You get that 14 when you assume that cadence weapon damage % has already multiplied the flat pierce. Which is not what happens of course, at least not in that order 
14 flat pierce x 500% weapon dmg = 70 pierce dmg
Flat dmg added to cadence dont get multiplied with % weapon dmg so adding 70 pierce to cadence is somewhat equal to adding 14 flat pierce to your build. Only difference is that actual flat pierce will be used for non cadence hits also and flat pierce added to cadence will be used only for cadence hits.
Only if its totally changed with recent update and I doubt it is 
That’s not how it works. Item skills modifiers don’t take into account weapon damage when adding flat values to skills. Mythical Reaver Claw literally adds flat 70 pierce to a level 1 Cadence and only goes up from there. Cadence has base 24 physical and Mythical Reaver Claw adds a base 70 base flat pierce.
Please read again what I wrote.
On 26 lvl cadence gives 312 flat phys dmg so with 2 mythical rawer claws it will be 312 flat phys and 140 flat pierce and 500% weapon dmg.
Assuming that your base weapon dmg is 0 (for the sake of arguments) you will do 312 phys and 140 pierce dmg with cadence.
Assuming your weapon dmg is 28 (those mysterious 14 flat multiplied by 2 :p) but your weapon is not adding flat pierce to cadence you will do 312 and 28x500% weapon dmg = 312 + 140.
Im definitely staying with the thing I wrote about math
Except you said 70 flat pierce is the same as 14 flat pierce, which is not. Then you said this:
14 flat pierce x 500% weapon dmg = 70 pierce dmg
It has nothing to do with math. This is just flat out wrong.
Ok, Im really sorry I didnt want to upset you, but I was thinking that you will be able to conclude that I was thinking on 70 flat dmg added to cadence from mythical R claw, and actual flat pierce added to build, like I explained earlier, my bad.
Work on your math.
I hope it’s not going to be a nerf to Shamans and two-handers because they finally feel powerful and in the right place.
As people already said, Valdun is definitely getting the nerf. That thing is ridiculous with it’s pierce damage.
However, I built my DW Pierce Tactician around Warborn. It’s still strong as fuck. A pity about DW Gun Valdun, though.
Cabalist will receive some nerfs too, I think. The most broken pet build currently on the market.
ITT: Nerf all the new skills and items until everything takes an hour to kill a nemesis. Everyone here’s talking about how some set items are so strong but I doubt how many people will be lucky enough to actually collect the said set items and if they are nerfed to the ground, then the incentive of hunting these items will only diminish to the point where there will be no powerful items/skills, only a varieties of similar damaging different animation skills/items. Not sure why people are so obsessed with nerfing in a single player games, especially for builds that rely heavily on super rare items.
Remember guys, GD sold more than a million copies and solely listening to handful of “hardcore” mass might indirectly harm the silent majority of casual players.
I… pretty much agree with that sentiment.
Then again, as much as I hate the nerf hammer, 2 points:
1.) I vaguely remember Zantai saying something mysterious about “backend” game changes or something during a stream he had to take over. Makes me wonder if GD will get something like an on line storage implementation of some kind (ladder season, multiplay between game versions, ?), in which case, decent nerfing will be a requirement.
2.) It does keep the game from getting overly stale for people to come back to. Changes up the meta.
No amount of nerf will ever truly establish the balanced meta-less atmosphere. There will always be a single build which will fractionally have better DPS and the meta-whores (no offense to anyone) will blindly follow it. If people are willing to ignore the most fun aspect of the game (finding items and building your own builds from scratch) and instead follow others’ footsteps blindly, they deserve to face the consequence, which in this case, the game becoming stale for them.
If your #1 point is true, then while I can understand it but it will simply make GD no longer GD. It will just become another online game with all “balanced” builds and artificial ladder competition. I am afraid at that point, at least I will be leaving GD for good. So, at least for my own sake, I do hope no dedicated ladder or leader-board will ever get implemented.
The backend changes are the new renderer that is now out.
We are not planning any sort of always online components. The game is primarily singleplayer.
A closed multiplayer setup would require fundamental changes to the game engine, not to mention server costs, customer service, upkeep, etc.
It’s a monumental task, and one that would have had to happen early on, not when the game is years old.
That was a relief to hear. Just my personal request, please don’t make all builds/items/skills have same level of “power”. One of the most attractive part of a great ARPG is to farm hard-to-find just-the-right items to make a total broken build. Just having another “balanced” build with all hard works of farming, simply makes the whole item hunting tediously mundane.
You’ll be happy to know then that Zantai has always maintained that builds having the same “balance” power-wise has never been a goal. Nerfing something that is ridiculously overpowered is fair game tho imo.
I can never buy into some peoples ethos that “single-player games” shouldn’t receive nerfs. Bullshit. (not claiming this is your stance by-the-by, just saying ;))
I am perfectly content with necessary nerfs for truly broken builds but it seems people in the thread started arguing over why XYZ item is OP despite being the compare being made in a perfect environment having the rarest gears with best rolls. I am satisfied as long as gear dependent builds are practically more powerful than those that relies mostly on less-rare equipment. I believe an item or a skill should be judged based on an average scenario and not based on the ideal optimal one which is next to impossible to achieve, in a legit way with casual playtime.
Pretty good but not quite on the level of the dw one.
I suggested Valdun’s 3/4 bonus to be moved to the rifle rather than being open to any weapon type. It also wouldn’t hurt to take down the % Attack Speed granted by Reaver’s Claws, as it seemed all too easy to surpass 190% AS on the build.
The issue with the Pierce Tactician is much less that of skill choices as it is itemization. That said, there could still be things to tune in Inquisitor. Haven’t really pushed it to its maximum overcaps yet.
If you are comparing amount of flat pierce dmg stacked is far above DW one, and that was the point of that post, but if you are comparing in game performances ofc is not on the level of melee DW its 2H ranged
On other hand if melee DW cadence pierce tactician is on the nerf list already am staying on my previous statement that Zantais nerf hammer will be really busy.
Maybe Im wrong, since I didnt tested it but comparing DW melee pierce tactician with mediocre rr and no dot dmg with this or this I dont see the scenario where pierce tactitian wins in dmg output.
I think you misunderstood me a little. I make no claims about a perfectly balanced game being a pro, just that a game of this nature getting the occasional update in regards to how things work does keep it from getting stale. Everyone’s endurance for a recreation varies a little after you’ve clicked the same things over and over again. For me, after 600 hours of playtime I really appreciate popping in to see what’s new or different when it comes to making the monsters drop loot.
Glad to hear there’s no intention of focusing this game to multiplay.
Loving the new engine btw, Zantai. Very smooth on my machine.
It makes me just a tad salty that these guys hack in these items (BiS mind you), then the devs are on it immediately. Now i get WHY that is healthy, but even as stated by the dev in this very thread, this is a primarily single player game, let the people who want to ruin their fun by playing incredible “ez-mode” builds do exactly that. Even if just for a while. :rolleyes: