V1.1.9.8 Discussion

I’ll look into it, you got me interested. If you say it has no AoE then I’ll try the Chaos WoP conduit with all (or all except the 1st) nodes maxed for AoE. As you say, the build will need to be tanky enough to stand in the Seal. I actually really like this skill and not very mobile builds in general in contrast to other players so I’ll try to make it work.

On the topic of what a set is supposed to support or not - this is not true. Chillwhisper is very good for Infiltrator and there’s is no Pierce → Cold because you can get 100% easily with 1 Spectral Blade, the gloves and the rings. You can respond - I don’t want to be forced to wear these. You’re not, you just lose the conversion - that’s called a compromise. And I think other players are fine with that - and i.e. build more towards Frostborn damage from what I’ve seen. I could agree Chillwhisper might not be optimal for Apostate but this is because of the nature of Drain Essence which is a channeling skill and doesn’t intertwine well with a short cooldown spell like Rune of Hagarrad. And needs to cast Ill Omen too. I haven’t played this variant though so take it with a grain of salt.

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it’s pretty simple, if a set has support for 3 masteries, even if the original intention is to only support 2 of their class combos, it will still end up supporting 3 classes regardless
the question isn’t even whether or not it supports (nor if it was the intention), but if the support is big enough to make the 3rd combo work as well as the first or second, and in some cases, like Avenger it works splendidly (and works even better if not going the greedy wps approach like me)

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Also saying Chillwhisper is made only for Reaper is odd when that set made Infiltrator completely busted, to the point both Hag and Blade Spirit ate a bunch of nerfs.

Don’t know how the situation with Infiltrator and Chillwhisper is at the moment, but i highly doubt it’s in such dire straits that it’s somehow overshadowed by Reaper on that set.

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If built tanky it’s one of my best builds in SR 75-76 (although I prefer a similar custom one which is even sturdier). Can Shadow Strike into a group of 10 heroes and won’t go down. Moosi, Grava, Fabius, Reaper, Alex, Iron Maiden… - all can be facetanked w/o issues. Here’s some gameplay Chillwhisper Infi SR (I died at end against Mad Queen - I miscalculated or had too little Acid overcap - 16). Ravager is not a problem but seems to be missing ~10% Phys res to be able to take Callagdra. Reaper is a better choice for her.

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projectile attack spam while her red aura is up, i doubt 15 more acid res would have saved you there :sweat_smile:

Dunno, my other similar build can take her Adv Moosi MadQueen Grava - YouTube but it is sturdier. Maybe a variant with Ghoul would be better here which helped me against Rashalga in other builds. Cannot say for sure because Mad Queen is pretty rare in SR, I meet her once at best throughout my tests usually.

I wanted to suggest this for a very long time but always somehow forgot. I know skill changes are off limits but I was thinking at Breath of Belgothian. Can it be turned from a 1 pointer to a 3/3 giving 20-40-60 hp regen and also the same amount of energy regen? Reason behind this suggestion is encouraging dw casters since most of them rely on an offhand for energy regen, or at the very least increase the health regen as it is and also add energy regen. Cheers!

I am all for tri-elemental builds buffs to defensive options, especially in its devotions. The top tri-elemental builds are too glass cannon and have very little options for defensive devotions since they feel forced to heavily invest in purple and green devotions to get Seru and Sage. Their damage is also not that great to make up for it, so it always feels bad playing tri-elemental instead of focusing on fire, lightning or cold. Seru feels pretty bad and is a pretty hipster t3 devotion. Maybe give it some phys res instead of the DA?

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I believe the main problem is that tri-elemental build loses a RR source compared to single-element ones (as they cant get Widow, Murmur and Solael’s Witchblade without sacrificing too much). And their itemization is pretty limited too, as any single-element build can use both its own element and tri-elemental gear, but tri-element build has to use tri-elemental gear only.
And Seru/Blind Sage arent so good because the only thing their procs offer is damage. They dont have sweet RR like Ultos, or damage reduction like Light of Empyreon, or OA reduction/miss like Arazkaa, or life leech res reduction like Rattosh. It’s just plain boring damage we have everywhere, and it isnt that high even.
I’d rather like to “sweeten” Seru and Blind Sage proc with some extra, like OA/DA reduction, fumble/impaired aim, resist reduction, etc.

