V1.1.9.2 Discussion

it doesn’t because of what Valinov mentioned.
though the proc and overall bad stats make it a rather terrible choice.

Avenger is lightning to physical tho, and that means it comes after elemental to pierce on bladetwister.

Pretty sure elemental conversions come before any single fire, cold and lightning conversions. Unless something changed recently.

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they don’t. in Avenger’s case, lightning -> phys conversion applies first.

1 Bladetwister, Avenger crusher and Brute force:



2 bladetwisters, Avenger crusher and Brute force:



Avenger crusher and Brute force:



Since Avenger crushers average roll for conversion is 100%, you would expect 0 pierce damage with the bladetwister ring(s) because you said lightning to physical conversion happens first.


Yup, i vividly remember now when i played Warder Avenger with Bladetwister and always wondering where the pierce damage was coming from.

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conversion on main hand comes before the ring slots, that’s how it works with trielemental vs single elemental conversions.

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Do you know the “order list”? Is it published somewhere?

Lol there’s now a item priority for elemental conversion? Because that’s what that conversion needed, to be even more confusing.

Zantai posted it somewhere




Familiar pic…


So, elemental conversion can still go before fire, cold and lightning, like Ulvar showed? Meaning item priority only matters to elemental conversion when multiple conflicting elemental conversions are in play, and also meaning elemental conversion is above any single element conversion in the conversion order.


Are you sure you want to turn V1.1.9.2 discussion into a Elemental conversion discussion?
There a million of special cases when 3-ele and single-ele conversion order swaps.

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my experience has always been like @Ulvar1 shows
unless the conversion is a transmuter, Bladetwisters come first, which is why they are poopoo annoying on phys builds :unamused:

would seem like that’s GT only, and ingame it’s working as “intended”/as @Valinov says :thinking:
wow, that opens up somethings now :exploding_head:

how is another 10 free RR bad for a phys build already using savagery?

I hope not, but at least in my mind, things are a bit murky still, so maybe I could try to present a couple representative examples that someone could clarify, and perhaps a mod could move this into its own topic at their discretion.

Example 1:
@Ulvar1’s grimtools example https://www.grimtools.com/calc/4ZDBDY12
We have

  • Starting with 105 flat lightning damage from Brute Force
  • 100% lightning->physical conversion in gear slot 1 (according to numbered chart)
  • 25% elemental->pierce conversion in slot 5
  • Grimtools displays non-zero (41) final pierce damage

Correct me if I’m wrong, but without making assumptions I see three possibilities:

  1. Grimtools implements conversion incorrectly; 100% lightning should apply first (either because of the numbered gear chart or because it should always apply first)
  2. Elemental conversion always comes before lightning, which is why we get non-zero pierce damage at the end.
  3. Total lightning conversion sums to 125% (with 25% coming from gear slot 5 via elemental conversion) and is scaled down to 100% so that lightning->pierce conversion becomes 20%.

Note: as far as I can tell, the grimtools numbers most closely match #3 since 20% of 105 flat pierce damage gives us 21, which is then multiplied by 1.946 (+73% pierce damage from ring and +21.6% pierce damage from cunning) to get about 41 pierce damage shown in grimtools under weapon damage. I don’t believe grimtools is implementing #2, since if it were, the final pierce damage should display as higher than it is, and of course grimtools can’t be doing #1, since final pierce damage is non-zero.

So the question is what’s supposed to happen here? Is grimtools wrong? If so, how?

I also found this statement

in the referenced topic, which got me thinking that maybe I should pose an example to clarify possible interpretations of this as well, so here it is:

Example 2 (pure hypothetical— numbers may not correspond to real gear):

  • Start with 100 lighting damage
  • Slot 1: 50% elemental->aether
  • Slot 2: 25% lightning->vitality
  • Slot 3 25% elemental->chaos
  • Slot 4 50% elemental->aether

Final damage breakdown should be…? A step-by-step calculation if possible would be nice even though it might seem obvious to you.

That also seem to contradict the conversion order as grey-maybe wrote about.

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hand slot before rings, no?, or did i misread Grey’s pic?

Hand slot? I though you did my GT links in game.

ye i’m on avenger warder, and the sheet there says 0 pierce with 1 or 2 twisters, and 100% phys dmg
which makes sense if mono ele comes before tri ele or when the handslot is before rings

so what hand slot are you talking about?