@Crate: It’s been bugging me for quite a long time… There are people who pick two masteries, and there are people who stick with one. It seems like the latter ones are left at serious disadvantage stat-wise if they don’t invest in any secondary mastery. Is it possible to somehow even the score in this department?
The game is entirely designed around the player picking 2 masteries. The solution is to pick a second class and just level up the mastery for the stat points.
What is Crate’s rationale for using such an antiquated system for crit and hit chance? Did they just have no time or resources to change anything about the skill system from TQ?
It seems to me that having OA% specific passives and the fact that one attribute is controlling both crit and hit chance is the real problem here. If you want this problem solved you need base crit chance on skills, crit chance increase as a separate stat, and accuracy checks. You also need to spread out crit chance among the classes -> or make certain classes revolve more around crit and then balance base dmg around this fact.
Never did, it was previously a tooltip bug.
Boss and Hero fights are the only fights that actually matter.
They are also the only fights that we hardly get to see jack shit of our Devotions proccing on due to how ridiculously hard it is to crit them.
Me no like.
No wonder I couldn’t land a crit to proc reckless tempest.
Just ouch! And thats on a lvl 69 blue mob.
So, Spirit is the new Crit?
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are diminishing returns not a thing in this game? how about we revert the rate change, allow crits to start at 85% hit chance again, and implement diminishing returns on crit chance after 100% hit. this way with equal oa/da you’ll now have 90% chance to hit and 5% chance to crit. it’ll still be reasonable to reach 20-25% crit chance and be able to proc on crit effects but it will be harder/impossible to crit +50% of the time (or however you want to balance that).
basically, the diminishing returns would only effect the crit chance. you’d still be able to have your big crit multipliers but characters with only a moderate amount of oa won’t have their crit chance halved.
Can you please add heroes/champion in Kymon/order of death vigil area ?
As stated in the change log: “With the probability to hit formula adjustment, we will do a future pass to adjust OA / DA bonuses in devotions and possibly gear so that builds without skill based bonuses will have a little better access to OA and DA”
So no, I’m not trying to avoid that…
This was a hotfix and we didn’t want it to grow too large / end up like hotfix 4 that went on for over a week and turned into build 30. We’re also at a point in development where we have a bunch of things checked in that can’t go out to the public, so we can’t just do a full database sync for the builds and have to selectively sync each file. That was another reason we had to keep this small and not include lots of skill and item changes.
Further adjustments will occur in B31 that will address this aspect of the OA / DA issue, along with impact on devotion skills. We’ll also re-evaluate our formula changes to make sure they ended up in the right place and make further adjustment if needed.
I think more even access to OA / DA is needed but I also felt like it was getting sort of ridiculous on the high end where even in ultimate, 50%+ of hits could be crits. It put too much focus on OA and crit damage. I feel like high chance to crit would be better around 25-30%.
In general, we’re in the balance phase and it’s likely things are going to be a little chaotic for a couple weeks as we try to figure out the best way to fine tune the game. Sometimes you have to test out both extremes before you can find the good center ground. I don’t know yet where this will land but it wasn’t rolled out as some thoroughly tested, final solution we necessarily expect to stick. We don’t have a big QA team (or any QA team), with my workload, I unfortunately don’t have nearly as much time to playtest the game as many of you and this is EA, so everyone providing feedback on the forum is essentially a tester and we constantly scan the forum, watch streams, tap into the hidden cameras in your house, etc, to try to collect information.
So additional changes will be coming in B31 and we’ll be listening to people’s reactions.
I think it should be obvious we do care since we’ve implemented several changes based on your feedback in the past. Instead of grumbling, make your case for what it should be.
So if you are dropping crit chance are you also going to adjust the chant of crit skills from devotions? Or are they going to be forgotten due to extremely hard conditions for them to activate? Because lets face it, 30% chance on crit with 25% chance to crit scales to a really low chance. And that is providing that a person is able to hit that 25% crit chance.
Yes, on Crit effects will be reviewed for B31.
I experimented with a formula that had diminishing returns but it had the potential to cause wonky things to happen at higher levels and would have required a lot of OA / DA rebalancing on enemies, gear and skills to work properly. it would make OA / DA comparisons relative instead of absolute and may be too big of a change for where we are in development. I may play around with it more in the future. Instead of using the formula, we could code some sort of point at which to set a diminishing return but that would basically just be adding a type of cap and I’m not sure people want more of that. I think caps can be useful and efficient in some cases but I feel like it would be bad for that to get out of hand, where everything is eventually restricted by some sort of coded limit.
