nice I also do all difficulties(with lokarr and potions) and usually get nemesis/revered with every faction before ultimate to make the whole ultimate level a campaign farm.
I think the “questioning” here is why you feel the need to define “legit” play your way and then defend that. Are you trying to prove something to feel like you are better than others because of how you play?
As @medea_fleecestealer said the real legit play and heart/soul of Grim Dawn is fun. That is undeniably clear from the devs. If you want to give yourself 500 levels and 10 million health points then go for it. If you want to play completely solo self found, have at it. Hell there are a few of us on here who like to play “meme” characters because we create stories based around our completely non-optimized build because it fits a theme we make up.
So go play the game your way. It’s not any more “legit” than @Knife’s way, or Maya’s pets only way or someone’s mods only way or anyone’s way. Having fun is the only way to play.
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Completely correct; it’s all about fun and everybody should do as they’re having fun.
And no I’m not better or over any other player; never implied that. I also not waging war to anyone here. We’re just debating and there is no heart feeling on my side and hope that they also feel the same.
Though I’m trying to prove that GD is an arpg. It’s a time consuming game including leveling,farming etc and it’s aim is also to force you to improve your characters as you play and test it on the endgame content/secret bosses/celestials. This is the way that devs choosed while programming. So I’m not sure because I’m not a native but if it is not clear enough, I’m gonna explain all over again;
Opener made a point that consist GDstash ruined his fun.
I commented my thoughts on it as others did.
People mostly stood by GDstash as it never broke the fun of the game for them and praised it as QoL since they don’t have to level,farm,earn rep,depend on RNG etc anymore so they can make better builds etc.
And after that I disagreed with most of them to support the game’s soul. Told them if you’re bored from these aspect then you’re getting bored from the things what makes Grim Dawn as a game even though GDstash makes you better builder, better in end-game and improved your creativity by giving you more freedom; these are only the parts of the game.
I accepted and highlighted multiple times that everyone is free to do whatever they want unless they brag about their extraordinary creation in public places or multiplayer. Like there is a chaos melee pyro recently; with two gdstashed weapons and really high dps. So? I can’t reach that without gdstashing maybe with insane rng two times with same weapon?
And also I know that some people have their limits on gdstash, they do some things and don’t some other. And if everyone can have fferent methods and reasons to use GDstash like that everycan have different reasons to not use GDstash.
But; the game’s basic mechanics and style is same as devs did it at the beginning. I called it game’s soul since they designed it this way.
And people called those features as waste of time. Like who has time to earn rep? Who has time to farm and depend on rng to get shitty rolls, who wants to level a new character from 0-100 right? Since we have gdstash just make it so!
But; these are THE things that game depends on as a genre. Even devs accept everyone’s play style to support diversity they also preserv the game’s soul over the years and patchs. I’m just defending this.
Anyone can use gdstash, and don’t even need to justify their means. They can just say that “I’m lazy.” or “it helps me to maximize my builds.” these are okay and accepted imo. But when they say things like farming is pita; it despises a lot player who farms even right now to get their goal items all around the world and they also depend on RNG.
I’m not saying that no one should use gdstash and never did. There are some people use gdstash to optimize their builds without exceeding the games limits to both test and publish. They helped a lot of player with their builds and GDstash also helped people to test the game mechanics which I also appreciate that. And they just need to say like that and all is okay.
What do you do when someone who borned rich say like oh you poor people have to work and spend your whole time to earn money? That’s buzzkiller man, life is so much fun when you don’t spend your precious time to unneccesary things like gathering the materials you need…
And obviously that’s why I’m defending the play style without gdstash as there are lots of players sweats their guts out to get some set items with good rolls.
And I’m aware all the talk about ‘‘this is the way’’ is nonsense, it’s already a joke but no one watched Mandalorian I guess?
But eventually organic leveling, farming, praying to RNG are the natural playstyle of the game. Yeah devs developed it in time and keeping to do so. I just supported and supporting Grim Dawn is a time consuming game; it’s how devs made it. You need explore, farm, level and repeat even to finish just one build by all alone. Ofc people do trade and help each other in multiplayer which is also a good feature. If I got something unnecessary for me why shouldn’t I give to another who needs the exact item? Helping each other also compensates the bad rng without gdstash.
And RNG isn’t a bad thing. It’s just like life. Ofc no computer can replicate the pure chaotic randomness but it’s close enough. You get what you get, not what you deserve.
This is the way, this is the purpose of the game, this is the soul of the genre.
