about as much work as copying the transfer stash would have been, which was your reason (being able to dupe) for not allowing the mats in it. So as a reason not to allow storing mats, duping is still out, as it is equally easy whether you can store them or not
Overall I think some limitations are good. It makes people strive to work around them and appreciate the point to which theyâve taken their build.
I played TQ a lot and Defiler and TQ vault although very useful made things too easy. The temptation is too high and there are very few who are disciplined enough to be selective with what these tools offer, or that even want to.
and yet somehow limitations are good⌠striving to work around them leads to more widespread tool use, esp if few are disciplined like you said
I see what you did there:). I understand a lot of people like the freedom and have all sorts of tools and do what they want. And I agree with you that itâs easy enough to dupe them with or without the devs allowing transfer. And itâs also this way of thinking âehh itâs easy enough anyway, no use trying otherwiseâ that ruined games like TL2 where you could transfer whatever, dupe, dupe your enchantments on equipment, and had/has a modding toll just like GD. The only difference is that GD devs are far more involved in improving and balancing their game and have also involved the community to an amazing extent. Whether one game is better than the other is subjective, especially since TL2 dev did not do much for game balance to reach itâs maximum potential.
For me, some of this âfreedomâ alters the core experience of the game. You strive to make your build better by finding new loot and making tweaks.
I personally like tools that are made to aid the game as it was intended to be (obvious bugs that need fixing and for some reason were left unresolved or, unreasonable mechanics that were not balanced and ruin the experience in some way. The Titan quest community patch was amazing stuff for example.
Everything else other than the above should be classified as a MOD. If people want to transer mats and think that is the way their game should be, then someone should make a mod for it so that those people who want it can have their way. Grim dawn offers this freedom. I donât think there is any reason for the devs to implement this officially.
I disagree. I donât want to use any mods, because I prefer the ability to train the game not be an option. I have -0- self-control if I can just stay my hero, I will. I canât play Dungeon Siege anymore. It just starts small and escalates lol.
I shouldnât need to involve someone else to trade items between characters, because I can still drop these things, and effectively trade. If Crate didnât want you to trade them, then they shouldnât be able to be dropped at all.
but finding the right loot with a different char and not being able to hand it over is more of a nuisance than a feature
Everything else other than the above should be classified as a MOD. If people want to transer mats and think that is the way their game should be, then someone should make a mod for it so that those people who want it can have their way. Grim dawn offers this freedom. I donât think there is any reason for the devs to implement this officially.
not sure how easy that is as a mod, given that we do not have one yet (other than a hacked DLL, which to me is not a mod)⌠itâs not like there simply is a flag whether storing in transfer stash is allowed, so there might be other implications, have not taken a real good look at it yet though
It actually make sense. If you play with your Friend, and you guys canât finish the Quest due bad dropluck, you can share both together mats. So its more like an reward for people who stick together and play together.
However if it would be transfarable, it would to easy to get Mats for your lowlevel twinks. This is pure balancing and intended, so even though there is an workaround(and for an Game like GD for everything is an workaround), that doesnât mean you should use it, or the concept itself doesnât make sense.
This is intended. I answered the same question on reddit the other day, for the same reason you canât trade iron bits or quest items between your own characters, they want you to play the game every time. Not play the game once, then powerlevel all your characters and bypass every quest or blockade.
crucible DLC negated that whole argument. you can make 500k iron in 1 hour, buy scrap from level 1, get all the rare mats like candy, get to level 85 in less then 1 day
and also again, why can I drop them then? I can still powerlevel all my guys with items, just have to get a friend or 2nd copy of the game.
If this is intended then you shouldnât be able to drop them
To be Fair. The Crucible DLC also kills the Purpose of the Devotion-Shrines. Should we ask now the Devs so they take out the Shrines or give us a easier way to unlock the Points in Campaign? No! Crucible is an whole other League with its own Benefits where every really have to decide to himself if he want use it to get some things faster/easier or not. And also you must atleast(if you arenât an backer) have bought the DLC.