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so can we get some passthruu for ranged RF builds

HoS is also an absolute waste of stats on the set and the supposed playstyle. It doesn’t support cold. It’s extremely hard to plug weapon damage into Drain Essence, and the set actively converts away from vitality, while mutated DE converts from aether. And the skill bonuses to it are also bordering on non-existant. So AoC ultimately comes out on top, even if it’s also hard garbage.

I fundamentally disagree with the premise that interrupting DE to cast RoH “doesn’t intertwine”. I’m currently finishing my run on Clairvoyant Spellbinder. The core of the set is the support for AAR and 2 short CD nukes - Doom bolt for Warlock and Reap spirit for Spellbinder. To both the set even offers a chance of 100% CD reduction - so yes, there absolutely are channeling builds that interrupt the channel for the nuking. And it’s quite fun to soul punch the shit out of mobs from time to time. Surely RoH isn’t any more obtrusive that RS. And DE is even better suited to interruptions, as it sports way bigger DoT than AAR.

As for the whole idea of “using Chillwhisper on the wrong class”, I’d like to make an argument here.

Let’s look at the sets available to Reaper.

Chillwhisper, naturally. It’s clearly visible what the set offers to the class combo.

Morgoneth. A set that I absolutely love on Reaper, focused on SS. A set that is also widely run on Spellbreakers. There are also variants with it on Archons, Witch hunters and Ritualists. Seems like the set can be run on more than one class perfectly fine, even when drifting away from SS focus.

Deathguard. I have no clue about this set, I haven’t played it. Seems tailor-made for Reaper with its skill support. However, I see it also used on Dervish just skimming through the grimtools.

There may probably be more set-based builds for Reaper, but I’m going to stop at reaching 3. Because now we will look at sets available to Apostate.

Bonemonger. Set so omnipresent it absolutely dominates Apostate and Opressor builds. I’ve even seen it used on Paladins, and personally used it on gunsilnger Purifier at some point.

Radaggan. Widely run on Decievers as well, which I’m considering at the moment. So clearly there’s more than 1 class to play this set on. It’s also worth noting that Inquisitor offers absolutely 0 native support to vitality or acid. Way less than what Necro and Inquisitor offer for cold. Yet the set makes it work.

And that’s it. There’s no obvious third set to run on Apostate. Maybe there is something less obvious, but Chillwhisper is absolute garbage here. Unlike Ragaddan which brings the same class together for a rather unorthodox damage combo. Unlike Reaper, which enjoys 3 obvious sets supporting it, all fine and dandy.

So what else Chillwhisper supports? Infiltrator? Does it though? Does Infiltator benefit that much from amazing modifiers to RoH on the set, especially the energy cost reduction? Does it somehow benefit from amazing aether to cold conversion on chest? Maybe from the 2-set resist bonus? No, it doesn’t. For Infiltrator it’s almost purely a Blade spirit set.

So, the bottomline, is that Chillwhisper is just a shit set for a shit class. It has absolute junk for stats - you can just remove several lines from it tomorrow, and nobody who plays it will even notice. Unlike sets like Morgoneth or Bonemonger, it barely supports one class, and for Apostate it’s WAAAAAY worse than Radaggan, which deals with equally problematic damage combo way better.

And, honestly, I half-hoped that somebody more competent than me would come up in this topic and give their perspective on actually playing the set on Apostate. Guess nobody plays it after all. Maybe I should just cheat it up to 100 to see if it’s as miserable as it looks on practice.

Some time ago I tried Wyrez’ Chillwhisper DE Reaper. Tweaked it for max dmg. Kicks ass as I´ve never seen before in a channelling character. SR80, no problem. Better single target dmg than any AAR or EoR build, and I´ve tried them all.
Just saying - it’s not shit at all.

