Just wanted to get everyone’s opinions on what are the all-around toughest opponents in the game.
(I know that some bosses are harder for some type of builds than others, but just as a general idea)
I’m gonna put a list here, to be able to discuss this, the whole point is to tell me I’m wrong, so I can change it and finally arrive to a general consensus.
I’d reorder as follows, with caveats after each group:
Superbosses
Crate of Entertainment: the only boss I haven’t killed, not even once, not even close. Best I did was half HP. The boss itself may not be as insane as it seems, the issue is the run to it is ass and if you lose once you have to restart the whole thing cause the summons persist between runs. Completely discourages me from trying to actually get it done. It also massively limits you in what builds you can use against it since the 70% total damage debuff makes any sort of melee untenable, given that the whole boss fight is essentially on a timer.
Callagadra
Ravager (have yet to actually figure how tough you need to be to stand up to this boss straight up, I always just abuse his leash and wear him down)
massive gap here in terms of threat level
Avatar of Moggie the Droggie (only cause even if you have him easily handled it takes ages compared to Lokarr; I actually find him pretty easy otherwise, I have a number of characters that have enough natural Lightning overcap that I can just slap him around as is, can’t say that for any of the top 3)
Lokarr
Clone
these two are flipped cause Clones of John Bourbon aren’t actually dangerous IMO, the only hurdle is when they get their %damage absorb shield up you lose most of you leech. If you just kite around until the shield drops or if you manage to leave one clone untouched so you have something to switch to, the whole fight is a breeze. If you’re heal/regen based, it’s trivial. Lokarr, on the other hand, actually deals threatening amounts of damage and has punish moves for both melee and ranged.
These 6 I’d put in a category of their own though since, yes, they are the toughest fights in the game, but you have to go out of your way to look for them. If you’re a Crucible (not me) or SR player (me), you never have to worry about these at all. The rest on the other hand:
Korvaak (takes forever, hits like a truck at high SR, only played a handful of characters that are actually 100 % comfortable against him at SR80)
Theodin (same problem except easier to tank IMO)
Kymon
Morgoneth (mostly under Kymon because I don’t find him nuking me dead as often as Kymon and he also seems to spawn much less frequently in SR)
Rashalga, the Mad Queen (would never ever rate her below any of the nemeses, in MC maybe, but not in SR; hits like a truck, a moment of inattention gets you shotgunned, bitch keeps healing so the fight is hard on your timer as well)
Gargabol (first phase is pretty easy, second can be trouble if you’re melee, also his constant area denial (volcanoes) keeps you on your toes and pressures you on breathing space if you haven’t cleared the SR arena)
These 6 are another category of their own as they do spawn in SR and are super dangerous. But they’re pretty rare, with Kymon and Rashalga probably spawning the most for me. The rest I see maybe once every 10 boss rooms.
Then there are the nemeses:
13. Fabius (How is he not on your list?? By far the most dangerous nemesis for me cause there’s no easy solution to him other than being a straight up supertank; can’t even kite this POS)
14. Grava (just cause of how much of a PITA he is to fight for everyone. No matter what your damage type, your damage and healing nearly disappears, kiting causes skill disruption, standing in melee causes fumbles and DR, limits you on space cause of dispell bolts. Even on characters that can crush him things can go bad cause you take a few bad hits, fumble, fumble, fumble, fumble = no healing = dead)
15. Kuba (not cause of threat, but cause depending on your damage type, you might be there for 3 minutes)
16. Iron Maiden (not even close to the threat level of Fabius but you can still take the occasional crit from full to dead on squishier builds that rely on high leech etc.)
17. Moosilauke (similarly to Kuba, not really at all because of how threatening it is, but because this is like the only common SR boss that forces you into high freeze res; I’ve had to switch precious components or devo routes just to get freeze res off the ground on some melee characters for this bastard)
At the very least I’d grab Log by the tentacles, yank him out of there and put Fabius somewhere in its place. Log really doesn’t even come close to any of those, you can kill him on Ultimate while decked out in levelling gear.
Then again, you never get to fight Loghorrean in SR
In campaign, Fabius is a pushover too
I’ve edited the OP and added Fabius (took out Reaper since no one mentioned him so far, so it might just be my experience, and the kind of builds I enjoy that are problematic)
You get to fight 3 Logs at the same time in SR, just modified. And I’d disagree on the pushover part, I’ve had low-phys res ranged characters I’ve had to overhaul defensively cause they’d breeze through the campaign, embarrass Lokarr and then I’d try to farm Cronley Warrants and get killed by Fabius 1/3rd of the time.
Edit: Reaper definitely deserves an honorable mention but once you know where the threat comes from (it’s the fucking wraiths) he’s fairly easy. His WPS thankfully doesn’t trigger that often. Speaking of honorable mentions I guess Aleks should also be noted. He’s pretty trivial alone but if you meet him in a crowded area it’s pretty hard to keep track of what he’s doing and then BLAM! Also super enjoyable around entrapment monsters.
I use SR 65+ nemesis to benchmark my build, so most of my experience is from them. I always have problem with Kaisan and Reaper on SR 75+, last time I face Reaper on SR 81, my highest damage taken went up from 11k to 17k with 12/12 Blast Shield active. Kaisan is always nasty when he summon his 2 crystal.
Grava, IM, Fabius, Kuba, and Moosi can be tough to face too, but it’s mostly when they resist the build damage type. Aleks mostly just know when to avoid his meteor or bait it away with your mouse cursor.
About the other nemesis, I’m rarely struggling against them.
On superboss, Calla and Ravager most of the time requires specific stats on the build, so I don’t face them often unless using specialist build to farm their head piece. Mogdrogen drop is too niche for me, so he’s one of the superboss I rarely fight. For me, campaign Korvaak is a glorified training dummy, basically I test my build DPS on his first phase and see if my build can force him to second phase before he use any skill.
curious why Logh is even on the list, and why higher than nemesis
surely you must have thought about Kra’vall, because there can’t be a world where Logh is on a "toughest boss"list, let alone above nemesis ?
I guess it’s the last straw for this guy in that list then.
I was comparing it to the other bosses in campaign, as you never encounter it in SR (well, you get to meet 3 of his clones sometimes, but do they have the same stats ?) and nemesis aren’t particularly hard in campaign.
MC Nemesis might not be hard compared to SR, but i’d still say it’s an even more far cry for Logh
which is why i thought it might have been Kra’vall, since he actually hits hard and does stuff (tho being a static grounded enemy he still has cheese potential ofc)
i think IMarcusI’s list is pretty close to how i’d rank stuff, i’d rank Morgoneth higher tho
same with Maiden, she has bigger 1 shot potential than some of the others, which can be tough for builds to mitigate because “fixed” armour ratings on builds and phys res is scarce
Hmm. As someone who mainly plays SR in endgame I’ll list my worst enemies to encounter. I’ll do it from the perspective of 1v1 in boss rooms, as a clusterfuck in shards with a nem is a different story.
1: Mad Queen. She’s a pain, I don’t have any chars that can dps her down before that red aura of death, and few who can tank her. So basically you always have to kite, and a misstep is death for glassier chars.
2: Grava. I don’t even hate his arcane balls. What I hate is the inconsistency of his fumble pools. Sometimes you can kill him before his de-buff, sometimes you die because you can’t leech due to fumbling all your attacks. Very frustrating.
3: Maiden. If you misplay and get blitzed by her on a glassier char, you’re dead. It’s honesty one of the more frustrating things in SR for me. Ok, so that’s a case of git gud. But no matter the char it feels like it takes FOREVER to kill her, plus she has a really annoying heal skill so it takes even longer.
4: Fabius. Simply because he can spawn with insane weapons that obliterate you no matter what. Usually he’s not a problem, but sometimes he’s impossible to kill/ he’s dealing mad damage and I rage quit after 5 consecutive deaths.
5: Theodin. Thankfully he’s rarer than annoying nems, but man this guy can hurt. Plus 2 stage in general is just frustrating in SR.
Sentintel is especially difficult for pets without mind control as you simply lose the pets, also the fighting area is rather small and he summons the acid shards which add to difficulty of the fight.
Also we need to add if we talk about difficulty of the bosses basis end-game builds? I mean, including mythical legendaries, fully upgraded devotions, etc?
Callagdra and Crate are in the league of their own, Ravager is slightly easier. Mogdrogen is no difficult then average nemesis in Main Campaign now, you just need lightning/stun overcap. Sentinel for pets, Morgoneth, Korvaak and Theodin are 2nd tier, then there is everything else, in my opinion.
yea, no, that’s just utter BS and i’ve no idea why some people think that
i’ve got several characters that can kill MC nemesis blind folded with a hand tied behind their back while they are talking to a salesman on the phone eating breakfast on the toilet
and by no means can they kill Mogdrogen
heck, a melee build that can clear Morgoneth, Lokarr and SR 75 nemesis with lighhtning res overcap and stun resist might not necessarily be able to kill Mogdrogen, because he still hits like a freight train in melee
let me be clear i’m talking about melee toons, since ranged or casters is an entirely different thing on Mogdrogen
but since my base benchmark for builds is Morgoneth, Lokarr and at minimum SR 65 (which is way tougher than MC nemesis) and still often the melee builds that can clear those things can’t survive Mogdrogen, because he hits too hard for the same stats and leech too little
so being able to kill MC nemesis aint remotely a notch that a build can kill Mogdrogen, and comparing them is absurd
Purifier, Level 100 (GD 1.1.9.6) - Grim Dawn Build Calculator this is purifier which killed Mog - but before the nerf of passthrough which obviously helped with leech from the minions he summoned. Only used potion for adtch, fight took abt 4 mintues. Hardly a ranged since i was shooting Mog just in front of him.
I don’t know how the situation is now after the passthrough has been removed.
Ravager, on the other hand, shreds this build in 5-10 secons (depending if Ghoul procced or not) despite all potions, dps/leech is simply not enough to sustain the damage and keep shooting.
