Heya! So, I’ve been playing this Sorcerer a lot recently, it focuses on dealing retaliation damage mostly with Blackwater Cocktail (BWC) (GrimTools link - best iteration I’ve put together). There have been a lot of additions and changes in the game in relatively recent times that have helped bring this build up, and I’m thankful for that. I think it’s decently powerful and holds potential, but I believe a lot can be changed to improve it, and I don’t mean just straight-up buffs.
First I’ll provide some results:
- Mad Queen goes down in 10 seconds.
- Best time for Crucible 150-170 with 3 buffs and Vanguard banner was 7:40.
- SR 75-76 can be done consistently.
I’ll start with what I think is the biggest problem with the build, then give relevant item feedback and later go a bit into skills and devotions.
Mirror of Ereoctes (MoE) as a retalition skill is supposed to be a big offensive part of the build, with seemingly powerful modifiers on items, but it just isn’t. Instead it’s a very short-lived damage boost on a huge cooldown, used as an unimpressive nuke. This can surely be remedied, best by changing item modifiers. Since Avatar of Order has a disgusting number of modifiers (six!) on just one of its 3 skills, Let’s look at Turrion’s instead.
Mythical Turrion’s Reprisal
MoE’s duration is very short and ends up feeling irrelevant (similar to a modifier on Blast Shield or Arcane Will). So, this item could increase its duration by at least 3 seconds (I’ve seen @AdamNavel suggest this as well). Naturally, the damage absorption on the skill would have to go down with another modifier. This would work well, as a squishy caster might want 100% absorption, but for a naturally more tanky build like this, a lot of it ends up redundant. Reduced total damage modified could be added to prevent unwanted interactions with other items on non-retaliation builds. The lightning retalition on the skill is already underwhelming so I’m not sure about reducing that (maybe it even needs a buff?).
I think the goal is to make MoE more like a cooldown skill that feels good and needs some strategy/timing to use, like Ascension, Absolution or Overguard with a modifier.
And bonus points to Mirror would do wonders, since it’s really hard to get them, as Mirror wasn’t always a retalition skill.
But Turrion’s itself feels a bit overtuned at the moment, I’d say 16% RATA on BWC is too much.
Mythical Avatar of Order
A modifier that reduces the cooldown of MoE would be better, as you’re unlikely to have much CDR on the build.
Do both this and Turrion’s need to pump chaos reisistance? Poison would be nice instead.
Mythical Mask of Infernal Truth
This item I deem outdated at this point. I have nothing against multipurpose items (The Dawnshard gear is fantastic), but the non-retaliation support for Mortar Trap and Canister Bomb has probably lost its use. The reason is that now we have the Ulzuin’s and Pyran’s sets which outclass it, and even the Mythical Dread-Mask of Gurgoth was updated recently. So it’s perhaps due for a slight redesign, and I would make it more specialized towards retaliation. On this build, the current Canister Bomb modifier is really underwhelming, as a cooldown skill it’s weaker than BWC which is spammable. It just tries to make Sorcerer even more of a piano caster than it is, which it already does with the much nicer granted skill. I’d like to see the retalition modifier be on BWC instead, which pretty much every build already uses at least for utility.
Mythical Divinesteel Shoulderguard
Strong item, but the resistance choices for an elemental item are rather poor. Poison or aether instead of bleeding I suggest, or at least give the item some physical resistance.
Avenger
It doesn’t at all seem like it compensates for not having bonuses to any mastery. Notably, it doesn’t give attack/casting speed nor a % bonus to retaliation damage. Comparing it to Oathkeeper’s retaliation relics makes me sad. The skill is strong but goes overboard on the non-retal damage.
Ulzuin’s Pyroclasm
This relic is largely outclassed by Korvaak’s Deception and the recently updated Annihilation. It could be repurposed to fill a niche by being Demonlitionist’s dedicated retaliation relic. It’s already halfway there: give it % bonus to retal damage, RATA on the skill and make the skill proc on attack and not on crit.
Or make it focus on lightning damage instead since Demo doesn’t have that in a relic.
Mythical Runeplates of Ignaffar
Nice item, though the proc is a bit lacking. And the choice of resistance is not spectacular. Seen in this thread that it’s not popular with others either.
Mythical Sash of the Immortal Sage
It’s kind of too gimmicky/unfocused and can’t compete with Mythical Ulzuin’s Torment.
Now, a couple of skills I want to point out:
Reckless Power - The newly added stun retalition is really lackluster. Maybe that’s just on a retalition build? Regardless, it’s weird to have it alongside damage retalition, and I think the skill needs something else instead.
Vindictive Flame - I was happy to see the addition of retalition damage on it. This could actually give it new identity. Now, the skill has for a long time notoriously had damage on the proc that is not noteworthy most of the time (especially the Ulzuin’s Wrath modifier). Even with the buff on said modifier a few patches ago, it was really weak when I tried maxing it on a fire/lightning Elementalist and threw in a few support items.
Radical suggestion warning
So, why not give Ulzuin’s Wrath retaliation damage added to attack, and finally see use out of it? At the moment it’s not good even as a 1-pointer. It would really fit the theme of the skill (Vindictive has “retalition” right in the description), and the modifier even hits targets that are further away, the ranged monsters that don’t take normal retaliation damage. Some items are just begging to give RATA to Vindictive Flame (Gaze of Empyrion, Mythical Pagar’s Betrayal, Mythical Mask of Infernal Truth, Okaloth’s Visage - instead of the useless FS mod on this one). And some items already fit this concept very well (Mythical Seal of the Blazing Inferno, Colossal Fortress Mythical Ulzuin’s Torment).
And lastly I’d like to mention that I’ve used the Hyrian devotion a bunch, it’s pretty nice for this build, but ultimately I think it’s too expensive to take.
EDIT: tl;dr Retaliation BWC is overtuned, Mirror is a terrible and anti-synergistic retaliation skill, some elemental retaliation items are really subpar, so physical retaliation is king.
Thanks for at least glancing at this wall of text, and here are a couple more threads relevant to this topic:
