GD2 - Crate should stay silent or not?

Grim Dawn General Discussion
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From 8th December 2018 stream:

“And in terms of advertising I think that, unless you throw a lot of money at it, it doesn’t work quite as well as you think. These days advertising is actually a pretty complicated beast. In olden times you’d contact all the big video game sites, pay them for articles, pay them for some advertising and you get the hype you want. These days you’ve got Twitch, you’ve got YouTube, you’ve got all sorts of servers streaming, you’ve got game websites, everyone has their own blog, Reddit, all that stuff is where players hang out. They’re no longer focussed on one thing they’re seeing and it’s not so simple as just throwing money at it and seeing what happens. It’s not like it used to be.”

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Well, don’t let the success of certain few Games mislead yourself and look at this stuff more realistic. 2M even “nowdays” is a pretty high number which can be already considered as high or best selling. Majority of the Games which are considered as that have Numbers from 2M up to 5 or even a bit higher. And don’t forget in case of Grim Dawn we talk about a single Plattform. Even more “Mainstream” Modern Games on more plattforms available can struggle with such numbers. And Games which sells like 10M up to 30M Copies are absolutely rare and mostly across more than one single plattform.

We could now start a argument about “but Diablo 3 & Path of Exile”, but than we have to talk about that both of these Games have different target audiences. PoE is f2p, and D3 is easy accessable(plus Diablo brand). 2M for a Indie-Game, which wants to offer a more traditional experience and compete with such big Monsters, on a single plattform, is absolutely amazing.

Well, and maybe i’m wrong in this aspect, but i thought since the beginning that majority of us People here and Fans of this Game love Grim Dawn exactly for this Reason, to not being overly modern but rather traditional. No Forced Online-Only, no “over the top” MTX, no Seasons and such nonsense, simple classic and traditional ARPG, where you aren’t forced to play at specific times to get exclusive Goodies but rather get the full-experience, everytime you boot t he Game up. Fair and content-rich expansions, a fair priced Endgame DLC, and also a fair priced Skin-Bundle for people who want to support Crate. What you call “aging” is for me a fresh breath of air because in all this modernized standart madness we still get a classic and traditional game. And don’t get me wrong in this regard, i also enjoy more modern ARPGs and some of it’s strenght, but it’s still nice to have a classic oriented game.

Well tbh, besides the obvious Diablo 4, i really can’t wait to dig into Wolcen and especially Last Epoch.
Sure Wolcen have lost a few / lot potential since they scrapped some features, but after playing beta and see how they finally make some progress, it feels pretty solid. And Last Epoch did surprise me after seeing how much progress they did in a single year. I hated the alpha demo, still kept an eye on, but the Beta so far was a blast.

If it really will compete against GD, D3 and such we’ll see, but i’m pretty optimistic that further down the road i will kinda talk about my top 5 instead of my top 3 ARPGs (GD, D3, TL2) once they are released. (And as side note, why i didn’t put D1/2 into the list, i kinda prefer to have only one Game from a series in my favorite list, so other Games have a chance too).

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Sounds like something those investors would have said to Medierra before he turned their offers down :wink:

Given the fact that Crate doesn’t have Tencent money like GGG or Activision money like Blizzard, they are doing quite well don’t you think?

It’s like Biggie Smalls once said, “Mo Money Mo Problems”.

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Forced games aren’t good

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POE started as a indie company and thrive to become a very big game. Grim dawn haven’t become that because it didnt attract that much people and wasnt fF2P. POE is older than Grim dawn and we will have to wait at least a few years before Grim dawn become dominant like POE or not.

There is a GDC talk about POE and you guys should look how hard it was for them just to keep players playing even with new content.