Also please donât ignore my Argument, due the fact it letâs you looks a bit Childish on your end, because you want to force your own idea into us while you talk the Concept behind it down. Obviously the Dropthing, that you can get the Items still to your twinks if you ask an Friend or buy an second copy, is simply an Workaround which isnât intended too. But what should they do? If they change that, you force your own idea upon other Players and the Developers; due there is no intention to make it for your Twinks that easy. If they limit the Players and you canât share things with your Friends anymore, everyone also would be butthurt. I find it a bad attitude of modern Gamers, to donât respect anymore the Vision and Intentions of Game Developers. People whine and complain how much Maintstream, and wish they could be more Creative and have more Soul, but i ask you how should an Game-Dev can be creative and offer his Games a Soul/Vision, if alot of players complain and force their Ideas on a Game, even if it doesnât fit etc. Thats one of the biggest Issue of modern Gaming. Back than in the Day, Gamers have gotten to an Store, picked up a random Game by the Information on the background or maybe what theyâve gotten out of an Magazine. They hadnât an pre-defined Mindset, âhow an game have to beâ. They bought it and let them surprise by it. And then they decided if i like it or not. Nowday they donât. They are very arrogant, and think they know better to develope an good Game than the actual devs. Everyone believes, only because he Playâs a Game, he know how an Game works and how it should be, which is incorrect. Alone the Fact, that even in Videogames tastes and opinions differs from eacht person to person, there isnât such thing like âhow a game really worksâ. Donât misunderstand me, i donât say in a fair Portion critique/suggestion canât be helpful, and people should shut their traps. I find this important too. However you should let the Game-Dev judge if suggestions fits in ther Game, and which not, and what makes sense, due the fact its their Vision. And not to Force it with cheap Arguments which arenât even correct. And if you ask in this whole Topic(which have gone a bit offtopic sorry) - i atleast favor an Game with weakness, but which stands on its own more, than an Game which havenât that much problems and is nearly perfect, but is overall very Generic.
But anyway, back to my Point. That you canât see, why they made it this way, doesnât mean it doesnât makes sense. Let us not forget, this Genre grew up with an heavy Multiplayer-Focus, and even if GD doesnât have any of the modern ways to approach MP Players and is more Classic in that way; in its core it still makes the most Fun if you play it together with your Friends or other Peoples(as long as they donât except you yourself like to cheat than its an different story anyway). So it makes absolutely sense they allow to drop Materials for your Friends, but not to transfer it to your other Characters(except the Workaround). In GD Multiplayer atleast, it should balance it out by themself. If you play both an freshly started Character, you both gather Ressoruces/Materials anyway and donât have that much to begin with. So it makes sense that you can share it with your Friends to have an fluid Gameflow in Multiplayer. If you both are Highlevels, you should atleast have already enough materials so you donât have to give it to your Friends, but even so its an fair; balanced trade off for an high character; because you get also something out for it due the fact, the Friend gets stronger and you both can play more effective that way. Obviously itâs also possible that one friend playâs with an highcharacter and the other one with an lowbob. However i donâT think that is an very common situation; so this as well balance it out on its own.
However if they would allow, that you can share Mats between your Character, than it would kill the balancing. Its easier to set up your character in early with high gear, and rush easy through the content. I mean hey, i donât care that much anyway, if they change it, because the Devs thinks it fits their Game, than iâm okay with it. But than people shouldnât whine afterwards that this Game doesnât offers anymore that much of longlivety and that the Game is on early too easy(which gets too much complains anyway already). Its so ironic, funny and sad in the same time, that people whine about how modern Games donât offer more that high of value due the missing longlivety, but in the other Hand whishes for things like; Respec(we hear that often about the Masteries), easy and more rare dropps. Heck on Steam-Forum someone even wanted smartloot from Diablo 3. Do you guys know, how much this already killed the longlivety of Diablo 3. No Skilltree for different Builds, and the one Point which offered longlivety, the Gear/Loot is now mostly killed due smartloot, because of that you can get BiS within of Hours⌠Diablo 2 it takes months to get even max-level, none to speak of how much you have to farm/grind for an usefull gear⌠now in Diablo 3 you have everythin within an week. But yeah, you canât stop the casualization of Games anyway; and like i said, i donât care enough anyway. Do what/wish what you want folks, but complain afterwards if it brings an negative point with it.
