I don’t know… My opinion is radically different.
If a build can do crucible but not when a Reaper shows up than it can’t do crucible. If a build can do 75 but not when aggro abuse fails then it can’t do 75. Telling yourself, “Oh, no! If there’s no aggro abuse I won’t be able to do 75… NO!!!” is a little bit of a… What I mean is that the truth is you can’t do 75.
BUILDER A: I can do 75.
BUILDER B: And I can beat Mayweather in boxing match if I only aggro his face, first.
I doubt this will ever change, Crate have a real loving of forcing boss fights in very small rooms. Personally something I really hate, but that’s how Crate like their boss fights.
If someone posted video of beating SR 75,then it will have the tag.But what if that player use some kind of cheats or just started with build directly on 75 and restated it until got easy combo.It will have the tag,but you can’t beat 5 or 6 consecutive waves.Same things for Cruci,I have lightning Conjurer super fast,but is completely glass cannon.It have like 10 or 20% chance to finish Gladiator,but if I post video with Alex spawning each nemesis wave,I can claim is 170 viable,right.I will never do the above,but someone else might do it.My point is in these situations we depends on other players honesty.
Hi
It’s a no for me.
Base on your OP, you said all bosses should aggro players all at once in the boss room. This will definitely increase the difficulty substantially and will definitely measured the limitation of your build.
But why you feel like this is the change players need? I mean if you really want to test the limit of your build, couldn’t you just aggro them all at once already at current state of SR? And other people can still use this pulling/lure bosses one by one tactics.
Maybe I can see the point where you are coming from. Lets say you make build A and other people created also build B which is similar to your build A. Both of you posted a guide on the forum and both mentioned SR75 viable. By SR75 viable, build A completed it by aggroing all the bosses at once, while build B done it by luring the boss 1 by 1. As a result, build A is on paper is should be stronger than build B. If this is the case then just mentioned in the guide that it is done by aggroing all the bosses and demonstrate the power of the build.
I get it. It might be deceiving for players who want to try new builds that could push high SR by saying SR+ or SR75 viable. Some build can do it by aggroing all the bosses and some only 1v1 fight. I feel like this is what should be mentioned and/or clip of SR runs included (so players can judge it themselves) when anyone is posting a guide that is SR+ viable.
For the sake of argument, lets say the concept of bosses aggroing players right off the bat is implemented, you get Kaisan and Grava with some other combination of nasty bosses that will debuff you to death in SR75 boss room, can you name me any builds that could do this boss room with “ease” and without dying as of patch 1.1.2.5? I know I am still new to this game and I would love to get my hand on such a build haha :D. Of course there are builds, example is your princess octaviana set up and I love how you posted a clip to prove it (Though only Grava is present in the boss room), that could do it and these builds should be considered as top top tier!
Different approach to the topic:
Rephrasing, do you mind the “SR aggro abuse”? Would you rather have all enemies automatically aggro in boss stages a bit like in crucible?
Let´s assume it would change to aggroing all at once. Then we have a Wave 170 with:
I will not talk about that I had wished for a different approach to SR in the first place. But making it more like Crucible (only harder at deeper shards)…why even put it in-game? Okay, it isn´t an add-on so you don´t have to buy it separately.
The solution in the title thread of this thread was proposed by me a bit hastily… It was on the hype of SOMETHING MUST BE DONE WITH THIS AGGRO ABUSE, SOMETHING, ANYTHING!!!
There have been more mature and more complete solutions proposed, such as introducing multiple different modes of boss stages, that are super creative and I support them 100%.
But I still stand by my original statement: even total aggro like in crucible would still be better than what it is now. How people play SR now is just comical. Little Tiptoe Happy-Go-Lucky.
But I still stand by my original statement: even total aggro like in crucible would still be better than what it is now. How people play SR now is just comical. Little Tiptoe Happy-Go-Lucky.
Don´t think it would be better. Did you forget that SR is part of Main Campaign with very important quests for toon building?
You seem only to think of Shard 75+ (in a competitive approach), but don´t forget that people have to be able to clear Shard 50.
We had this conversation. Change 50 to 25. Done. But people say no because “I used to do 75 now I can only do 50” = “I don’t feel badass enough in my video game no more.”
The magic power of numbers.
Well, my other argument will still stand:
Why make SR like Crucible?
Why not make the different approach and make Crucible totally Random with spawns like in SR? No planning ahead, which boss spawns where. Up to 7 Mutators. Buffs are random and come with a cost.
And then let´s talk about numbers especially clearing time. 
What you do right now is (un-/intentionally?) downplaying SR players and their builds and their “achievements”.
I hope you’re wrong and they’ll do something about it. I know it costs time and resources to work on the maps but it’s something I think is necessary to make all of SR fun and not only the normal chunks.
Fighting in those tiny boss rooms isn’t fun for me at all, whether the bosses aggro all at once or not. Since I got most blueprints already I only play SR for the skill points. I don’t really care about aggro at this point so I’m not even voting.
But I’d definitely vote YES if the boss rooms were much bigger. Like at least 4 times bigger, and with varied terrain like ledges, bridges, overhangs etc.
Even with the hardest bosses teaming up against you all at once, you’d still have a chance if you play well. You’d be able to separate fast bosses from slow ones, retreat in dire situations, take advantage of chokepoints and so on.
Utilizing tactics is fun, going tippy toes while praying to RNGsus for a benevolent boss combo isn’t.
Increased map size would give the player more freedom to make the most out of their preferred playstyle, whether it’s tanking or kiting or anything between.
Exactly. Glad you put those quotation marks there. They fit.
