2H melee is in dire need of a granted WPS (this one little trick will give your game 100 more builds...)

I know this sounds like a change out of the scope of this test patch. But 4 mastery -rr% additions cause a major ripple effect that makes your wheels spin in search of builds that open up. And since the 3 changed masteries offer the highest amounts of flat dmg of all, naturally you seek opportunities to make WD based builds. And while there are a lot of new builds indeed, 2H melee once again faces a wall of low WPS pool.

Reaper, of course, is the most notable. A fantasy figure traditionally wearing a 2H weapon, in Grim Dawn is almost always equiped with 2 weapons - too many souls to reap, i guess. If you want to make a 2H melee Reaper, be it cold, vitality or acid, you need to take Beronath Strikes which leaves you with a single multitarget WPS (NE). Of course, no sane person would choose this over DW.

Trickster has a single WPS - can’t make 2H vitality or cold. Conjurer has a chaos conduit that intrigues you to put new Occultist chaos rr% to use - can’t play that with 2H melee either. Can with ranged cause ranged has 4(!) WPS granted by items, but can’t with melee. Cabalist, acid, vit or cold, - same issue, etc., etc.

Lack of 2H melee WPS was one of the biggest issues for me since i joined the game. DW melee and ranged, 2H ranged have enough WPS granted by the items to make a build in most scenarios, often with some unexpected outcomes, like aether Binder gives you one of the strongest DW melee builds and chaos Conjurer - one of the strongest 2H ranged builds.

2H melee is always behind, lack of WPS often prevents you from making builds even with 2H specialized mastery - Shaman. And with new -rr% additions it’s all the more agonizing seeing all the casters and DW melee getting new toys while 2H is forced to sit in the corner and play with a single old wooden toy, Avenger.

There’s a lot of items that can be a target for this WPS addition:

  • There’s a weak pair of blue gloves with a granted WPS, so mirroring this feature in greater effect on a legendary feels right, Maybe on Crimson Claws, a 2H-themed gloves?
  • Maybe Dawnshard Grip, a glove with as% and two mods to casters?
  • Maybe turn the proc into WPS on Sigil of Bear King, severely underused item?
  • Scourge relic has a nice idea but i haven’t seen a functional build with it that made sense.
  • Malediction is pretty much a Meditation double and i never understood its purpose.
  • Avenger relic is another one rarely seen in Cairn with a strange proc, does any retal even pick it?

Anyways. It feels like right now this one small change will open up literally a 100 new build possibilities. I want to swing a big sword around! Prayge

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Once, some patches ago, I requested gun+shield WPS-s. Do you think something changed?
May be it is intended some weapons have less WPS than other… who knows.

Yes please, some additional 2H wps would be very appreciated. Any time i try some 2H build i feel rather disappointed and stats are lacking in a lot of cases, often selling DA and %dmg to reach acceptable OA.
I will try the new fleshwarped shard up coming days and update with results

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dawnbreaker warder

maybe 2-handers need to come with baked in wps.

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If you take a combination of masteries with only 2 WPS, you won’t get many WPS. That’s on you. Zantai already showed what love two-handed weapons are receiving in FoA in Grim Misadventures, with some items giving some WPS more chance to be used. Grim Misadventure #187 - Wights Arise

Look at the public preview of the Berserker mastery. You can make sweet WPS builds with Veilwalker (Necromancer + Berserker) using Onslaught as your auto-attack. You see in the GM that there are items providing 100% conversion, so a 2H cold Onslaught + Avalanche + Necrotic Edge Veilwalker build is a no-brainer for example. I’m not allowed to show you anything but I would say your suggestion is already covered.
Broadly speaking, fun 100% WPS builds I made include 2H ranged acid Paladin, 2H ranged vitality Veilwalker, 2H melee aether Veilwalker.

it is a no-brainer indeed but has the same problems of getting 100% wps pool. and what about… 2h Trickster? Pyromancer (that can have only 1 component wps)? Druid? what should they rely on? cuz Upheaval is extremely unreliable still, mind you.

I agree that %chance to be used for WpS is a very good addition but it doesn’t work everywhere and with everything, and some other solutions are needed.

I feel like Sigil of the Bear King might be one of those. weird ass medal with fw bonuses and those semi-wps/proc thing.