GD at its core is an SP game, if you like playing in MP, feel free to do so. However that does not mean that there should be any feature that forces us into MP
However if they would allow, that you can share Mats between your Character, than it would kill the balancing.
as you said, they do allow it in MP, which I can use to trade between my chars by jumping through some hoops⌠so either it should not be allowed anywhere, or everywhere
I mean to be fair they support modding, theres even a section here on the official forum for mods. Infact grim dawn defiler and the trainer are stickied posts, on the official forum, and those kill the balance 100% because in 5 minutes I can have a level 85 with full gear with 9999 in every stat and go online with it
facepalm
Have you anything read what iâve written. Again: That you can get Materials with your Twinks due Multiplayer is an simply workaround. THAT ISNâT INTENDED. So no, it doesnât force you, you shouldnât do that in the FIRST PLACE. If you do it anyway, which is against this concept of the Game, than you have to life with the downsides. With an Workaround you even can respec everything, does that mean they should dumb down the concept only because it is possible. With a Workaround you maybe could also enable God-Mode, should they implement God Mode? Good grief get a grip.
And NO - the Difference between MP and SP is - that you shaire a fair trade WITH YOUR FRIENDS - not to push them or to make the whole Game as easy as possible. If you donât have enough Materials in SP you simply can farm the Spots, go back to Menu, and join. Do you know how complicated that gets if you have to do that in Multiplayer. Each time out of the Game, than host it again, people have to join, than you have to farm etc etc (also i get the feeling in MP the Materials drops lesser, so maybe[hopefully some devs could answere that] the droprate of materials is shared)so you would probably spent HOURS for a simply quest where you simply need some Materials. Also you play with YOUR FRIENDS TOGETHER at the same TIME at the same REALM - which means its legit if you share stuff, because YOU BOTH DID something for it. However can you say the same stuff with your TWINKS? NO!
So suma sumarum:
MP - Share with your Friends is Legit. But hey, they could make it like Diablo 3 legendarys, you only can share with friends materials as long they played with you as you obtained it! Better?
SP - Not so, due the fact it kills the balancing of the Game.
I donât even argue that much against it, if Crate think(on their own; not because some Casuals wants it so) they should change that. Okay. However, you guys argued about if it makes sense, and if you are openminded you will see: Yes it does.
No, thats a completly lie made up bei SP Players. Only because Grim Dawn has no Battle net, not such features like Seasons etc, it doesnât make it in its core an SP game. That execuse is plain stupid because it talks down every classic game which had an traditional MP like Grim Dawn have now. Maybe you couldnât call it MP Focused(meanwhile infact the Genre itself IS MP FOCUSED there is no point to argue that), but neither SP Focused as well. AGAIN: if you can share with your Friends materials, its legit because YOU PLAYED together(normaly). You BOTH did something with your Characters which deserves to share it and it balance itself out due the fact you loss something with it and your friend gain from it. But in Singleplayer it does not. You simply transport Materials from one Character where you failry got it with an new Character where you have nothing done for it to deserve it, and kills the overall balancing. If you USE your Friends or Second Account to trade Items to your Twinks, than its your Problem due the fact, its an Workaround and that isnât intended to be. Its only intended that you can SHARE it with your Friends. Period!
