I agree with every point of the topic, expecially nn. 1 and 3.
Please fix thermite mies, is probably the worst skill in game. They need to have some reliability, a better area of effect and not to take eons to deploy
My biggest concern about the demo is the amount of skill you need to cast to debuff the ennemies, before using your main damaging skill. At least that’s how I feel about it generally. I also moslty play melee builds if that matters.
Debuff skills :
Flashbang, Thermites Mines which you need to cast 2-3 to cover more area :rolleyes: , and probably BlackWater Cocktail which is a good devotion proc skill… and that’s without another skill you might have to cast from another mastery to debuff the ennemies.
All in all the experience gameplay wise isn’t interesting or fun, especially in campaing mode. I wouldn’t mind to have flashbang becoming a proc ‘‘when hit’’ and thermite mines covering way more area since fire tends to need a lot of resist reduction which force you to cast them anyways. In fact I wouldn’t mind if the Mines became a flamethrower skill. A turrent that turns with at least 2 flame thrower that turn around that turret and reduce the ennemy resist by -x% for x secs… that would be so much more convenient.
In the future all fire builds I will make will probably not go with demo… moslty with Inquisitor, Occultist, Oathkeeper. Unless some changes makes it interesting to be taken.
Again, that’s just my experience with the demo with a few builds I made with it (dualwield, 2h sharzul, callidor’s tempest…)… in campaing mode!
Honestly it easy to see the demolitionist is underpowered, just compare it to the shaman class.
Trickster vs Saboteur -> Arguably the best nightblade class combination vs one of the weaker ones.
Purifier vs Vindicator-> Both are strong but the Vindicator is undeniably better in most cases.
Defiler vs Ritualist -> Worst class combination vs one of the best casters.
Sorcerer/Sorceress vs Druid -> Not a large difference but not an advantage for the Sorcerer/Sorceress.
Conjurer vs Pyromancer -> Strongest to second strongest pet class vs a good ranged auto attack build with a specific set, lackluster otherwise.
Commando vs Warder -> Not a large difference but not an advantage for the Commando.
Elementalist -> Weakest lighting class that has lightning support from both its classes.
Let’s make another list:
Defiler - weakest class in the game
Elementalist - weakest Shaman class
Saboteur - weakest Nightblade class
Commando - weakest Soldier class outside Battlemage
Purifier - one trick pony
Pyromancer - one trick pony and still weakest outside Warlock
Sorcerer - mid-tier Arcanist class
Now, I know the game has been finished for 2 years and it’s too late to rework skill mechanics. And I know it’s Victorian age and not Star Trek. But seriously, its not a bad idea to fix the numbers to make up for that CLUNKINESS! Clunkemolest is last in every race. And if it’s not it’s only because of fluke synergy of two skills (Brimstone in purifiers and Blast Shield in sorcerers).
Shaman was buffed in AoM.
Sorc was god tier caster pre-AoM, but after some nerfs to Demo (yes, Demo was nefred) and the introduction of new good-for-everething classes like Inquisitor and Necro Sorc is no longer competetive.
Conjurer is just too good. Perfecty synegie on all dmg types they share together.
Elementalist - too clunky to use. You need to cast devils, place mines, spam flashbang and charge Savagery.
On the Pyromancer - on paper you’d think this should work really well, as after all there’s some nice potential synergies there with Blackwater Cocktail, Firestrike with Brimstone, Sigil of Consumption with Destruction, Curse of Frailty and the rather important chaos resistant debuff from Thermite Mines. Along with some gear support as well for converting damage types and skill bonuses and plenty of gear that gives skill+ bonuses to both masteries.
And yet, there’s only one Pyromancer build really that shines in AoM, and that’s a Darkblaze Firestrike build.
Add in all the other issues and it’s obvious demo needs some serious work and a good look at certain skills and also some reversals of prior nerfs.
I have to agree with almost everyone here! Tyvm for this thread, Demo is absolutely TERRIBLE compared to other masteries atm. The nades need a little more damage to make them feel like the nukes they are supposed to be. I’d be fine with their clunky throwing animations, if it would actually feel worth to hit them. Combined with the ulzuin’s chosen CDR RNG, Demo is supposed to be a high risk, high reward nuker imo (at least the double nade build). Atm it just feels like high risk, little reward sadly… Then there is stun jacks, which is also terrible atm? It’s supposed to be good as either a castspeed caster or as a supportive skill for electrocute, but afaik its damage numbers are too low aswell. Partly also because it’s much harder to shotgun enemies with that skill compared to say RoH. Then the lack of DA, HP, armor… As people already mentioned DA/Armor should be added to either temper or vindictive flame. Or crate could change up ulzuin’s wrath and give it a temporary DA/Armor buff on proc (would have to change wrath to on any hit instead of melee hit) similar to say fightning form or deadly aim, but defensive. Also increase the mines radius or its RR please! I would probably like increasing its RR more, which would fit my vision of a more skill based high risk high reward mastery where you have to hit stuff and kite enemies into your mines. Blast shield, brimstone and flashbang are the only good/decent skills demo has, but even those are replaceable with similar skills from other masteries which just give you better skills on top. Blast shield is really good now though.
I hope this is not only seen as rant, but also as constructive criticism and I’m looking forward to hopefully some upcoming Demo buffs with FG!
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remember, mines and mortars die like paper in enemy aoe pools and auras. no mines, no mortars, no rr, no support damage.
make conversion and DA good again, or boost OA shred from other sources, (like give some to underutilized skills or as ultimate ranks on other few-point wonders.).
I’m gonna rant about Stun Jacks in particular since many people here point out about Demo’s defense already.
I just came back to GD so this is a fresh feedback.
I just lost my Quick Jacks/Lightning Tether Purifier to the last AoM boss, here is the link to grimtools in order you curious about the char.
