It only affects one target and the value isn’t that big, at the opportunity cost of weapon component slot. It’s still very niche, only reason to use it is if you’ve only got vanilla game without expansions.
Actually I think little to nothing would change with this discovery in terms of the buildmaking. Damage reduction was considered a very strong debuff already and was incorporated in builds if reasonably possible.
What’s about skills like fist of vire or nullification?
Do they work the same way and do they stack with general DR?
This also explains, beyond order on damage formula, why I always felt damage reduction (e.g. possession) sucked butt compared to reduced incoming damage. Can’t compete with the latter debuffing so much.
Good question.
The common opinion is physical and elemental damage reductions don’t stack with all-damage reduction, but I never tested it personally.
As for whether they cut debuffs in similar way - probably not. But this is merely an educated guess, I could be wrong.
Does this mean the Arbiter relic is one of the best in the game? I already thought it was underrated but this information increases its value a lot.
First thing i checked after learning this DR “feature”.
But the skill mimics forcewave, its not a judgment-like nuke, so DR application will be very limited.
It actually didn’t change much things except the order of debuff(should be). DR was important, now it’s a bit more important and it’s more valuable to have a castable/AoE DR since if you apply first while encountering an enemy, you’ll get the advantage of having lesser debuff effects from them. I don’t know how it will result the outcome but atleast something to follow.
ugh, i posted this with a thought that its not about DR being good on player but about it being broken on enemies that have stupidly high values of it and that it should be altered.
I see your point. The discovery of yours explains some instances I had with my toons and why they felt squishier/weaker than they should be. But we were playing without knowing this info and except a few exceptions all things was okay. All can agree if Grava has lower DR affects in SR and CR. I can also suggest same with Shattered Sentinel/Theodin in SR which are kinda ‘‘too’’ strong after SR 85. Some other exceptions can be suggested/discussed. This issue also explains why we can’t get proper crit chances even with high DA shred. Couldn’t figure out by myself that monsters affect your debuff efficiency, not without GI lol. But in the end, it didn’t change much.
This is the main thing. Just like with physical/armor interactions being unintended, the game was still balanced around their unknown functionality to achieve the current state of things. I don’t expect tweaking DR debuffs on enemies to matter too significantly one way or another, but at the same time the game works as intended even if the steps to get here are malformed.
I’ll take a gander through grimtools when I’m home to look for any enemies with particularly egregious DR debuffs.
I mean what you’re thinking is right but data is data and people get to do what they wanna do with the data you provided.
But anyway it’s probably useless thinking about this on the player’s case since (1) DR sources don’t stack, which makes it hard to abuse, and (2) most people already max the best DR sources they get on their builds, so we get max benefit most of the time anyway
Tho this provides the reason why prenerf censure was so broken, since even enemy RR is reduced 100% of the time. Which is also why fire/lightning struggles more with Grava than say cold struggles with Kuba.
Clearly the big highlight of this discovery is the fact that Health Reduction is reduced on 3-4 independent layers, which is preeeeeeeeetty coooooooooool.
GD, as most games, much like a mathematical theory, is a closed system with set rules (axioms). Knowing the rules is imperative to achieve an expected outcome. Without this knowledge you opperate blindly within the system: when you make a build; when you propose balance changes; when you implement them, and so on - everything is empyrical to a degree, everything is imprecise.
We see 2-3% patch changes to item/skill stats in the game on a regular basis. Trying to diminish the impact of this huge chunk of “rules of the game” about DR, which can change the expected strength of the build for 10% and more, is kinda ignorrant.
The relatively recent “discovery” of magical property of dmg converted to phys produced numerous strong builds, in fact, the vast majority of strongest non-retal phys builds rely on converted to phys dmg and, most likely, wouldn’t have been made without it. This discovery produced a build that triggered another round of generic AAR nerfs, and these nerfs pushed several AAR builds out of viability.
Speaking of phys builds, this knowledge about DR reveals that Empyrion devo path is much stronger than Oleron path for all phys builds with no access to high DR.
Lol so i guess this is why Aleks’s meteor would do jack to my BA Witchblade when he RR’d that character before dropping a meteor. He was under perma DR because Warborn War Cry is best War Cry.
It all depends on which point of view you’re looking this at. Zantai gets the most use of this discovery (if he didn’t know of this beforehand) as he’s in charge of balance and will therefore have more insight as to how future changes regarding DR affects game balance.
As for the builder perspective, while this should in theory affect how we should distribute points towards DR sources, practically it still means we max censure like every elemental inquisitor already does. We max decay like every RE build already does. We’re already maxing Ill Omen too on builds that use it for DR and have the points.
As DR sources in the game are pretty limited. The only two questions on the builder side I can think of are: (1) Is it worth it putting that next 4 points on War Cry from 12/12 to 16/12? and (2) is investing 12 points on Horn of Gandarr worth it for your non elemental inquisitor? Those two are the only mastery-based DR sources that aren’t always maxed nowadays (war cry is generally left 12/12).
In before Zantai is already aware of this for eons at this point and has enemy DR sources balanced around it. lol
Maybe, but if I had to place a bet it would be against that. I mean DR affecting debuffs was suspected for at least two years, and back ago I did relay these suspicions. Zantai’s answer was vague, but I took it as he didn’t believe that.
Is the coding similar for total damage modified by X% or is that coded to behave as expected?
How does it affect dmg reductions of a particular dmg type? Like elemental on Null and Horn?
Here’s another thing that i’ve tested and it turns out to be even more broken than %DR.
Modded Steward to have 50 flat DR over 5 secs on his breath, instead of % one.
Initial ADctH is 16%, then breath comes in - no lifesteal at all because 16-50<0
Then Ghoul kicks in, 5 second debuffs still works - lifesteal is present, 16+80 - 50 > 0
Quite a plenty of mobs have this kind of DR on their skills.
Good job, engine.