God grief, this argument is really dumb(to point out: The argument, i didnât say YOU are). Obviously this is the downside of Modding however, that doesnât mean the Developer shoudl dumb down the whole concept and kills the balancing of the Vanilla-Version. If you build an mod for it, than its your thing, and i donât argue with that. But only because of that, it doesnt mean the Devs should stupidly throw features into the game, which doesnât fit or arenât intended there.
Again Materials are meant to be shared only with your Friends, not to your twinks. If you use that as workaround to get it for you twinks, its your Problem. But doesnât mean the Concept itself doesnât make any sense and they should change that, only because some people get too lazy and casual to farm their goods fairly for their new characters, atleast for such a thing like materials with have an huge impact of the balancing.
/edit: But im done here. You canât discuss in this topic fairly and normal due people ignore what you write.
That you can get Materials with your Twinks due Multiplayer is an simply workaround. THAT ISNâT INTENDED. So no, it doesnât force you, you shouldnât do that in the FIRST PLACE.
I do not care whether it is intended or not, it can be done and can ONLY be done that way, so yes, it does force me to do so if I want to give them to any of my other chars
Also you play with YOUR FRIENDS TOGETHER at the same TIME at the same REALM - which means its legit if you share stuff, because YOU BOTH DID something for it. However can you say the same stuff with your TWINKS? NO!
If I found the materials with one char and want to give them to another then yes, I have done the exact same thing to get them that you did in your exampleâŚ
You might as well mod your game and give yourself unlimited materials and be done with it. Itâs not different from using a multiplayer exploit in singleplayer. You are using external tools that arenât part of the singleplayer campaign, and there is nothing wrong with it, Crate encourages you to play with your friends or to play with mods, go ahead.
But the game is still very much so a singleplayer game and as such, when you make the choice to play the singleplayer campaign, you have to play with its rules and restrictions. And singleplayer was designed in a way that prevents you for sharing important stuff between your own character. Period. You arenât meant to share stuff.
Multiplayer came afterwards, and to accommodate people playing together in a group, they allowed it here. But thatâs multiplayer. Multiplayer is its own campaign, so is Crucible so are mods and so is Singleplayer.
Tl:dr if you canât be bothered to play singleplayer with its rules and restrictions, or you donât like them or donât understand them, you can mod your game or even faster, use a cheat engine.
yeah right, because moving legitimately farmed items between my own chars is somehow the same as hacking as many items as I want so my chars can have them :rolleyes:
Donât get me wrong, I know I can, I just do not think I should have to
Yes, and thatâs the Point which you donât seem to understand or donât want to. Every Game follow it own rules. As example if you play Saints Row 2, which have a lots cheats implemented, also as an Option within Co-op, cheating is an legit thing. However if you would use a trainer, in as example GTA V, than its a whole completly other thing.
So in case of Grim Dawn, its meant to be played for each character purely selfound for materials,only exception to share your goods with friends. So, if you ask me, it doesnât make any difference anymore if you use your MP Workaround or use Tools instead! Both can be labeled as cheating because you donât play it that way, as it is intended too.
Nope. You did not. You didnât played with your twink through the content to get this items, you let it do your other Characters. I donât understand whats so problematic to understand that point. The Intention/Rule behind GD is that each of your characters is based on pure selffound if it comes down to Materials, the only exception is if you play Multiplayer, due the point that you most likely played with you Friends together.
:rolleyes:
Damn Developers, T_T you force me to use an Mod/Tools/Workarounds to cheat; why donât implement it fully in the Game already. I want in Vanilla-basegame an one-win button where i can easily respec everything of my character.
Sorry but your Arguments get worse and worse each time you answer. Simple fact: Crate made this Game, with certain intention&rules. If you want to play it, like it meant to be played, than you have to accept it. If you donât the Game supports modding and you can change the Game to your own rules. Or wait until the Rules change. Parrot!
But than again, why do i care about this topic. Again you donât go into my arguments and ignore the most part of it. Bye!