I’m specifically referring to Apostate here. There are many sets that support 3 classes in a playable fashion, and Chillwhisper isn’t one of them.

My “testing” through crucible so far also showcases energy balance somewhere between “unsustainable” and “gods why” territory.

well it certainly intertwines worse in comparison. People always prefer fewer skills when having a channeling filler in comparison to other types of filler. But don’t mind me, I didn’t say it’s unplayable

I haven’t played it but since both Cold Chillwhisper DE Reaper and Hagarrad Infiltrator are totally playable (for me personally they’re good) it’s hard to think a combination of both of these (each a bit weaker perhaps than in these standalone builds) would be bad. Especially if interrupting DE with Hagarrad is not that bad.

Also - the Grim Dawn community of builders is not that big and some builds might not have good guides / videos on them. Doesn’t mean it’s instantly trash.

Btw I’m not saying to not buff it if other players feel like it needs some.

Again, it mostly comes down to horrible, horrible, HORRIBLE stat budget. Reaper and Apostate on otherwise copypasted build will see a difference of about 400-500 OA and 300 DA. Then you start chasing casting speed.

I’m just off my crucible attempt with the build above. Which probably is suboptimal, but I utterly failed to find better gear in the database to improve it.

It got oneshot on sigil at wave 98, without blessings. The health swings wildly all the time.

The energy management, even with Royal jelly extract, is completely miserable. It hinges entirely on Viper energy leech, which is a terrible hullmark on its own.

The damage is mediocre. It’s entirely reliant on RoH DA shred, and that, in turn, runs into all the traditional problems of rune placement.

Overall, it’s miserable to play. Visually cool, and quite smooth compared to some of the garbage I’ve run. The AOE is decent. But with the lack of damage, survivability, and lack of any ability to patch them - it’s terrible. Even stats for gear turned out to be a struggle.

If I actually had any theorycrafting credentials and experience, I’d assume the reason both Reaper and Infiltrator variant are viable (other than stat distribution) is due to Blade spirits, which are entirely passive and get more buffs from it than the damn DE does. Unlike the joke that RoH support is on this set.

Seriously, please make Chillwhisper Apostate a thing. It has potential to be cool, the core gameplay is nice, and the argument “oh the set isn’t just made for it” is so fucking dumb in a world where Bonemonger exists.

Gonna have to agree with @lMarcusl here. It’s a SR 65 farmer meme build. At this level WoP somewhat works (I took Chaos Inquisitor Seal conduit for the colors and RR though since there are quite a lot of single Element conversions in the setup already in various items) but in SR 75 it’s painful indeed and its flaws start to show. Meh against Ravager even with all these heals, ADCTH, absorption, DR. I think you’d need to give it Chaos Hagarrad or Kalastor support to make it better.

Deceiver, Level 100 (GD 1.1.9.7) - Grim Dawn Build Calculator (“crafted” for Stun res :stuck_out_tongue: )

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I don’t know much outside some of the warlord stuff, but I think that it would be nice to give Targo’s Craft set a bit more bulk. Or atlrast some HP, like many of the chest armor has.
As I understand Targo is not being used very much, so I might be onto something there. But I don’t really know the legit reasons why that is, can’t really compare it to anything… But I can tell that it could use atleast some +HP stats at the very least, especially after the Military Conditioning nerf… But even before the HP wasn’t great.
I’m sure others here could say more about the set, this is just my bit of an experience with the set (Judgement IT build). But I gather that other soldier IT sets “perform” better.

Try this Chillwhisper Apostate. If you don’t like DA:

  • has ~330 OA shred

  • maybe one can move some points from Spirit to Physique for more Health and DA without ruining Energy regen

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Targo isnt used as a full set, true, but 1-2 pieces of the set fit into some strong builds, like physical Battlemage.

It has literally been the best set in the game for the past two years. Just check top 20 SC build list and you’ll see both Archon and Wardur in it. Also it has been one of the most popular and better HC builds for a good reason.

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