Da shreds from Crushing Verdict and Markovian’s Advantage don’t stack
@Fluff
Last question because you’ve been kind enough to let me pick your brain: isn’t Final Stop better than Zolhan for these kind of builds? Zolhan’s on hit proc seems great but Stop saves you lots of points and has better retal stats. And what does this 12 meter range on Zolhan’s proc mean? AoEs say “target area” or “radius” so is it a single target ranged proc?
Nah it’s not like vanilla anymore. You don’t have to wait for mobs to hit you. Small mobs that get stunned die anyway. On a flat dmg retal build like this want you want to stack as many %retal to attack sources as possible. You are missing out on the best part of the new mechanic devotion wise
Epic. I didn’t like that goddamn verdict anyway.
Such nice.
Fixed.
Is possible to put the points from markovian’s into verdict instead if that is more meaningful for playing.
Nah, i think you are plain wrong.
Targo’s hammer for example, it’s equates to 5%*times it hits(1?) increased retaliation damage, with trample being 6% increased per time you block compared to your 100% retal damage.
It’s minor damage increases at best unless the right conditions are in place, like say an army of ranged hitting you while you are fighting boss, or trample killing ranged. Ironically these two advantages counters each other and the only real advantage here is killing ranged. They are actually defensive cc’s(that you don’t need).
They stun and knockdown thereby directly countering your entire playstyle of retaliation, and it hardly increases boss damage. Doesn’t seem that good to me, maybe, maaybe if it was so powerfult hat everything just died that it touched, but i doubt it. If that’s the case i can pick it then. It’s a bit hard for me to test right now, computer i have can’t run grim dawn lul, my main pc is parked elsewhere.
You know what, fuck it, i will make such a version also to have all possibilities covered.
https://www.grimtools.com/calc/D2p4qkL2
There, i guess this is the final version for now except some minor tweaks to stats. Did lose some health to be able to get those devotions. Ah well, now it has got all the shield power stuff i always wanted rofl.
You seem to have things figured out in spite of someone who has tested this build and mechanic successfully telling you otherwise. Perhaps you will convince yourself if you’ll ever attempt to try
Maybe, but i prefer to discuss things with details. Not just, that’s good because… yea, trust me.
That’s why i answered with arguments why i didn’t think so, instead of just leaving it at saying “nah i think ya wrong”.
I am used to getting straight to the point, i walk through a lot of trolls in my time who all think they are right. What convinced me really was watching a video to point out that hammer seems to hit 5 times!
Hey Superfluff - thanks for this info - I was trying to get these answers which are very helpful for my theorycrafting!
One more very, very important question as I prepare for March 27! If I use righteous fervor with retribution, and also use smite and shattering smash procs, will the retribution damage be applied to multiple enemies via the smite and shattering smash aoe? In other words, if Smite procs, will the retribution RDATA damage hit 3 enemies? If shattering smash procs, will the retribution RDATA damage hit the enemies in the cone?
Thanks!!
Hey,
I’ll include this explnation in the build as well. Short answer to your question is yes.
Here is how it works:
Shattering smash:
It works like upheval basicaly. Main target will receive full damage(in this case retal damage) from Main hand and Shield. MAin target also receives both Retribution damage and Shattering Smash retal mod from main hand an off hand. Mobs behind your main target will be hit by Off hand shield damage only as described in tool tip. As retal dmg varies a lot the 2 dmg sources can vary a lot too. Sometimes a crit from main hand can be lower than non crit from off hand for example
Smite:
All 3 targets get hit by retribution if in range. Not only that but it applies to both main hand and off hand. If you use Final Stop shield for the Smite mod, it will also apply to all 3 targets, main hand and off hand
Zolhan Technique:
Same as smite. Retribution to all targets + Mod from Zolhan shield if you use it. Only difference is that there is no off hand. To compensate for that the mod is slightly stronger and also ZT hits in a much wider arc.
