Some Conduits could use spicing up

Over the years, Conduits have gone to some truly zany places. Spam Aegis, spam Doom Bolt, nova Phantasmal Blades, Chaos “rain from the sky” TSS. However, looking over them, there are still some affixes that feel like they don’t fit what Conduits are trying to do, or, simply feel a bit too vanilla, if you will. These could be split into two groups: Channelling spells and RR modifiers

1. Channelling Spells

Flames of Ignaffar
20% Weapon Damage
18% Chance of Impaired Aim to target for 2 Seconds

Drain Essence
24% Weapon Damage
15% Slower Enemy Attack for 2 Seconds

Albrecht’s Aether Ray
16% Weapon Damage
20% Slower target Movement for 1 Second

All three of these basically do the same thing: add some % WD and a secondary debuff effect. Doesn’t feel very fitting for what Conduits are designed to do, that being: supporting niche damage conversions or skill uses. This is especially the case for the FoI Conduit, as from these three skills, FoI is the only one that already has inherent % weapon damage. The extent of the “zany” for that conduit is adding Impaired Aim to a skill that already has Fumble. That’s not very experimental.

2. RR modifiers

War Cry
1650 Bleeding Damage over 3 Seconds
22 Reduced target’s Resistances for 3 Seconds

Curse of Frailty
-15% Elemental Resistance

There are many more of these “added RR” modifiers across the Conduits, such as those tied to Storm Box or Devouring Swarm, but those not only add RR the skill doesn’t natively have, most of them also convert the skill they’re tied to. The two above, however, seem strangely timid. Both of them are free of major conversions and add something the skill already does. War Cry with the Terrify modifier already has generic flat RR, which is only 1 RR point weaker. So all the Conduit does is save 3 skill points (removing the terrify chance in the process) and add bleeding, a damage type Soldier already supports. In the case of CoF, Elemental RR is already part of the skill, Conduit just amplifies it. Going Elemental as Occultist is not all that crazy of an idea, certainly not enough to warrant a Conduit slot.

I feel like these 5 Conduits could either use some spicing up or could be a good spot for a full redesign. If we were to try to stick to the original design of the latter two Conduits, the CoF Conduit could add flat Elemental damage to CoF, perhaps promoting a playstyle similar to Word of Pain, except the player will have to find their own sources of flat damage for CoF. The War Cry Conduit could perhaps be adding flat Pierce or flat Vitality to War Cry, or perhaps include % Weapon damage and some War Cry damage conversion to promote a shouter build.

The first three Conduits seem like a good place for some new, wacky designs. DE, AAR and FoI don’t really seem like the skills that give much room for that. The FoI Conduit could be replaced with a Cold Aura of Censure Conduit with lifesteal to perhaps promote an aura build. The AAR Conduit could be replaced with a Chaos Devastation Conduit that removes the spell’s cooldown but also drops the duration and projectile count so that the spell only drops one meteor. The DE Conduit could be replaced with an Acid Reap Spirit Conduit that either has an AoE explosion around the target, or chains between enemies.

A third group worth mentioning are the Conduits for the two core CC abilities:

Blade Trap
100% Piercing Damage converted to Vitality Damage
-15% Vitality Resistance

Olexra’s Flash Freeze
-20% Physical Resistance
-20% Aether Resistance

These would be technically zany…if they worked. Both conflict with the skill’s dedicated set (Rimetongue and Mageslayer respectively), thus removing the ability to further increase the skills’ Trap/Freeze resistance reduction. A BT or OFF at ultimate levels with Conduit equipped and the absolute maximum number of duration increasing items lasts a grand total of around 1 second on all nemeses. And that’s with the maximum item support, which isn’t always good for the build (e.g. dual-wielding Spectral Blugeons). This means that most often the Conduit’s effect ends up being mostly useless.

For these, I think the Conduit itself is fine, it’s the base ability that’s simply not useful enough/not fulfilling its role. The addition of reduced Trap/Freeze reduction to the base skill was a step in the right direction in increasing the general usability of the skills without a set, but it feels like it’s still not enough. If the worry is that reducing Nemesis Trap/Freeze res even further (either through these skills, or just across the board dropping their res) is that they could be perma-cc’d, a common approach is to give enemies a resistance to cc after the initial cc expires. I’m sure something like that could be baked into BT and OFF. If the maximum duration of the CC on a nemesis were to be increased to, say, 2 s, so that players get to capitalise on the debuffs that come bundled with these skills, the enemy could afterwards be given a 6-8 s buff that increases their Freeze/Trap resist. It would allow these crazy builds like Physical Arcanist using the Conduit to possibly actually exist, without making OFF and BT broken across the board.