So it’s better to wait for up to 1 year or even more to get a new mastery that would still produce much more DW/ranged builds than to give some item a granted WPS (that will have 0% chance of breaking the game) and have a 100 new builds now?

7 Likes

We will be there when it comes out but this feedback is not about getting wps with a new mastery and new items it’s adding it to existing ones.

I agree with that topic and I have suggested the same many times. It’s weird that 2H aa style is gated behind one set and few 2h wps from masteries. Like giving wps to ALL of the suggested items won’t be even as 10% power creepy as current RR changes.

Oleron’s wps was very clutch, great addition to the game that really helped quite a few builds become better but not a single one of those became overpowered.

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Maybe a quick to make trio of relics similar to the ones allowing DW and raged DW. With some bonuses to all damage and mediocre but high chance 2h WPS?

“And of course +2 to all skills” :slight_smile:

We need a new effect: +25% chance to all WPS. That way if you only have 2 skills, you can still hit 100% or close to it. Item based WPS(Oleron, Seal) should also have higher base chance with a two hander.

I wonder which is more possible to make: increased chance for a type of weapon or two component slots for 2H weapons.

They can just make 2 versions of the components, like they do with augments.

Maybe i’m wrong, but wouldn’t that double the component pool? I doubt Zantai wants to deal with that, neither do our inventories.

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Maybe those could be non droppable. Just transform with the smith

While I agree with the overall idea that 2h melee could use some more WPS options, I’m wondering if adding more % chance to the existing WPS will be possible for base game, or is it only for FoA. Maybe a mixture of both mechanics (some more options + adding % chance to existing ones via items) could benefit build variety a lot.

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Strongly Agree. 2h melee builds are lack of WPS.
Nightblade has 4 WPS for dw, Inquisitor has 3 WPS for range, while Shaman has only one WPS (Upheaval is special and conflicts with other WPS). In granted skills, ranged WPS is the most, dw WPS is the next, shield WPS and 2h melee WPS are the least. I remeber Misadventure showed some shield WPS, but 2h melee WPS is still few.
In addition, dw can use 2 Oleron’s Blood or 2 Seal of the Void, but 2h can only use 1.

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I wish Upheaval would proc regardless of the attack whilest wielding a 2-handed weapon…So basically on all WPS and Stuff like callidors. You could always lower base damage of Upheaval accordingly.

+1 to transform scourge relic active skill into wps

It’s one of the most non used relic in game, maybe wps give to him a new life

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I wish Upheaval was just a regular WPS with the same functionality.

Right now it’s almost unusable.

  • There is a set, Veilkeeper, which is now one of the strongest in the game, that supports Upheaval but Upheaval build with it is very weak, @afanasenkov26 can share his pain.
  • There is a stat-stacked faction craft - Blazerush - that had its 15 mins of glory once, with 6 Tempest prefixes for 30% oa, and now that you can’t do it anymore the Upheaval build with it is just bad, squishy, unreliable, without any redeeming qualities or even a single target edge
  • There is Avenger Upheaval build which is laughably bad compared to WPS oriented and even has worse single target dmg
  • Full Ultos set, again, is stronger with either regular WPS or PS spam, AND is much more reliable

The skill at its core mechanic is super outdated compared to other skills. It relies solely on OA stacking that tripple dips your dps incentivizing an omegaglasscannon gameplay with extremely hard to farm gear.

I wish we had any real conversation on this skill just once. Every time i bring it Up some god armchair gamers Heave a sigh of contempt with “skill issue” energy. In reality there hasn’t been a competitive build with the skill in years, since Savagery passthrough and Ultos arc to Savagery were gone.

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Some quick 2h build attempts

Oppressor with buffed Fleshwarped Shard. Morgo set because i’d hope omen could clear trash, but it doesnt work out that way without much %dmg. Horrible build.

Ritualist with the same weapon. Better than Oppressor but still very very bad.

Acid Oppressor i tried when necro got acid RR. Dont remember much other than it not being good and the save file was instantly deleted.

Cold Defiler. I wanted to try this weapon for once. Looks like an absolute meme (which seems to be the usual case for 2h builds), also plays like one.

2h builds are so much behind everything else i dont even know how to save the archetype. There’s no stats and as mentioned earlier everything needs to be sold off to salvage OA, only to end up with below average damage output anyway.
Avenger before the nerfs had some recipe for success. Ultos has received a lot of steroids but is still stuck in mediocracy to my knowledge.

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