What i would like to see ( my preference)
When you kill a hard boss, you know that it will drop the item that your looking for and not do that same run again and again…
I’m not saying I agree with this but this could work with MIs, because the variety of prefix/suffix means you can still make more runs to try to get the targets you want. But this wouldn’t work at all for things like the Magi Rings or the Outcasts helm or Alkamos Rings because they’re designed to be rare and powerful (and very specific) so they would be too easy to get.
I don’t think anyone is criticizing how YOU want to play the game at all. I think everyone is taking you to task for feeling what you define as ‘the soul of the game’. It sounds a bit elitist to be honest.
The soul of the game plain and simple is FUN. That’s it. Everything else is wrapped up in that as I’ve already explained. The devs have given us a playground and ENCOURAGE people to play how they see fit. If you want to play within the borders. GREAT. If you want to move the boundaries of the playground and expand them in some way shape or form, great! Is the essence of a playground to only sit on the swing and go forward and backward? I can guarantee you nearly every kid on the planet is going to figure out ways to make that fun, for them, including taking the chains off, installing ramps up to the top of the swing bar and riding their bikes over it (guilty as charged.)
I started to use GD stash because I got so much items I can already make most builds, all it takes is leveling, farming reputation and ugdenblooms which bores me. I am more interesting in theorycrafting, checking builds limits, testing my owns limits and increasing skill.
I don’t treat GD as singleplayer game anymore too, it’s basically offline multiplayer - I post builds online and discuss with people, without GD stash it wouldn’t be really possible. I don’t want to farm hours for components then doing it again after changing some things in build.
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LoL really? If you said conservative, I would accept since my approach is even though I’m not as a person.
Yeah exactly, for example when I was 4-5 I played doom 1. My father thought me how to run the game on msdos so I played a lot, but it was a really hard game for the time; never progress further. Then started to use the immortality keys etc to finish it. Now I’m well aware of that playing with cheats is not the proper way, because I experimented back then now I can say that use only game provides you to increase the challenge.
And as a concept experimenting is one of the most important thing in human development. I did and do experiment in every aspect of my life but in games? Taking chains off? Really? For example if you create a character that can one-hit ravager what does it good for exactly? What will you learn from this experiment? losing chains is good only in real life.
Some people feel this is fun. Some people don’t feel like they have to ‘learn’ something in a game. Who are you to tell them otherwise or to say they’re playing the game wrong, which is exactly what I meant when I said it ‘sounds elitist.’ The soul of the game being “FUN” allows everyone to find their own way. Your definition of the soul of the game seems to indicate to find their fun they must go down a narrowed (or conservative, as you phrased it) path to truly be ‘playing the game’. i.e. elitist.
I think we’ve both exhausted our points of view here. You feel one way. I feel another. Everybody else has variations in between or on the other side of either. The great thing about what the devs did with Grim Dawn and allowing mods and making it primarily a solo game is thankfully it can encompass ever style of fun. The soul.
imo, crate wants gd players to “Do The Best They Can with What They’ve Got” (One of the famous lines of all gd blacksmiths). cairn’s future is bleak. its post apocalyptic dead end for cairn. so use all the rusty scraps & equipments you’ve got to beat all those end game challenges!
i recommend players to enjoy playing makeshift builds on the way to get their BiS items for their dream builds.
because, once you’ve farmed all the BiS for your dream builds, and you can beat all end game challenges easily with the minmaxed gears you’ve got… you’ll miss the time where you struggle beating difficult contents with rusty unoptimized items, and leap in joyful manner when the BiS you want dropped with good rolls.
tldr: try looking for ways to enjoy the game with unoptimized equipments while you’re simultaneously farming those contents for the n-th times to drop the BiS items. and remember, balance the farming session with real life schedules, and take breaks from the game occasionally to feel refreshed when getting back to gd after ‘mandatory vacation time’.
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That’s true. I like to share my builds, it will be massive loss of motivation to play if I can’t.
And GD stash allows you to test every wacky idea you may have in a flash.
But I have to say something to all people that are against GD stash and builders that are using it. Most builders have played tons of time without it and have post many builds self found. I’ve posted some of them in AoM era and they were self found. @mad_lee for instance played lots of time self found and even had online sessions giving up duplicated items for free, cause doesn’t need them anyway, so on.
But at some point it becomes difficult to realize your ideas/organize inventory without extra help. Or you have to level some class just to test your build. So that’s why most builders use it. But if I wasn’t going to post builds or be active forum member, probably wouldn’t going to use GD stash at all, to be honest.
I have seen other people also avoiding any external help during leveling.
