Why not, though? I’m of the opinion that more items can use the Blazerush treatment and get tons of bonuses that maximize all of its combined bonuses. Some may disagree, but that’s the point of raising the idea in the forums.
For comparison, I created a Voidsoul Deceiver to see how it compares with the SR set Apostate.
The Deceiver undoubtedly does a ton more damage, but a single stun and I’m done for. Channeling builds require CC resistances to be maxed out, which was why I went for the SR set for the Apostate in the first place. I can probably fiddle with the Deceiver to maximize Stun resistance, since the damage and leech are obviously there, but that would be outside the scope of this thread.
i don’t understand this, what are you giving up?
voidsoul blocks nothing there even if we just pick vampiris for Foi, on deciever or apostate
i mean, you can already do that
the issue isn’t the foi mod, or even the reap spirit mod, as Mergos already said chaos reap spirit works, if ex you go defiler; Reap spirit is merely such a dedication you either can’t really do it as a throwaway implementation; or if you do then you gotta full focus foi, ie not use SR set for chaos/vit foi
which i tihnk is a “mistake” no matter how you look at it
either you focus Foi with either split chaos vit, on voidsoul, or you convert as much chaos to vit as you can; still with voidsoul, because Foi has to be the main focus in either case. And chaos reap spirit “on foi inclusion of vampiris” can’t be the main focus or focused dedication but more “you take what you can get”, ie no reap spirit offhand, at most maybe you use reap spirit gloves(which might be questionable too here)
and in both cases, you pick a better suiting devo route
i should probably also once again mention my stance/perspective of “just because an item gives XY modifiers does not mean the items intends for you to make a build using both mods at the same time”, while it totally can be done, and in some cases even is obviously directly intended, it doesn’t always have to be the case. And if we look at vampiris in individual application, the mods are fine (imo)
For a comparison, you could test something like This
for a full Foi/RS focused on Vampirris.
With 4 MI and 1 conduit you can get whatever you want for extras. And it gets RS more frequently than DB, while approximating the same relative devotion path and main skills.
ofc, RS is not a nice AoE like DB but the skills are different.
Well that stands in direct contrast to my argument that more faction items need the Blazerush treatment where the modifiers get supercharged in order for the class to truly shine. Apostate has terrible build diversity as it is, so I don’t know why people are so vehement for the status quo when there are numerous ways to give the class a better standing.
In response to hammyhamster, I’ll give your proposed setup a try and see how it stands with the multiple greens and different equipment set-ups. I immediately see an issue with Energy regeneration (FoI is a hungry little bugger), but it’s worth checking out different configurations to see which one is superior.
chaos is however also not really the class’ native pairing
basically 0 support in Necro means that’s probably not what you “really” want, and inquis has tertiary chaos support “at best”, ie chaos apostate, is probably not the aim nor the apostate combo most deserving of consideration for that class boost, so vampiris isn’t really the indicator for that class buff being necessary
which means the blazerush comparison isn’t really apt or “1to1” if you will
Um, the weapon is a Chaos weapon and gives Necro and Inquisitor modifiers, of course I’m going to try a Chaos Apostate with it. The fact that there’s little support means that the support it does have should be buffed to make up for the lack of support elsewhere.
I tried hammy’s set-up (appreciate the suggestions, it is better than the SR set version I was using) with the 2 double rare greens + 3rd MI, ran it through Crucible, and failed 10 out of 10 times. In case that’s not indicative of the build’s performance (due to my playstyle, haven’t been in the loop for a while, etc), I checked other Voidsoul and other Chaos FoI builds to see what they used.
Banana_Peel’s Voidsoul Deceiver: Actually uses Vampirris, stacks up Chaos damage to take advantage of the 22% Weapon Damage modifier. Vitality Decay modifier may as well not even be there, and wouldn’t be affected by buffs to the Necro side.
Bagel’s Voidsoul Apostate: Focuses on Vitality FoI and uses Decree of Malmouth, which I already said should be used if you’re going the Vitality FoI route.
Purlpo’s Voidsoul Deceiver: Similar to Banana_Peel, focuses on stacking Weapon Damage and Chaos damage. Does not attempt to figure in Vitality or Vitality Decay at all.
So no builds try to incorporate the Vitality Decay modifier to FoI, even the ones that use Vampirris in Voidsoul, and no Necromancers try to use Vampirris to play Chaos Reap Spirit (I know there’s a discussion about Clairvoyant buffing Aether Reap Spirit, and all those problems are magnified ten fold when going Chaos Reap Spirit). Seems like enough reason to buff the Necro side of the weapon to me.