I’m sure even the grumblers will appreciate your response medierra. I do. I know there is a lot of negativity on the forum at times but I don’t think those of us who do notice how deeply you care say it enough. Perhaps it seems redundant, but against the storm of endless opinionated complaints perhaps not.
This hotfix was a step in the right direction. It may not feel like it, and it definitely will take more, but I can see it. It’s close medierra. It’s close. From b28 I had no idea how anything was going to scale into ultimate and my fears seemed confirmed on b29. It wasn’t that it couldn’t be balanced but I wasn’t sure how much could be done before feb release. You and your team’s choice to make drastic changes and see how deeply it shakes the meta is truly something to behold as a tester. And now with b30hf1 I can start wrapping my head around the changes needed to make sure each class combo has a place in ultimate.
The good news is the changes needed are now going to get more specific. Pointing out which items don’t compete with similar items. Which skills don’t compete with other skills and so forth.
Hotfix one is a bitter pill for people to swallow. They’d adapted to b29’s narrow Meta and with b30 and b30hf1 viability is becoming more normalized, but this time at the cost of dps on pretty much every build above 100% hit. Hotfix one has nerfed the damage output of viable builds across the board.
This is a good thing because now we can buff areas of the game in a variety of ways and implementations as opposed to just stuffing our faces on all the OA we could horde. Now that we can actually hit our foes we can look at multiple ways to improve damage. Mainly through flat and %dmg, and stacking synergetic procs. Cunning and spirit may still need looking at too. What people don’t yet appreciate is that while this hotfix hurt all of our damage in the short term, it will make the game more interesting long term. (And come on its like a month wait)
I appreciate the frustration of releasing a build in the hope of setting the stage for a healthier diverse meta, only to have it temporarily slow the mid-end game down. We might have to break a few more things, but we are headed toward something great.
If I’m not wrong the lower crit chance also effects all other procs(item procs, devotion procs) that deal damage because they now crit much less often.
I’d be also in favour of the suggestion to nerf crit dmg instead of crit chance, the way it is solved now seems suboptimal imho…
Hi there,
is there anything in the polishing queue regarding Mob AI and pathfinding in general ?
It is still hillarious to see when 10 rangend mobs try to shoot through massive walls instead of taking a few steps to get LoS and be actually able to hit my character.
On the other hand it’s kinda annoying when I try to move my char to a free spot and he refuses to go there cause a single mob is in the straight line to the desired destination. The same goes for doorframes and some edges of the geometry, wich also influence some of the movement skills like Blitz etc.
aside of that, thanks for the fast hotfix and have a nice weekend.
Hi, blademaster!
Crit chance before: ~50%.
Now: ~30%.
Game is unplayable right now except if you are a summoner.
I’ve never had the Bound Spirits spawn for me anyways.
Thanks for the quick hotfix. Got my Act 3 quests back. Have to kill Karroz again, but hopefully after three fruitless SoT run, I can get some new epics or a legendary.
I think it should be obvious we do care since we’ve implemented several changes based on your feedback in the past. Instead of grumbling, make your case for what it should be.
Sometimes you take my jokes too serious. But this was only partly joke. Because sometimes I really cannot understand your decisions.
Well, problems of current solution:
- It makes cunning totally useless for crazy amount of builds. I remind you that most masteries give you around 3 cunning per point. And you make this bonus more useless.
- Collecting OA for non-crit builds becomes non-effective even if you have not 100% hit chance. This trend will continue until very end of the game when you have over +1000% damage. At this stage getting +100 OA can be useful because it gives you around 3.5% to damage which is equal to +35% all damage (97 spirit if your damage is magical).
This force player to run around with non-100% hit chance until the moment when he have very big amount of +%damage and items give very big amount of OA. This is very frustrating especially for skills with cooldown. It’s very dissapointing when your grenado miss. - Early items with OA even more useless than before.
- You made skills with +OA, -OA etc two times weaker. For example, Field Command gives you 8 DA. What? 0.25% less chance to be hitted? One point in mastery bar gives you 43 hp. This is 0.5% of your hp pool when you have 8600 BASE HP (before +%hp bonuses). So again. This passive becomes useless until late game (when 8 OA and DA become attractive)
- Still you leave hole to break your game
So yeah, I liked my suggestion more (surprise?). Because I do not think that making stat useless until ultimate is good approach. And game like Grim Dawn is impossible to balance. That’s why playing such games usually is dancing around caps. Still it’s possible to play with current numbers. Your team have own vision of the game. But damn make starting items with OA comparable to items with +%damage.