I have a build that really needs it. It’s a 2h FoI and thus experimental because normally FoI builds are with off-hands. It can be used with various 2h FoI builds so it does support a niche FoI use. Let’s not change it please.

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Agreed that the “zany” Conduits are the far more interesting ones. It’s hard to justify using a Conduit that offers solely conversion if the damage type is going to be unsupported by the mastery/items so the unique mods add a lot to the conduits.

A couple potential ideas I would add for Conduits would be:

  • Aether Stun Jacks: extra projectiles instead of total damage (like the PB and Hagarrad conduits)
  • Chaos Stun Jacks: less projectiles but a large total damage buff for a longer range playstyle
  • Acid Doom Bolt: add a bunch of poison damage
  • Chaos Mortar Trap: +1 Summon Limit
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I disagree they all need to be “zany”

I think there should be one “boring” for every class. So I like to keep the CoF
I wish I could get the vindictive flame one back that was removed

The reason is that sometimes you I just want the massive survival power of the conduit +3 max all resist combined with a fairly normal build for the class instead of a build that is more a ingenuity for the forum and comes with the message: “well you need to level this as something very different from what it is”

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i prefer zaney, but dont’ mind some generic boosts to exist (i’d almost imagine bunch of complaints if removing 15% ele RR conduit from Occultist perceived on how it’s sometimes often used)
I’ve no clue if AAR wd conduit is/would be used or competitive again like it was for a hot minute back in the day, but FoI WD seems to get some use with no real better options for 2handers anyway.

OFF aether/phys RR i can’t wrap my head around, in part because of OFFs mechanic, but also because of the investment required to then make use of it, which both conflicts with the dmg types but also not quite sure when/where aether or phys arcanists would even prefer that OFF investment to then stack 20rr “over just stacking something else”

War Cry could seem fine, as i recall the issue was more application/functionality, it doesn’t overlap, so the RR doesn’t become as usual to the bleed build. (something usual WC uptime makes need for RR elsewhere and the war cry hit bleed was checked before the flat RR application is calced iirc?)

If FoA comes with a dark “Rimetongue” trap set to use the BT conduit i don’t think that conduit is so bad

kinda puzzled why that wasn’t already the case like with fire, since that seems to be the “natual” inclination for acid stuff :thinking:

That’s why I suggested not removing it, but expanding it with flat ele damage on top of it. Not something you HAVE to build around, doesn’t interfere with the existing conduit, but if you want to try to build around it as your AoE, the possibility is there.

sure, but that just a free buff to existing RR users :sweat_smile:, not really a similar incentive as the other zaney examples
*not saying it’s bad/wrong, but appears unnecessary, and possibly even infamously “compensation inducing” :zantai: :scorv: (nerfs)

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I’d make an experimental Blade Trap bleed/vitality witch hunter in a heartbeat if it worked on nemeses long enough. You can get +4s duration to it from headgear + medal but the entrapment RR only barely gets nemeses below 100% res, so the +4s still gets reduced to nothing. There aren’t any other skill mods to it either, and merely getting the skill itself capped is nigh impossible. It’s probably rather pointless to complain about this with FoA changes being mostly unknown, though.

Anyway, I’d like to see 10-20% entrapment RR on the conduit and skill bonuses added to more items.

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You can do it, but it’s not easy though! I made an incomplete rough draft for this combo back in 1.2.1.2: Witch Hunter, Level 100 (GD 1.2.1.2) - Grim Dawn Build Calculator

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Agreed 100% :+1:

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honestly it should be the type of rr that has the most effect the higher the resistance, dunno which one that was otoh. wait, that wouldn’t even work because we already have -% trap res on the base skill that diminishes the effect of said rr, right?

