I still think the table is more telling, but at least you can still use that+the personal rankings. Like the immortal words of Winnie the pooh - more is more, unless you suffer from overdose.
I like changes.
I don’t like stupid changes.
Reaching fair and updated scoring for each individual tester was not feasible for us. A lot of builds were updated throughout the testing, and people didn’t have enough motivation and time to go back to review their exact scoring for each individual build.
At some point there was not a single day passed that i didn’t ask everyone to review their scoring for the builds that were updated during the testing. And most marks still weren’t updated. In the spreadsheet we have Pyran SB at 45th place, LD Puri at 36th place. Placing builds in the end list by their current spreadsheet scoring would be a big mistake that compromises the whole effort.
Idk, I think it was quite stupid to add a completely subjective layer at the end that does nothing to address people not playing updated versions of each build and months of oBjEcTiVe hand wringing, so beauty is in the eye of the beholder here. Both sources are posted so diligent readers can form their own opinions, I was just offering the rational that was mentioned in discord.
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Your approach (sticking to the final rating in the grimsheet) is certainly the best one on paper. But that would require everyone playing and replaying all the builds at the same time and carefuly reviewing and re-reviewing their previous ratings. It would also imply that the system that we had for rating builds is like 90%+ objective. First thing was impossible because of the amount of work everyone had to do and all of it on voluntary basis: everyone was reviewing builds at their own pace and many of us didn’t have a lot of times to review and adjust every rating to all of the 40+ builds we played. Second thing is also hard to achieve (having objective build rating metrics), we ended up with some builds “loopholing” their way to the top due to price of gear, and also our “group tankiness” metric was far from being consistent across the builds, etc.
In the end, the grimsheet rating was a great crutch to all the testers when they were compiling their personal lists. I think that our final top20 is as good as it gets.
I am replying here and not in our discord for people who are curious why we did the things the way we did them.
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It’s a little bit stupid to add that subjective layer. But it’s the best we got at the given time.
Thoroughly enjoyed the last Top 20 Softcore builds, and after perusing this list, it is just as good! Really interesting to see Nightblade in so many of these builds now–one of my favorite classes.
Disclaimer: I play solo on Xbox. I have not beaten a single Celestial Boss (not on Ultimate, at least). I have taken a several characters to SR 75-76, and took retaliation Warlord up to 85. Is there some compendium of specific builds to take down specific Celestial bosses? All of them kick my butt. And this Top 20 Softcore list really only mentions SR 75/76.
It’s kind of frustrating that I can’t seem to get over this hump.
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Hello guys,
I’m trying to understand how the link to discord on the gdoc works for the build file. It sent me to a discord page with nothing.
And what is the .zip under the builds? what do I have to do with this?
Thanks a lot and good job for the great works
I honestly (still) find the internet baffling. I’m an older guy, mid-fifties, and have been using it since the beginning. Nothing changes. People in an online community flog their guts out offering something for free simply for the love of it. Cue others - who’ve offered little or nothing - appearing out of the woodwork to snark and nit-pick.
The OPs here have made their rationale quite clear. Even I understand it. It isn’t meant to be definitive, just fun for those who want to take part.
Now I’ve added to the chaff in this thread that isn’t about the subject matter, but I thought the people who created this list and put a lot of effort into it deserve to know a lot of us appreciate it.
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The easiest and obvious solution would be to add 3% adcth on Kraken, i think, to help with leech.
I doubt it will have an impact on the Top 20, but might for the honorable mentions… Evoker Vin sheet on the toxic top 20 is not including the Celestials in total calculation that is brought over to summary page (cell 25B should be summing through row 24).
All of them can take down Celestials, but difficulty varies. We will be adding more videos (we already have most of them) as time goes by.
It’s based on our personal lists, not on the list you see in Grimsheet. Unfortunately it just didn’t make it this time.
Discord links are to our server, it’s a relic of testing useless to people outside the server because in here we have zip files ready for everyone. Just unpack the contents into your Grim Dawn/Save/Main folder (if playing from Steam).
Can we have access to this discord Sir?
I have unpack the zip files in Grim dawn/Save - nothing happens
Turn off cloud saves
Documents/My Games/Grim Dawn/save/main
Put the extracted folder there, play main game.
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Totally makes sense considering how versatile the entire Oathkeeper kit is. You have great RR that covers 7 damage types with Celestial Presence (aura as well, so one less button to press). Great support for shield, WPS, AA replacer builds. Extra mobility button, which is less important now with evade added, but still super nice to have. Two great ultimate skills. I wish the new Berserker class in FoA is just as good if not better.
Can you provide examples of monster skills that inflict impaired aim but not an equivalent or greater amount of fumble?
I think one of the real reasons why ranged might be underperforming is that melees get greater access to radial or wide-angle AoE procs and can apply them better. And these procs can proc each other, potentially bypassing fumble.
We’ll see what happens in FoA when ranged builds can start stacking Evade charges.
From the top of my head Kaisan. Also those aether snake heroes. There is someone else, don’t remember.
Yeah, that might also play a role since monsters are flanking all the time.
I have a few questions. I am a new player. and I wanted to try out some complete characters so I downloaded a few of them above. I disabled cloud saves in the game. but when I copy some characters into the game I don’t see any characters. My local save folder address does not have the main file (E:\Steam install\steamapps\common\Grim Dawn\save). I don’t know why I don’t have the main file. someone help me. Sorry my English is quite bad