Stun Jacks suck, because it has physical damage type that work poorly for late game, most of the physical damage is negligible due to physical damage being absorb by armor and Stun Jacks deal heck of a lot of many projectiles rather than big one hit like Grenado, this is particularly obvious when dealing with high armor enemies later in game.
Another issue with physical damage on Stun Jacks is the fact that there’s zero item to convert this chunk of physical damage, which is huge 330 damage at level 26, they got wasted. There are some few way to turn this physical damage to lightning by Stormcaller’s Pact, some weapons and components but they are too limited to be anything substancial. If you are Purifier then it’s even more limited than Elementalist.
Take a look at SJ modifier on items
https://www.grimtools.com/db/items/8533 A Scepter with no physical conversion…
https://www.grimtools.com/db/items/8583 An Off-Hand so no physical conversion
Too bad you don’t get to choose this is the BiS caster items for QJ?
So if you want extra physical to lightning you must use these
https://www.grimtools.com/db/items/9278 An epic axe… or/and
https://www.grimtools.com/db/items/9448 A shield
Let’s compare SJ with PBlades for the sake of comparison since they are both projectile skill with 3 second cooldown with similar 16/12 skill points.
SJ 330 Physical damage / Average 257.5 Lightning damage. 6 projectiles max (22 Full Spread)
Pblades 330.5 Pierce damage / 245 Vitality damage / 85% weapon damage. 6 projectiles max, can life leech and pierce through
You see SJ is lacking,huge chuck of wasted physical damage, no weapon damage, no life leech, can not pierce.
This is even more prominent when compare Quick Jacks to Frenetic throw, right of the bat QJ required 3 point vs 1 point in Frenetic Throw. QJ -1.5 radius means you have to be face to face to maximize shotgun protential of QJ which leave you vulnerable to got shotgun yourself.
Some options I can think of right now for buffing SJ
-
Reduction physical damage scaling on SJ, add them to lightning damage instead to help SJ in late game
-
Give physical to lightning damage conversion on SJ gears either global or modifier, for example 50% physical to lightning (100% would look be op imo) could be a significant boost to SJ.
Well… You get 15% conversion from Stormcaller and can get 20% from weapon augments. Unfortunately weapons that support those builds don’t have built-in phys to lightning. Mortars have the same problem.
or you could’ve just played a skill (cough forcewave cough) which is fully convertible to lightning. https://www.grimtools.com/db/items/8129
to add insult to injury, that’s a purifier gear piece too.
I had a similar devotion setup on my Barrelsmith attempt except I didn’t need as much mana regen so I went for the on attack heal instead - https://www.grimtools.com/calc/p25DkL0N
It’s weird because itemisation wise, you can get full conversion on both Grenado and Canister Bomb. It’s just Stun Jacks which got overlooked last patch.
It once again show how favored the soldier mastery is. While you have multiple items that convert 100% of the physical damage of force wave and cadence to multiple damage types you still can’t convert large part of the physical damage on most the demolitionist skills.
Only after the last patch could you fully convert the grenado and canister damage. You also still can’t convert the damage of fire strike (neither the physical, lighting or chaos damage can be fully converted to fire) and mortars(the physical damage)
Fixes:
-The Dagallon set should fully convert the physical damage of the mortars to either fire or lightning
-Add item mod(s) to ranged weapon(s) (There is already a melee weapon that converts chaos and physical to fire for firestrike from the FG teasers) that converts the chaos and physical damage to fire.
-The forcewave item mod in the item linked above should be either changed to Stun Jacks or the Stun Jacks conversion mod should be simply added to the item.
Edit: alt fix just remove most of the physical from the skills and change it to either fire or lightning damage where appropriate.
Reasons:
1)The demolitionist has no physical rr so lack goods physical support
2)The oathkeeper also has physical damage support while adding physical -rr, this would be a way to differentiate them more.
3)There already is a item that converts 100% elemental damage to physical and multiple armor piece that have partial conversion, so the reverse is already possible
But I still agree that Thermit mines feel too clunky to use. I have tried it several times and gave up. Takes too much hassle
Also, the off-branch node that has little use besides completing Tempest could give some physical to lightning conversion, and/or pierce to lightning.
I also like the idea of making Vindictive Flame into more a self-sustaining ability.
I wonder if giving it the new Increased Healing stat is possible as well so Demolitionist builds have it passively, though it’s difficult for me to make such a suggestion as I don’t know what other masteries will have access to it or where 
But I still agree that Thermit mines feel too clunky to use. I have tried it several times and gave up. Takes too much hassle
I used these intensively on my first character and on most everything. Spam, spam, spam - with kite.
But near the end I mostly limited use to stationary targets, in spite of the fact that end-game was where the RR was most needed.
Based on my early experience, each of my new builds rarely invested more than 1 point in the mines thereafter. And that is after having learned a large part of the game…
It is clunky. It is functional. But it can definitely be improved.
Yep, thermite mines start strong, but due to demo’s defenses trying to kite endgame will just get you killed.
I think they’re ok on casteresque builds but on melee or high dps ranged builds they really break the flow of combat. They also pale in comparison to Inquisitor’s runes.
In my opinion, mines cater more to tanky auto-attackers. Yes, they are worse than every other resist reduction skill in the game, but with a tanky auto-attacker you can hold your ground while mines burn around you. You have to be very very tanky as a caster to fully utilize those mines, which is very hard with Demolitionist.
Definitely Inquisitor Runes. Haggarrad is just so much better in every way. The enemy hits it once, and it’s got reduced DA for the whole 5 seconds, as opposed to just 2 with a Thermite Mine.
Front-loading the damage and resists would make it benefit casters and mobile players a lot more than tanky melee.