Well, my other argument will still stand:
Why make SR like Crucible?
If they made toons race on My Little Ponies in SR boss stages would you still say “Wow! Great! Cuz not like crucible!” ???
This is what I hoped when first reading about SR. Maps like Chunk 1 to 3 which have to be cleared in time for full loot with the possibility to kite, use terrain, etc. With more than one boss charging at you in some parts of the map with options to separate them, etc. Perhaps even more enviromental hazards, etc.
Well, it is as it is. But make it more like Crucible…well, give me the Attribute/Skill Points and I will play only Main Campaign with Rogue-likes.
@ya_:
I (emphasized by me) give a shit about achievements, clearing times, etc. The whole competitive approach to Grim Dawn since AoM (?) is something which makes Grim Dawn less attractive for me. More so if I now read comments in threads how “bad” a build is because…well, not reliable Crucible in -06:30. You don´t like SR as it is right now? Well, don´t play it. You want the competitive approach? You got Crucible.
I don’t see the problem of builds being able to do SR75 at its current state (already really dependent on mutators and boss combination). How players approach and complete SR75 is entirely up to them (aggro or no aggro). Why limiting builds to only SR50, 60, or 70 just because they can’t handle aggroing all the bosses in higher shards.
But the only thing I am suggesting is that when people creating builds that is SR75+ viable they should at least mention in the guide the way they approach the bosses in the boss room and maybe upload the clip of the runs. This way people who read and follow the guide can judge the build by themselves according to their play-styles.
If kiting bosses 1 by 1 is intended - then they should spawn one after another, or there should be several rooms with 1-2 bosses in them.
If it’s intended to fight all bosses at once - then they ALL should aggro at player, just like Crucible.
My personal opinion - SR is very imbalanced. The existance of buff dispel, the ability to continus after death, insane boss combinations & their power combined, ability to pull bosses one by one, radom spawn of shrines, of which some are clearly better than others, etc.
And on top of that, maps for SR arent even randomly generated.
I actually expected something BETTER than Crucible, or, at least, not worse. Something akin PoE’s or Torchlight’s map system, for example… With SINGLE boss in the end, not 4+ bosses charging at you in the end, all havinh various shitty debuffs, that screw your resists, DPS, speed and hitting like trucks. Boss is a BOSS, because he’s ONE. Just like campain. Do we get 4+ bosses in campain every time? HELL NO!
Just have SR boss rounds start with a single boss, maybe 2 weaker bosses. After a certain length of time, a second boss will spawn (15-60s depending on level difficulty boss type etc) this continues until all 4-6 bosses have spawned. If you kill all bosses before the timer ends for the next boss, you won’t have to wait and it will spawn the next boss in 7s or so. DPS builds can focus on taking down one boss asap, tank builds can focus on surviving multiple bosses at once.
It was suggested before and people have pointed out why it is a terrible idea. If you can’t kill the bosses in time and aren’t tanky enough to survive fighting all of them at once, you will just end up dead.
Nope, it’s unfair , they hurt too much ,have nasty crowd control and build get nerfed like pussy all time by Crate
Maya, this is a great idea, and one of many good ideas that were mentioned in this thread. That’s the point - make better builds to get deeper - no?
In my opinion SR has unlimited potential. SR boss rooms should not be limited to one mode. That thing be one of many modes. Fluff proposed another. Even the current faulty mode of aggro-abusable noob-eldorado could find its way to a diversified SR with may different solutions for boss stages.
But to insist on keeping the latter as the only mode?
If you can’t kill the bosses (…) and aren’t tanky enough (…) you will just end up dead.
I removed some modifiers from this sentence to make it a little more apparent what nonsense you just produced, with all due respect. This is the very point of games you’re trying to contradict. You aren’t good enough you lose.
You really want GD to let you win with builds that “can’t kill” and “aren’t tanky”? Is “if you aren’t lucky enough you’ll just end up dead” really the better idea?
Well, maybe it is… Flipping a coin is also a thing to enjoy. And recently many GD players became very good at it.
I see nothing wrong with luring bosses one by one and don’t see the need to make it harder. That is all there is to it.
And cutting off parts of my post to suit your needs and then berating it? Shame on you 
In my opinion variety of builds should be able to venture into high SR and tackle the challenges that high SR provide.
It doesn’t matter which mode players prefer in SR. There is pretty much only two mode to SR as of right now. One is the aggro-abusable noob-eldorado mode which I’m pretty sure over 90% of players are using this at the moment 
Another is the “I don’t give a damn face-rolled” mode and just aggro all the bosses. If the builds that can do the latter, well awesome, these build should be categorized as A+ builds.
Long story short, players choosing to play A+ builds will have an easy time completing high SR while players playing lower tier builds will have a harder time completing it which is totally fine. Depending on the two “MODE”, those are players choice to make. There’s is no need to proposed something that completely limit player’s ability to play the builds.
Now if SR mode change to all bosses aggro at once, then definitely there is NO need to flip any coins and only A+ builds can do higher SR (80+). I am not as experience as you but I am sure that there are not many builds that can be categorized as A+ as of patch 1.1.2.5 (maybe 2 or 3 builds? I don’t know…). Why limit only a few builds? I mean grim dawn should NOT be like Diablo 3 (No disrespect to Diablo 3 game, I am playing that as well XD) where only a specific build of each class can do high greater rifts (SR) e.g. top 50 players of one class use the same build to push high greater rifts. This very very boring no and diversity at all. I feel like ARPG games are suppose to be build around theorycrafting and diversity of builds not one build wins all.