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I don’t want this game to be compared to other games because this game is unique. I believe Zantai has a planned update in the future which requires time to implement that plan. I personally like the constellation system. Although I don’t really like dungeons that are currently available But I dare to say that I love this game and still waiting for updates, including the next DLC. [sorry for language because I use google translate from Thai to Eng]

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I would like to believe that a major announcement will be made by beginning of next year, whatever it may be, we can only hope its gd related

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Crate has had this success thus far cause:

  1. They made a phenomenal game, backed up by players in kickstarter (more than expected ) and excellent continued development and support of the game

  2. Strong Business acumen.

You can bet Medierra knows exactly what it takes to overreach and mess up a good project. Getting over excited about the success of a project is the perfect way to mess things up. They prefer consistency over grand gestures imo and that is what players want from a dev as well

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I read somewhere that PoE2 isn’t a new game, it’s just a big update. Your account, characters, items, and micro-transactions aren’t going anywhere. There isn’t a separate game client. It’s an absolutely huge update, but it isn’t a new game

D4 is a new game yes but i dont think GD2 is coming on board for now or for the next 4-5 years. I know it will hurt me after the GD support gets cut but what can you do?
On the other side i know Crate peepos want to move on different projects which im all for it and they should stick on their goals
You never know tho! December is coming :]

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Sequels in this “game as a service” era are getting kind of confusing, or they are just expansion packs with different names.

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It won’t be.

PoE2 and PoE1 are two separate campaigns with different sets of characters, however there’s a lot of overlap. For one thing, you meet up in the same endgame and players of PoE2 can play with those of PoE1. Ascendancy classes unlocked in PoE1 can be used in PoE2, and vice versa. The passive tree will also be identical.

Basically it boils down to a means for GGG to run with new graphics and world design/monster design without needing to redo everything that presently exists.

It won’t. You select which campaign you play on a menu in one PoE client.

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Correct.

Why not? PoE is what, ~20GB right now? That’s a third to a fifth of most triple-A game sizes these days, and likewise a third to a fifth of what I expect D4 will be.

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Imagine making the mistake of playing PoE through Steam. :laughing:

NGL this seems both cheap to me and comparable to HDDs in stores:
image

Biggest here is the new CoD, clocking in at a delightful 175GB.

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I could get a lot more time out of Grim Dawn. I expect to get like 10 years out of a good ARPG. I don’t see any reason to release or announce a GD 2 just because D4 got announced. GD was after D3 and it offers way more longevity in my opinion. D4 is online only, TL:F is online only and I’m not going to pay 60 dollars for an online only experience. If TL:F sells for 20 dollars, I’ll give it a spin… even though the item system is not that great I really like the aesthetics and other things about the series. I am looking forward to Last Epoch. If GD2 releases like six years from now I wouldn’t really complain and would certainly buy.

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Well, it definitely will raise in the future. I mean i have already Games which take up space ranging from 100 to 125 > 150 and even ~170gb. That will be even more common once more Games have native 4K Support and stuff.

So i kinda have to agree with Ceno, 40gb doesn’t shock these days anymore, and i hardly know anyone who have less then 500gb or even 1tb Hard Drive… heck even the ones which i know go with a main SSD have a second HDD for that exact reason. I mean remember the days where 20gb Games were schocking because Games took up normally 500mb’s up to a few gb…

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If this were the case then gaming companies couldn’t innovate. There’s always a trade off as progress made. 30 years ago games were on a floppy disk until they needed larger space. Then people for cd rom games. Then eventually hdd. Now sdd. Innovation will require changes.

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True that. And before that we had to load games from audio cassette tapes using a cassette player and each game would occupy 1-4 tapes and loading took 5-10 min. And sometimes you would get the cursed TAPE LOADING ERROR… message at the end and had to reload the whole thing, haha! Good old Sinclair ZX Spectrum - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0EfycbDhiw

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Playing Castle Wolfenstein on my friends Apple IIe with a cassette drive. Oh hell yeah, them were the days.

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And before that, we had no storage media … which isn’t quite true … storage media consisted of magazine articles with the program code strings printed therein, which we then had to enter manually on our electronic “computing” device. If you had access to a mainframe with a keypunch and punch card reader, you could create and store the program in a series of punch cards … and woe be you if you got even one card out of sequence. /shakes fist at random cloud … “and stay off of my lawn! Punks.”

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I get that all this is sort of related, but if you want to talk in depth about D4 and PoE we have threads for those.