Personally enjoy normal difficulty a lot. Not much pressure and you can try different offensive skills and gain knowledge on the game’s mechanics without getting butchered all the time. And elite/ultimate offers nice difficulty curve. So for smooth progress, I would still play all three difficulty levels.
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@Nery exactly everything what I meant. Sometimes when I make some build in GT it looks good on the paper but in game it’s total trash (in my expectations) and vice versa - average on the paper but doing everything way better than I expected. Without GD stash I would lose many hours. Leveling another class and then farming components in the same boring route takes a lot of time.
Without forum and contact with community I am sure I would play without it like before. Sometime ago I started from scratch on hardcore to get 100% achievements on steam and did it fast without any issue on the road so it does not satisfy me anymore.
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I agree 100% with this statement. The way I look at it is as if its a trading card game like MTG Arena or Hearthstone, and loot chests are like packs of cards, and the gear that you get from each chest is like the cards you get from each pack.
Ive noticed in TCGs like the aforementioned, once I have full playsets of all the cards I want or like, I lose motivation to play. This is why I dont put money into packs in those games, and the same reason is why I dont use GD Stash for gear.
This is just me though, and here is how I learned it would ruin the experience for me- I started my first Hardcore Character, and realized HC characters dont share the same stash and blueprints as SC characters, so I would have to build up my collection all over again. This actually excited me! Having unlocked pretty much all the blueprints in the game, id forgotten how thrilling the dopamine rush was to get blueprint drops!
The fact that this challenge to re-acquire everything excited me told me that I valued the grind and the struggle, the work you put into finding things makes those things more meaningful, like in life, putting in the work to reach a goal will teach you to value and appreciate the goal. The journey there becomes more valuable in itself, and thats a huge part of what Grim Dawn has been for me. Its how I know Ill always love the game and I could play it for years. So long as I dont use GD Stash, I will still be on the journey to meet those lofty goals;
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Beat the game on Classless HC Ultimate
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Optimize all my builds
Once those goals are realized, thats when I will allow myself to indulge in the sheer power and awesomeness of GD Stash. I look forward to it very very much, just as I look forward to finally getting a Stormrend, some Magi rings, defeating the Crate of Entertainment, and achieving my goals.
If I were to tap into the wellspring of GD Stash it would corrupt the experience for me and cause it to suddenly reach the end. With development winding down on GD, I am looking to prolong the achievement of my goals being realized as long as possible. Perhaps even until GD 2 releases. I do not want to be without GD in my life. Maybe this is subconsciously why I havent been playing much of it this year.
At the same time, I really REALLY value GD Stash for how its affected the community. I am glad for those who do use it, because I can get the advice from them on builds, gear interactions, how to optimize things, when I am otherwise at a loss and looming for insight I can trust. This forum is super great for that! I love seeing what people put together. Its inspiring.
I know as a new person it can be frustrating seeing all these builds that are top-end, BiS gear, level 100 with all faction rep maxed and optimized components and augments. When youre new it seems like these builds just saturate the forum. I know I remember getting frustrated every time a new build was posted and id be like “oh that sounds awesome! Let me go read about that i wonder how th… oh. Mythical legendaries and gear i have no idea how to get, and i only have 1 level 100 guy who cant even do crucible solo… great. Ill never have these gear pieces!”
Then, i redirected my focus to just having fun with the game, building whatever i felt like even if it sucked, just building because fuck it why not? Then after id played around with all the lower level stuff i wanted to (took a couple years!) I finally started really getting into reading about builds and participating, it was @Nery and @MikeHeydon who really got me into things here, asking questions and sharing ideas. Then (about 2000 hours of gametime in) I started following a beginner build for the first time, @Contragor’s immortal army build, a highly effective MC farmer thats also super fun. Then @Nery’s vitality caster conjurer, which has so far been my version of using GD Stash, for all intents and purposes. I have used that build to farm soooooo much gear. It was the first time I was able to do SR 75-76 on my own! Let me tell you WHAT an AWESOME experience that is, its like a whole new game! But only so long as theres always some gear to chase.
This reaches my final point. I guess over time, the reasons you play, and the things you may enjoy about the game, can change. If anyone is seeking the answer to whether they should use GD Stash or not, they need to ask themselves, because no one else can really truly answer that for someone else. And also, important to note the benefits of GD Stash, may not ruin the game for someone either, as many have said. Now the game changes and becomes a playground for testing the most top notch combos and gear setups. Sounds fun to me too!
This is way too long.
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You may be interested in this upcoming Mod
It’s being hand crafted for both hardcore and old school gamers that really like challenge and long term progress.
There will be some more videos soon showcasing the game world and early testing.
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Holy shit this sounds amazing.