Wild Whispers:

fire storm totem
chaos devouring swarm

Warring Whispers:

chaos counter strike
bleed 22 flat rr war cry
aether counter strike

Undying Whispers:

Runic Whispers:

aether rune haggard
acid storm box
vitality storm box

Night Whispers:

aether ring of steel
aether shadow strike
vitality blade trap (used to have trap RR I think too)

Eldritch Whispers:

cold hellhound (might change after natures +1 summon, dunno)
pierce bloody pox

Divine Whispers:

lightning vire’s might
aether vire’s might

Destructive Whispers:

acid canister bomb
chaos mortar
aether grenade

Arcane Whispers:

piercing ray (I mean it’s really cool looking but fails miserbly)
chaos trozan shards (same like pierce ray)


A lot of these things are cool but imo they heavily either lack “the flow” or simply put - gear support. That’s what I have gathered when playing around with them for a while at least…

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Here the odd thing to me regarding OFF and Blade Trap.

Clearly, CC’n mobs too often that are suppose to be a challenge goes against any sort of vision (IMO). But in a world where there are clearly known (and unknown) builds that are basically already doing that by burning mobs down so fast they don’t really do anything to you unless they come in SR type groups…/confused.

I’d really like to play with these skills without the context of them having limited use or relying on conditions/sets to make them work.

+1. Not to mention converting the vit to something else.

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I use the pierce devouring swarm conduit in a rancor trickster build and it works well. The build was quite good too, being capable of sub-5 min SR runs and casually kiting calla/ravager to death.

The chaos RR in the swarm conduit seems kinda useless since any chaos shaman build is mostly one that uses the savagery/upheaval conduit instead. I’ve tried to use this conduit for physical builds where I pair it with Korvan Casque, giving 30% phys RR to swarm. It’s a tempting idea for phys/bleed hybrids, but it hurts that Korvan Casque has no bleed support, and the vitality->chaos conversion on swarm is useless. I’ll be testing this in some kind of trauma/bleed build once the playtest lands with the fix to converted dots stacking.

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Alright, sounds doable let em cross it out then. :smiley:

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I think this conduit is fine. Ele → Aether is pretty useful. You can make a few builds with it I think. Here’s Panini + RoH Mage Hunter example Mage Hunter, Level 100 (GD 1.2.0.3) - Grim Dawn Build Calculator

I played Aether RoH + Reaping Arc when the conduit had -20% TDM but thankfully the penalty was removed after complaints

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[1.2.1.6] Pierce AAR Mage Hunter, SR 36+ sr36 :no_mouth:
i swear the goal for meme fail keeps changing harder and harder :sweat_smile:

and while i agree with some of the other entries, it’s a simply numbers issue, which unfortunately is also intended; Conduit builds were not meant to be regular “competitive”/meta top50 material
hopefully FoA will add additional item support for some unconventional stuff, like my precious chaos Trozan, to make more conduit memes shine :face_exhaling:
(i’d almost imagine new faction gear being a prime opportunity for just something like basic +skill points, besides new modifier potential, or Onslaught)

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I’m still much more in favour of these “cool but lacks support” Conduits than those I listed in the OP. Them not having much of any item support is kinda the point. They are meant to be there for those who want to find their own fun, so to speak. I wouldn’t want Fire Storm Totems to be taking up much real estate on gear when other, “intended” builds could use it instead. Plus if you do give these things direct support, it kinda takes from the adventure of trying to put something like that together. And I imagine FoA is going to solve some of these problems, as we’ll be able to bias MIs whichever way we want, so you can turn that Groble Storm Effigy to Fire etc. I’m guessing the viability of some of these Conduits you listed will end up being determined by how much of the important items for a given skill are legendaries vs MIs. If most of it is on MIs, Conduits will be in a great place. We’ll just have to burn a bunch of materials for it.

I liked the “new wave” of conduits that were introduced with March of the Memes, though some of those then ended up much less a meme than probably intended (spam Aegis, nova PB). It would be great if all conduits could be transformative like that. Kinda like GD’s own little version of PoE support gems. But I’m happy to settle for just having all these conduits be cool puzzle material. Some just aren’t, particularly the channel and cc ones.

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I used the Fire Storm Totems conduit in the full Fire Druid concept - 100% Lightning and Cold conversion

Looks playable

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Yes, it did and it was taken away in 1.2:

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Would be nice to get it back! :pray:

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same with OFF conduits (and then some), to atleast put them on par with mageslayer/rimetongue cc res bonuses so they don’t get triple penalized for “meme” support :sweat_smile: