Waiting for the second “you don’t know what you are talking about”
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Exactly. I am talking about SR 90+ and stuff like Callagadra and Crate.
Pretty much every pet build in existence will breeze through Lokarr and SR 75-76, even Ravager.
But beyond that, they will struggle.
However, the point OP is making is that currently, Pet’s power is tied to maxing out the Skills and Mythical Beastcallers provide much less points compared to other Pet sets.
If you fix that by going for other items, you still need to make sure they synergize with the actual build.
Conversions take up slots (Beastcaller doesn’t have any), you need to worry about pet resistances, player stats etc and can’t blindly go for +Skills.
Scorpius pummeler for eg, will lock you into bleed/acid build. If you are say, going for Lightning Beastcaller’s you are taking weapon + 2 ring slots or amulet for conversion alone.
You can go Briar off-hand, amulet + MI weapon, all with +skills and get 26/16 Briar if you wish, sure. But then you are locked into that if you want a maxed Briar.
Take something like Lost Souls for eg and you don’t get that problem.
Aye, all those greens 
And 2.5k DA won’t really survive against tougher content without OA Shred.
Pets can only act as tanks so much.
My conjurer physical pet build, killed Calla just fine its like patch never happened except that primal spirit has less uptime so a bit slower.
ye but like i said, lost souls also only supports 2 pets, bysmiel supports 1, ghol supports 2,
beastcaller supports all conjurer pets, which is then “a lot” of +skills “combined” (and i know it can be said that doesn’t really count)
but i would also argue that ex skeletons, desperately need that +5 from lost souls, because they are so weak, specially as vit from my experience, and briarthorn, even just on +19 is steam rolling ahead (on… patch 1.1.4? setup? i’ve no idea how old it/the item setup is)
I am going to go out on a limb and say it is a bleed pet build rather than physical, or by fine you meant taking like half an hour.
Because actual phys pet builds are kind of the worst of the bunch.
But hey, feel free to actually prove me wrong as that would make me rather happy if you can.
isnt’ that most calla kills tho ? running around kiting for ages 
- and why i only kill her on retal toons
I have sent you that build on DM long time ago iirc, but it was not taking half an hour. And yes, if that is worst of the bunch I will be happy to play more pet builds (I have only made one pet build since 1.1.7 when I restarted and I went with phys pets because they were considered worst, I do have 2 Mis with doule rare affixes that I have farmed hundred of hours for) and nope, no bleed I am not even running modrogen devo
Beastcaller supports all Conjurer pets because there isn’t any alternative.
The solution would have been to provide said alternative so that non Briar conjurers don’t feel the need to go Beastcallers.
But:
Nope, 10mins on 1.1.8.1
Before that 8min was fastest.
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Should be easy for you to find it again then. I don’t mind waiting while you find the link.
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lol i could never match your times on pet builds, even on identical builds it took me like twice as long as your clear times - literally my first Crate kill i panicked when he was still alive after 2minutes and you had killed him in less than 1 - after that i just always “rounded up” when using as measurement
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Of course I can find it again, it is just a matter of uploading to GT 
But you are way better pet builder than me, I am sure you can figure it out yourself.
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I don’t think I can figure out the impossible.
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this turned from a “beastcaller could kinda deserve more +briar” to “you know how to test that” 
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One thing I know about Grim Dawn is that, topics rarely tend to stay on topic…
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I had one of my thread split into another thread, and that thread went off-topic 3 times 
But anyway, if physical pets is the weakest and worst of them all, I am pretty confident that the other pet builds are also just fine.
Also, I think the signals the “elite” builders sent can be missinterpted “pet builds are ded” more casual ppl and beginners will then not even consider them because “they read it on the forums”. But thing is, they can still do the relevant end-game content.
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seriously tho, from a “elite pet builder” perspective, how hard do you really/“objectively” feel beastcaller/briar has suffered in performance
the guy i talked to on the steam forum (another filthy casul like myself no doubt) also said his was fine - but neither of us are running, nor even expecting, pushing SR90, like ever. We do “regular content”, minor celestial shenanigans, maybe, and regular SR farming, which means the highest we go would be 76, tho that isn’t really called for anymore
Unless you count Pierce Pet builds…
(there is a reason why you haven’t heard of them)
I see it from another perspective.
Gnomish for eg said that he took double my times for stuff like superboss kills.
I have had a few players tell me my builds were hard to play.
I am used to Pets. I build around my playstyle and preferences. Some might find it suited for them, others might not.
I am used to piloting my builds to near perfection while new players won’t have that luxury.
Can I kill Callagadra with my fluffy squishy in the current patch? I am sure I can, easily.
Can I do SR 90+, I am sure I can do that as well.
Crate? I am not so sure given its unique mechanics, but add consumables into the mix and I should be able to pull it off if I try hard enough.
But can I give the build to a random person and have them provide similar results?
I want them to be able to, that is kind of the core of my design philosophy along with maximum laziness.
Objectively speaking, 99% of the playerbase won’t notice any difference.
Early game should be much easier and so leveling should go smoothly compared to before (for pets in general)
Pushing into deeper SR will rely a lot more on chance and instead of simply beefing up your pets and enjoying the passive player stats you get as a result, the build making process becomes a harder puzzle to solve.
Thunderstruck / of Kings, I can see becoming popular for those who still want to push deeper shards.
Celestials will be a pain, not to actually kill, but to slog through the boredom of longer fights.
Diviner reap spirits will become the new fluffy squishy as they don’t care about useless stuff like pet defense or skill points for maxing out their non existent line of skills.
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ye but except for Crate, maybe ravager and couple of “niche” builds, ex retal, personally i’ve always been used to the Celestials being a slog, and frankly why i don’t even bother doing them anymore, like i can’t even remember when i last bothered to attempt mogdrogen to “test run” a build, because on the upside he kills you in 1 min, “best” case scenario you kill him in 5, worst case you’re looking at a 10minute leftclick contest… which i just don’t think is interesting
Crate i’ve accepted not all builds can contend with, specially not most of my stupid ideas,
Lokarr ofc i know doesn’t really matter to many, but i feel like he’s a nice starter gauge,
and if i feel ballsy i might give Rabagur a whirl,
but Calla kinda falls in the same pit as Moggy, just worse… 