maybe because flat dmg, on a channelled skill is just better? doesn’t mean you can’t incorporate it
mergos already said he did chaos reap spirit defiler
not really (imo), it means when making an ultra meme you need/should get more creative; or just focus on fewer aspects of the modifiers
again, blazerush was a completely different scenario, vampiris has already been proven to work “as is”, you’re just wanting to use it in the least optimal way, which might then be asking a bit much, vs blazerush that straight up didn’t work at all at the time
chaos foi works with vampiris
chaos reap spirit works with vampiris
whether or not we can make a split chaos/vit foi work with reap spirit remains to be seen, but suppose that would be the next challenge/if the decay mod can be utilized in some fashion
but it’s not a blazerush scenario “since it’s actually working” already
edit, done did a doodle attempt at split dmg Apostate, Level 100 (GD 1.1.9.8) - Grim Dawn Build Calculator, besides the actual bonus dmg being low (lots of slots occupied by chaos dmg/not vit buff comp), general stats doesn’t look terribad, tho would need to craft 3x slow resist bonuses probably for optimal stuff
If anything imo the biggest issue I have with voidsoul is if u want to make it deal actual good dmg you end up with rly bad energy regen & even the wooping 72% reduced FoI cost on this wont safe it from having said energy issues.
If I would go outa the way & grab ectoplasm the DA, extremly needed stun res & already low’ish hp would suffer even more.
Furthermore for a heavy armor set voidsoul doesnt end up with a respectable amount of armor at all.
When we have a look at another heavy caster set like light’s defender for example there we have some nice armor bonuses & even added % absorb!
Again, imo Vampirris is fine as is even tho I can see why Maya would want pet bonuses on it.
My suggestion would be to beef up void soul into a proper heavy caster set with better armor bonuses, more energy regen & maybe even add some % cdr to the shield cuz not having any cdr % at all often feels horrible for devo & skill consistency.
why tho?
the modifiers doesn’t apply to pets, so it would be sorta meaningless to add pet bonuses, unless the aim is some weird chaos hybrid pet build?
Simply for the sake of build variety.
Adding bonuses for chaos pet reap spirits wouldn’t hurt the FoI & raw RS dmg part of it at all and would open up more stuff for pets.
“how” tho, is my question, since the modifiers doesn’t apply to pets/wraiths, it would just be a chaos stick with some pet bonuses
why would a pet build pick that over an actual pet stick “with solid pet build modifiers”
+10% speed and 50% all pet dmg etc “generic” pet stats, aint gonna be great for a pet oriented build, when it’s competing on a modifier slot
I don’t know what kind of ideas @Maya has in mind for chaos wraiths or chaos pets here.
I just don’t see why it shouldn’t get something like “cold/vit pet dmg converted to chaos” with some pet bonuses like flat dmg, % dmg, speed, res, oa/da or whatever to name some possibilities.
Imo, again, the more build options/variety the better.
I feel that this is likely a flaw in the channeling skill FoI. If you think about it, DoT on a skill that ticks multiple times per second and wants cast/attack speed is not ideal. I suppose it’s lucky that some “channeling” skills like EoR rarely have dot.
It doesn’t matter how fast you cast, you can only get a better crit, but essentially there is no difference for the dot if casted once or frequently, with enough duration increase. Dots tick 1/s. The only advantage is that you can estimate the dot and move onto another target quicker…but in practice…less than a second more focus will do it. Even with the limited cone, the start-stop delay makes it tricky to quickly dot a pack.
So…the skill is not about to change at this late time. It already has a transmuter with damage type mods. More AoE could have been nice on a transmuter focused more of DoT.
I have tried to think up a build that did focus on FoI dots only, but it went nowhere for the few damage types I tried. Too much investment for too little. Yet the community never ceases to surprise, so … who knows.
It opens up new build possibilities since atm elemental > chaos options are limited to a few off-hands for pets and felt like a harmless request in the grand scheme of things.
Which basically means that if it doesn’t have RR, significant elemental->chaos for pets, or any stats that outperforms the following
Already existing:
Dracarris
Scourge or Black Hand = with pet
Witching
Covenant,Fiendblood which never get used (covenant maybe in rare case of full set…)
Offhands
…then it will be a waste of time putting pet stats on it…as it will never get used. And if it does have better stats…then the others will drop off the map.
Imho it’d be better in that case to simply add better player stats.
Dracarris never gets used other than in meme builds due to the player requiring to get kills.
Scourge / Black Hand does not have conversion and Scourge has same issue as Draacarris.
Witching hour is 2handed
Covenant is good, but is full set.
RR is not necessary, but yes it will need like 100% Ele > chaos.
I can make you atleast 3 different builds with it if it had Ele > Chaos conversion
There aren’t any competing items though. Like, you are not going to use Witching Hour for Chaos Reap Spirits. You won’t use Dracarris or Scourge or Black hand for say, Chaos Birbs.
Ultimately, Zantai’s decision ofcourse. But I don’t feel like it would be bad for the game to have more options and build varieties.
I guess we differ in our opinions on that
And if it had pet bonuses, it won’t only be a “player weapon” .
I was thinking like how we have Mythical Manifestarius & Bysmiel’s Mindweaver for phys > elemental for example.
On a unrelated note, I still wish pets had conversion into Physical (as opposed to from Physical) and also options for pierce as well.
I just want more damage conversion options in general
.