Had i been a troll i’d have been expelled from this forum a very long time ago
Hey man, thanks a lot! That’s a very thorough explanation. My takeaway is that I should put at least 3-5 points in the weapon pool skills to give retribution/retaliation damage on righteous fervor some nice aoe! Just a few more days before I can test this out myself!
I’ve been wondering a lot about DA on a build like this. Originally my plan was stack as much DA as possible so that nemesis/super bosses don’t obliterate me, but at those levels of DA nothing else would ever hit me. Is the solution to that just gear swaps? I’d spec in and out of physique for fights like that if attribute respec potions were easier to come by.
I am very much in doubt of this myself.
The way i see is like this, everything gets more efficient when you don’t have mega DA on builds like this, more blocks, more retal procs, gets more OA, etc.
So, the way i see it don’t get mega DA unless you actually need it to survive. I’m thinking with 100% block and overguard + large armour that will be enough for the game but i won’t know till i try it. That’s what i am thinking anyway.
Can’t remember monster crit damage but crits really don’t increase damage average damage very much unless you got a good crit damage so i doubt it’s gonna be the end of the world not to have mega DA.
I can give a little update on DA values.
I think now for me it’s rather safe to say i will try to completely remove as much DA as possible. My first v1 version of build had 3600 DA and that puts bosses chance to hit like 54% against me. That sucks. Imagine how hard it is for regular mobs to hit me then. On my now 2680 that’s 80% chance. Still regular mobs they can hardly strike that probably.
Also, i think this is just generally problematic because it’s counter-intuitive. You’d think on retal tank you want physique and to be very tanky, so for crate it might be worth considering to change the order of defense so it tries to block before trying to evade the hit. Wouldn’t you also use your shield like that in real life? The negative effect of such a change is ofc for block builds they be wasting block recharge time on hits that might have missed. I guess they could move block up above chance to hit, so when hit was blocked when the chance to hit check comes it instead gives the same chance to not use block cooldown. This would make everything make more sense in my opinion.
So it has been updated now with a more stable safe performance version, more tanky version without assassin mark but with healing rain.
Great. Just a few things you’re still getting kinda wrong.
There’s no 56% chance to hit you. It’s been capped at 60% long ago.
There’s no dropping Assassin’s Mark on a physical build. There’s no two ways to put it: for whatever reasons you think you’re doing it it’s an build error.
Seems you got your advice resistance good and overcapped 
Watch me drop it.
I don’t drop it for efficiency, i drop it for relaxation of mind, quality of play, ease of play. Its instability is a mindfucker, with it the build is annoying because can’t rely and sits wrong on the mind in a multitide of ways, without it then build is relaxing even calming and healing is much improved which is something lacking atm. The only thing it is needed for is tough bosses, and while they take a bit longer, it’s a small efficiency loss on the overall scope of things to play safer. It don’t work well on super bosses regardless in this setup and frees up 11 passives as well to not go for it. Also you can’t utilize shield wall properly if you are using assassin mark on rigtheous fervor in this build.
So it’s a lot of downsides as well, and end up playing more annoying build with maybe 5%, max 10% efficiency gain in terms of overall clearspeed.
And it’s just a much cooler build.
Reached 65 now and completed devotions. I only get more and more beastly, i’m starting to transgress into immortal faceroll mode, killing also faster and faster.
Just switched to fervor, big upgrade.
All in all very happy with it, it’s not just a tank it kills stuff fast sometimes its elites die in 1 sec when everything aligns. Considering if trample is really worth it, keeping it for now.
Hello,
I’d like to try your build. Can you give some tips for lvling?
ty
To level you start with cadence, later counterstrike + menhir’s bulwark, also some. I went shield block chance points early also, overguard too. Level Shattering Smash when you can also and celestial presence(I haven’t got this yet on 69). When you start putting points into bulwark and counterstrike, then from around then you can begin focusing on retal gear and before you know it most monsters die when they hit you.
For devotions since i went block points fast i went right into anvil for targo’s hammer, then turtle --> Stag --> messenger of war and then eventually towards shield maiden, then obelisk of menhir and finally tree of life.
it’s interesting, may I know how does your build deal with ranged creep?